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Transhumanism- Can U Be God?

^^^^^
Im not always going to be around to explain things to you. You're going to have to learn to think more abstractly.
Maybe you need to rewatch video.

It's killing darwinism as we know it--Neo Darwinism. And I would argue even darwinism period.
To blend man/ machine and evolve (good luck with that btw), it would be very helpful to know what causes man to change, and more inmoprtantly what are his LIMITATIONS.

Ironically, transhumanism in respect to eugenitics, would have pleased Darwin--- but its advacements in respect to evolution kinda depend that he was wrong about random mutations being driving force behind species change.
Ever read the full title of his book?
"The origion of species by means of natural selection, OR the preservation of favoured races in th struggle for life."
He and Hiter would have had nice conversations over tea I would imagine.
Darwin claimed ultimately gradual random mutations and natural selection is responsible for the diversity of life we see today.
Dr. Noble ( try arguing against his credentials) very well argues the processes arent truly random.( which i agree with)
Moreover, they cant be truly random, and randomness cannot explain species change or proteins and the genome. The gene is not the vehicle. DNA is not alive.
Like he said, you remove it from a cell and put it in a petri dish; and it will do nothing.
The cell continues to function in respect to phisiology, but it is screwed when it needs to make new parts.
We can TEST this---- This is REAL science folks.
He also argues against neo-darwinism in other ways.
NOW you may still believe tiny invisible random mutations lead to formation of new species with complex new parts--- as a PSEDOSCIENCE
ITS OK to believe and have hopes for things.

Kinda like I believe Noble was right when he said, if you truly believe process is random,
he and phisology have nothing more to say.

But if you believe a designer alllowed for diversity within the species he made it fits wonderfully.
"According to their kind"
---God
BUT you "kinda" need the "kind" first.
Dont go pulling the cart before the horse.
To use your brain to select things,.
you "kinda" need a brain first.
Ps. Saying anything fails without a word to back it up,
is lazy,
and for lack of any better word----
fails
An ad homeniem rebuttal
or even a "lm right cause I say so" rebuttal
doesnt really refute my premise
 
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It's killing darwinism as we know it--Neo Darwinism. And I would argue even darwinism period.

Yeah, but is it really?

To blend man/ machine and evolve (good luck with that btw), it would be very helpful to know what causes man to change, and more inmoprtantly what are his LIMITATIONS.

Selective pressure causes man (and all life) to 'change'. Limitations are the physical constraints of earth.

Methmaniac said:
"The origion of species by means of natural selection, OR the preservation of favoured races in th struggle for life."
He and Hiter would have had nice conversations over tea I would imagine.

Conflating Darwin with Hitler based on a misreading of his book title doesn't demonstrate anything. Perhaps a 'favoured race' is simply one with attributes that make it more likely to survive. Favored by the environment and natural selection.

Darwin claimed ultimately gradual random mutations and natural selection is responsible for the diversity of life we see today.
Dr. Noble ( try arguing against his credentials) very well argues the processes arent truly random.( which i agree with)
Moreover, they cant be random, and randomness cannot explain species change or proteins and the genome. The gene is not the vehicle. DNA is not alive.

Nor is a virus, in the typical sense of the word. And yet, this does not ultimately change anything about the reality of viruses.

Like he said, you remove it from a cell and put it in a petri dish; and it will do nothing.

Same with a virus, and yet- we can still see a virus change spontaneously when it has infected a hosts cell.


NOW you may still believe tiny invisible random mutations lead to formation of new species with complex new parts--- as a PSEDOSCIENCE
ITS OK to believe and have hopes for things.


Your patronising tone in the face of incredible opposition is strange to me. You must be fundamentally misunderstanding the meaning of specific words and concepts. You are pushing a completely non-scientific perspective, and claiming it actually is scientific. Pseudo-science is the drawing of scientitic and objective conclusions using misattribution and errant cause-and-effect deductions. It is manipulating evidence to make it fit a particular view, as opposed to allowing the evidence to inform that view. The paucity of evidence that you can present would make drawing conclusions really difficult, but you continue to do so. This does not mean you are privy to secret truth's, but that you are manipulating the OVERT truth to fit your agenda and claiming truth where there are none. That is EXACTLY what pseudo-science is.

But if you believe a designer alllowed for diversity within the species he made it fits wonderfully.
"According to their kind"
---God
BUT you "kinda" need the "kind" first.

How does the idea of a creator fit wonderfully? In truth, it doesn't fit at all, given the weight of scientific evidence against it. The existence of a creator who actively created all life on earth is actually very difficult to fit into what we also know about the universe. You must explain to me how this works...

or even a "lm right cause I say so" rebuttal
doesnt really refute my premise

Given the incredible weight of evidence which belies your supposition, I feel under no obligation to claim to be right. You are simply incorrect in mistaking a natural physical process for something magical, particularly when the magic has been adequately explained. There is no room for the fairytale, no matter how much propaganda you espouse.

Before you go any further, if you want to have a discussion, please be sure to try and address what I have written.
 
You never answered my questions.
I will/can answer yours after mine.
Your fairy tale and "magic" of talking parrots, talking people, barking dogs etc arising absolutley without any design to aid it, is much much more facinating to me.

