Treating methamphetamine-induced anxiety with valproic acid

[/navarone/]

^^And you're a too-ool!



So someone posted an unnecessarily inflammatory comment, and I responded accordingly? This is personal? Since you can't point to anything 'personal' in my posts in specific, I'm guessing you have nothing other than your moronic little opinion for validation. Thank you for your constructive post.



No. Up until the last line, the content was pretty vapid, redundant, and at one point, just offensive.



What's that about Murphy's Bluelight level? It's over 9000? Lawlzees, it's not like this is some formal dialectic debate in which two argumentative connoiseurs artfully duke it out. This is just a bland disagreement due largely to what should have been a small issue of semantic clarity, one with which I'm becoming increasingly bored.



I strongly suggest you go fuck yourself.

While your at it, kindly take your crass, petulant attitude and shove it back up the fetid ass from which it came.

In rest my case.

It is not me who is going to inflict you the consequences for throwing the rock of insolence and derision towards another respected forum member out of arrogance and a overly touchy personality.
I contributed as much as I could to help answer the OP's question with all the diplomacy I could offer (and expected from the forum as a member) so I'm simply content with that.
Your behavioural issues are not in any immaginable way MY issues.
Have a good day 'sir'.

Over and out.

 

[MurphyClox]

Enough!

Thanks for the advocacy, /navarone/, this really honours me. But please, it's not necessary to join this pointless dispute! As one of the last entries has shown, it will only draw anger on you. This will be my last post, promised!


I'd like to adress Vanboy5 in short: It seems like P A and you have become new best friends. Congratulations! Honni soit qui mal y pense. I can assure you that my last post was not "histrionic" but the notion that I felt somehow personally offended was rather based on a slightly longer observation than your short membership in this forum could offer. Examples can be found here, here, here, plus all the stuff in this epic thread. Well, looking at his posts more carefully, it seems that I could have been indeed wrong; P A seems to exhibit in general a tone, which is regarded as lightly offensive.

This discussion has gone totally out of control.
My original point was - and that's actually the main base of my whole "harm reduction"-thinking - that it's
better to warn once too often than not often enough
(and it's a pity that I obviously could not make myself sufficiently clear). If you ever want to remember something from Murphy, then please let it be that rule. I really did not expect though that this point of view could deteriorate into insults of the worst kind.

Since I seem to disagree sometimes with certain opinions, I put up in the past with being accused as "elitist", "arrogant", "educative" and (IIRC) "pejorative". I'm really fed up with this kind of ignorance. I'm fed up with molesting the shit out of my dictionary only to get misunderstood again. Do I make myself really so unintelligible? I mean: "Semantic clarity"??? Are you fucking kiddin' me? That's what this nonsense is about?
No need to answer any of the above statements unless you have fun reading your own rantings over and over again, 'cause I'm afraid that I won't read the response anyway.





My patience with imbecile and ignorant backseat drivers like P A has gone its course. I came to the conclusion that my rare sparetime needs a more appropriate focus than trying to persuade people of something they apparently don't want to be persuaded of. I'm still having a hard time to grasp, why so, maybe it's my narrow-minded perspective... As i wrote above: ENOUGH!

Goodbye folks! It was a joy to be part of this marvellous forum for more than two and a half years. The positive responses of many Bluelighters fueled my motivation to go on and on, and I'm glad that I could actually help out on some occasions. Take care of you!


Murphy Clox, over and out.




Edit: I decided that it would be highly disrespectful to the Bluelighters who gave me A LOT, to leave without some appropriate final words. Hence, this is only my second-last post. Nobody in this forum shall ever be bothered again by me after that thread.

 

[P A]

My patience with imbecile and ignorant backseat drivers like P A

ignorant backseat drivers like P A

backseat drivers

lolwut

Goodbye folks!

Good riddance.

Your behavioural issues are not in any immaginable way MY issues.

Not only do you not have the slightest idea how I behave, seeing as how this is the fucking internet, but I'm honestly puzzled by your similarly ignorant lack of social awareness - you chide me like a puling brat when I criticize your strident friend, then swiftly wax butthurt when, again, I respond accordingly?

Have a good day 'sir'.

Whatever

 

[/navarone/]

Nuke?
Its all up to you.

 

[vanboy5]

I apologise if I've offended anybody, and for egging on such a heartbreaking dispute. Can we please shift the subject back to its original intent (treating amphetamine-induced anxiety with valproic acid)?

