Tramadol HCL Vs. Tramadol Base

[Venrak]

I am wondering if there is much difference, if any, between tramadol base and tramadol hcl in terms of dosage, ROA, effect etc.

 

[pasha]

Adding hyrdrochloric acid is just a way to make drugs water soluble. The only difference for tramadol hydrochloride would be the ROA in that it could be administered intravenously which in the many times I've done it, has proven to be a complete waste of time, since it requires extensive demethylation in the liver before being converted into an opioid with some analgesic benefit.

This why most conventional medical methods of administration are identical with tramadol (rectal, IV, oral).

 

[Venrak]

Yeah. I got that. I was just wondering about the possibility of needing a lower dose with the base, possible metaboization differences and such so I can make a choice between the base or the hcl.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

AFAIK equivalent quantities are generally slightly lower with bases than hydrochlorides, but I'm not certain if that actually means you would get equivalent effects with a lower weight of the base. There has to be a good reason pharmaceutical opioid tablets are normally the hydrochloride and not the base form. Is it just that the base form is less stable and therefore degrades more easily? Tramadol pills are always hydrochloride aren't they? I've never heard of tramadol base outside of occasionally being sold as a research chemical. I know that bases can generally be vaporized as they have a higher burning point whereas hydrochlorides burn before they vaporize, and that hydrochlorides are water soluble (note: I am not saying that vaporizing or injecting would be safe ROAs for tramadol). I wonder if it changes the absorption when taken orally? Hopefully someone with more chemistry knowledge than I have, like sekio, can better answer your questions. Or if there is anyone with experience using base tramadol. I'm glad you are trying to research the differences between the forms before using it.

 

[Venrak]

Yes, AFAIK there are only hydrochloride salt tramadol pills, but I am to be buying it as a research chemical.

Any more data will be greatly appreciated.

 

[Jackeh]

Yeah. I got that. I was just wondering about the possibility of needing a lower dose with the base, possible metaboization differences and such so I can make a choice between the base or the hcl.

If your ROA is oral, you don't need to worry about differences in metabolism as the freebase will be converted to salt in your stomach. What you will need to worry about is dosage.

Tramadol freebase has a formula mass of ~264 whereas Tramadol HCl has a formula mass of ~300.5.

If you want to work out the mass of tramadol in the salt, just multiply the salt's mass by (264/300.5). Not 100% sure, but I think that's how it works. So 1 gram of Tramadol HCl should be ~879mg of Tramadol freebase.

EDIT: I think the only other difference is absorbtion. Freebase isn't water soluble but the salt is. If you ingest the freebase then you may have to wait slightly longer for effects while you wait for your stomach acid to convert it to the water soluble salt.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

^Makes sense to me.

Yes, AFAIK there are only hydrochloride salt tramadol pills, but I am to be buying it as a research chemical.

Yeah, I just meant surely there is a good reason that as a pharmaceutical meant for ingestion it's always the hydrochloride. It might just be because because the hcl is more stable than the base. So I guess I'd wonder if the base could be relied upon for potency etc.

According to Wikipedia, tramadol has 4 different configurational forms: a (1R,2R)-isomer; (1S,2S)-isomer; (1R,2S)-isomer; and (1S,2R)-isomer. The drug tramadol hydrocholoride is a racemate of the hydrochlorides of the (1R,2R)-(+)- and the (1S,2S)-(–)-enantiomers. Tramadol is used as a racemate, despite known different physiological effects of the (1R,2R)- and (1S,2S)-isomers, because the racemate showed higher analgesic activity. So I guess I would wonder if the base is a mixture of the 4 different isomers as opposed to just the 2 found in the hydrochloride? My assumption is that the base is the same as the hydrochloride in that regard, but I don't know that much about chemistry unfortunately.

Personally unless I was planning on vaporizing it I'd just go with the tried and true hcl, although I am not aware of any dangers or side effects exclusive to the base form. But I've never met or read about anyone using the base form.

 

[Venrak]

I am leaning towards just getting the HCL, but I also am tempted to get a gram of base along with it and to write some TRs.

 

[tentram]

^they're both likely to produce the same results though, right? the only difference will be in dosing and absorption rates i imagine, gathering from the talk here.

still, i'd be interested in reading the TR's and intrigued if there were a difference in each effects'.

 

[muie]

I am familiar with the vendor in question and too have wondered about this though never bought the base. The base is priced higher than the salt so there should be a reason why. I think it has to do with a slightly higher concentration of tramadol salt as suggested in here or something to do with the isomers.

Why would anyone vaporize tramadol since you need it in your liver to be converted? Or why even IV tramadol for the same reason being that your liver needs to convert it?

Plus if its freebase why vape it, you could smoke it like crack!

Any TP would be highly appreciated!

 

[Venrak]

^ I never went for it, but might soon.

I liked the HCl, so I may just get some of that and little bit of the base. Worse thing that can happen is that it's more or less the same, which I highly suspect.

I don't think I'll vapourize it.

Well...maybe

 

[Psychedelic Jay]

Vaporizing it will indeed be easier to hit “that” limit...

Seizing is expected as with oral, just a lot faster setting in...