Are or are not new species caused by complete random mutations that are selected by natural selection?
They either are or are not..
As far as viruses,
Does a virus need DNA or RNA to replicate?
WHAT came first DNA/RNA or virus need for it.
I won't even go into fact you need a host cell for viruses to replicate.
Do you disagree with this?
Does a cell just spontaneously form itself?
IM not sure you appreciate the predicament you're in.
Cell or virus ? What will it be?



You're trying to go from the top down to explain how life arose from bottom up.
Top down supports my theory remember?

NOT to mention assuming non living mechanisms for life (and intelligent life to boot) can just come together and spark everything WITH absoultely ZERo proof. WHAT is your evidence for this?
Can I test it or observe it?
Sounds like "magic"
 
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So this is just a continuation of your evolution thread. This is a pointless debate as you are unwilling to accept reality. Given my own proviso for continuing the discussion I thought we were having, seeya. :)
 
^^^
Hey,
Im not looking for another long ass thread on evolution.
This thread was and is about transhumanism.
Evolution does happen to be relevant tho.

Honestly and frankly (not attacking)
I understand why you didnt answer questions
you have no idea which one came first.
"Science" hasn't told you the answer yet.
But that doesnt stop you from proclaiming Im
"Not seeing the light" of an unlit candle.

Intelligently explain to me what came first---
a cell to allow the replication of virus or
the viruses need for cell.
( im giving you formation of DNA/RNA as a head start)
Or will it be the usual copout of they popped on the scence at exactly the same time?
Once you can inteligently explain how this happened (and this is just one of at least thousands of examples of two things being needed at once)
you may then call me unintelligent/unenlightened/ " unwilling to see reality".
I will at least know what "reality"
I aint seeing.
No, I dont see the the emporer's new clothes.

Now back to transhumanism.....
Have we evolved to point where we no longer need this bag of bones?
Have we "evolved" to point where it's time to leave it behind and download our brain to a computer/hard drive.
Is our quest for infinite knowledge ready for its next step---?
 
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methmaniac said:
you have no idea which one came first.

Correct. But neither do you. In fact, I'm not sure that anybody can know these answers with complete assurance. That, however, is simply a fact relating to our existence in an entropic universe; the past does not remain static, matter changes constantly and any remnants of the past are often and obscure. It doesn't not speak of a supernatural mystery at all. Statistically, it shouldn't be surprising that complex life has arisen in our universe given the vastness of the universe. Invoking the further complexity of a supernatural, creative, all-aware deity creates only further questions of origin and provides no answers.

It is my opinion that it was humans doing the creating, by invented god to explain the functions of the natural world that appeared to be mysterious and meaningful. Thus many cultures have personified thunder and lightning, but we know that this is electrical phenomena caused by different temperature's colliding. We have evidence that says these things, we can measure the energy output of lightning, it can be verified and re-created, so for someone to say that it really is Zeus lighting a campfire, there is no point in truly responding. They have taken a leap of faith beyond reason.

Meth said:
"Science" hasn't told you the answer yet.

A fairytale contains symbolism that is mute, but just requires the observer to breathe life into it. God has told many people many different answers to the mystery of life, and they are all right! :D
 
Yes, you are correct.
You have no idea.

When you get an idea come on back.
And we can discuss it or the other thousands of symbiotic relationships that exist.
And you can explain how you build a motor with no design, not how you take one apart.

AND Im not asking you to explain the past.
Just an idea on how a virus replicates without a cell?
You can use one we have today, they're still around ya know. Some of them refused to evolve.
You dont have to accept that God made universe and life, but it is however an answer.
I suppose "randomness/chaos" is an answer too.
Its just randomness has limitations,
God doesnt.

Ps
GOD uses lightning to put nitrogen back in soil.
It aids in fertilization.
Look it up....
:)
 
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If you guys want to continue the OP's topic, feel free to focus entirely on that (and 'maniac: please post some sort of summary of or commentary on the linked material...focusing on material available only by video-viewing tends to discourage participation). If you want to talk about evolution instead, I'd suggest running a search for prior threads.

ebola
 
^^^^
duly noted.
srry, it would take me a small essay to condence
all this
Maybe just jump to about last 20-30 minutss of first link to get gist.
Its a bit disturbing to me some scientists view on God.
Reminds me of a story about some people trying to build a tower to heaven and their egos.
I'm told the "miracles" in thd last days would decieve the elect if possible,
I honestly think something along the lines of aliens or promise of living forever and becoming God via technology could be part of hoax.
Even if you get a completely different take out of it,
its worth checking out when you got a chance imo.
 
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^^^^
duly noted.
srry, it would take me a small essay to condence
all this
Maybe just jump to about last 20-30 minutss of first link to get gist.
Its a bit disturbing to me some scientists view on God.
Reminds me of a story about some people trying to build a tower to heaven and their egos.
I'm told the "miracles" in thd last days would decieve the elect if possible,
I honestly think something along the lines of aliens or promise of living forever and becoming God via technology could be part of hoax.
Even if you get a completely different take out of it,
its worth checking out when you got a chance imo.

great summary
 
^^^
All apologies,
Thread isnt three minute popcorn.....
.....*" now, with even MORE nacho cheese*"

You'e going to have to abstract you're own idea.
Might not be you're ideal thread.

I guess you could just do what "random" people do instead. Whatever that is they do.
I dont know cant "predict" it.
Maybe it would be something like "randomly" playing in a razor blade factory.
Who knows? Not me.
 
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