I hear both sides of the argument and yes P A is a good friend to whom I am loyal but I'm asking everyone to stop cursing/arguing over something which doesn't really pertain to bluelight nor my thread. I seek ideas, thoughts, and opinions - all of which I've duly received and am truly grateful.

I hope any further discourse/side-taking ends here. Admittedly, I am very new to Bluelight and I ask everyone who has been affected negatively in any way to stop warring and arguing. Let's stay positive. Please forgive me if I have wronged any of you in any way. I think I was brusque and engaged in excitement over something that unnecessarily grew to a fight on my own thread.

Back to something we all seem to commonly engage in: a drug discussion!

Has anyone ever heard of pregabalin? I have been switching between the two: benzo & valproic acid. In terms of benzo, I mean 0.5mg alprazolam/5mg bromazepam/10mg diazepam (I don't personally find a huge difference amongst the three in terms of using them as anxiolytics) PRN (not exceeding 3 doses within 24 hours). Valproic acid I would do 300mg morning/evening and cut out the benzo. I hope to not have to go through benzo withdrawal after while kicking a stimulant at the same time.

Cheers,
Van

 

[dread]

Nooooo murphy

first fnb and now you... my world is falling apart.

 

[pofacedhoe]

P A

your acting like a child and really is there any need for it?

grow up and stop being so weak in yourself. when people get really upset and enraged it takes away validity from any point they are making so think before you type. being massively offended is a choice and you can make a better one.

 

[melange]

he is very antagonizing

 

[P A]

when people get really upset and enraged it takes away validity from any point they are making

No one's enraged. Annoyed, maybe. And as any mature person should be fully aware, any point, no matter how it's made, should be considered on its own merit, not by the tone in which it was presented. Every other word in my post could have been 'fuckingfuckingfucking,' but would say nothing about any point contained therein.

being massively offended is a choice

...unbelievable. Where is all this bilge coming from? A vacuous self-help book? People become offended for reasons. Whether or not the those impetuses (impeti?) are valid is always up for discussion, but to pompously finger-wag and decry offense as reducible to personal choice constitutes social inanity at its worst. I'm done with this intarwebz argument, as Murphy just exited stage left and apparently left you behind to make dull quips about my maturity. Who cares?

Nuke?
Its all up to you.

Ohgawd. Now he's trying to summon the banhammer out of butthurt. Who are you, honestly?

Has anyone ever heard of pregabalin?

While Lyrica may be a decent anxiolytic, I would recommend trying an alternate modality further distal from the GABA-A system, so as to minimize further cross-tolerance between GABAergics. Baclofen or phenibut would be good places to start. Their highly selective GABA-B agonism could circumvent any of these issues whilst providing some comfortable muscle relaxation. Are you saying you're planning to triple-cycle, e.g. benzos--->VLP--->pregabalin/baclofen?

 

[pofacedhoe]

No one's enraged. Annoyed, maybe. And as any mature person should be fully aware, any point, no matter how it's made, should be considered on its own merit, not by the tone in which it was presented. Every other word in my post could have been 'fuckingfuckingfucking,' but would say nothing about any point contained therein.



...unbelievable. Where is all this bilge coming from? A vacuous self-help book? People become offended for reasons. Whether or not the those impetuses (impeti?) are valid is always up for discussion, but to pompously finger-wag and decry offense as reducible to personal choice constitutes social inanity at its worst. I'm done with this intarwebz argument, as Murphy just exited stage left and apparently left you behind to make dull quips about my maturity. Who cares?



Ohgawd. Now he's trying to summon the banhammer out of butthurt. Who are you, honestly?

does it matter who i am?

i care

if you cant cope with things maybe you should talk to someone, it could help you deal with your issues.

were only here to help:D

 

[P A]

does it matter who i am?

Lol, wasn't asking you mang. I was responding rhetorically to /navarone/ in that bit. Try to keep up.

if you cant cope with things maybe you should talk to someone, it could help you deal with your issues.

Your apparent insistence upon furthering this thread's already obnoxious level of inanity is getting tedious. But all the same, thanks so much for the armchair intarwebz psychoanalysis, doc.

 

[Hammilton]

Man, reading this makes it hard for me to believe that I didn't write half of that myself. it sounds so familiar!

Not one of these compounds has any known enzymatic/hepatic/renal, CNS, or sympathetic ADVERSE interactions, and are more likely to be benign when mixed appropriately than not

PA wrote that statement, and I can't believe that no one has pointed it out for the nonsense it is. Valproate has fairly moderate to severe potential to cause liver damage when it's not dosed properly, and without even a blood test, it's impossible to know what your levels are at. Not as dangerous as lithium, but it's up there, for sure.

memantine seems to have the potential to cause liver damage, but it seems fairly unlikely. methamphetamine can also cause this damage, but seems to be more prone than memantine, but much, much less than valproate which practically assured if levels aren't taken carefully.

He also says that valproate works in a manner similar to benzos in one of the lines. That's news to... everyone.

 

[nik12937]

Lol, wasn't asking you mang. I was responding rhetorically to /navarone/ in that bit. Try to keep up.



Your apparent insistence upon furthering this thread's already obnoxious level of inanity is getting tedious. But all the same, thanks so much for the armchair intarwebz psychoanalysis, doc.

I have no place in this thread, yet my hate for you is strong enough to make me say, I hate you sir.

 

[vanboy5]

PA wrote that statement, and I can't believe that no one has pointed it out for the nonsense it is. Valproate has fairly moderate to severe potential to cause liver damage when it's not dosed properly, and without even a blood test, it's impossible to know what your levels are at. Not as dangerous as lithium, but it's up there, for sure.

Yes I see that less than 50% of VLP is metabolised by the liver, however, with all due respect do you have any research to back that up?

memantine seems to have the potential to cause liver damage, but it seems fairly unlikely. methamphetamine can also cause this damage, but seems to be more prone than memantine, but much, much less than valproate which practically assured if levels aren't taken carefully.

So yes, anything metabolised by the liver could cause hepatotxicity at high enough doses. VLP could be toxic to the liver as with any other drug hepatically metabolised... is that your point?

He also says that valproate works in a manner similar to benzos in one of the lines. That's news to... everyone.

Does he? where?

 

[vanboy5]

I have no place in this thread, yet my hate for you is strong enough to make me say, I hate you sir.

There is no place for hate in this thread. Please.

 

[vanboy5]

While Lyrica may be a decent anxiolytic, I would recommend trying an alternate modality further distal from the GABA-A system, so as to minimize further cross-tolerance between GABAergics. Baclofen or phenibut would be good places to start. Their highly selective GABA-B agonism could circumvent any of these issues whilst providing some comfortable muscle relaxation. Are you saying you're planning to triple-cycle, e.g. benzos--->VLP--->pregabalin/baclofen?

Nope... just perhaps between benzos and VLP OR benzos and pregabalin/baclofen.

 

[vanboy5]

PA wrote that statement, and I can't believe that no one has pointed it out for the nonsense it is. Valproate has fairly moderate to severe potential to cause liver damage when it's not dosed properly, and without even a blood test, it's impossible to know what your levels are at. Not as dangerous as lithium, but it's up there, for sure.

If you read what P A wrote, he was talking about interactions, as opposed to valproate's toxicity when used monotherapeutically. Find out more about valproate's toxicity here: http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/819315-overview

It's an interesting read actually...

 

[P A]

Much of this has already been fleshed out by Van, but nevertheless:

He also says that valproate works in a manner similar to benzos in one of the lines

Orly? Care to point out where? Maybe you're referring to the part in which I referred to valproate's anxiolytic potency being largely mediated by increased postsynaptic activation of the GABA-A receptors due to elevated extracellular concentrations produced by the drug's GABA-T inhibition? I only mentioned this mechanism because it could theoretically pose an issue of cross-tolerance with the benzos, which I similarly pointed out. Problem?

memantine seems to have the potential to cause liver damage, but it seems fairly unlikely. methamphetamine can also cause this damage, but seems to be more prone than memantine, but much, much less than valproate which practically assured if levels aren't taken carefully.

Valproate has fairly moderate to severe potential to cause liver damage when it's not dosed properly,

when it's not dosed properly

not dosed properly

As repeatedly stressed throughout the thread, I've consistently and emphatically insisted upon conservative, cycled use, in order to minimize the already minor risk of complication. Also, are you implying that the liver toxicity of memantine and Desoxyn are at all clinically relevant? Any documentation (even a handful of case reports might suffice)?

I hate you sir

 

[seep]

thread is shite on either side

quite right

 

[P A]