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tramadol as an anti-deppressant?

morphiquet said:
@jamshyd: well, your definition of withdrawal might be another one than mine. but i insist on the fact, that tramadol-withdrawal does not produce any real existing symptoms, just like caffeine-withdrawal doesn't.
of course, if you stop your daily tramadol (or coffee) consumption, you are going to be in a bad mood, unmotivated for most things, quickly upset and sometimes even aggressive. but that's not what i would call a "withdrawal" in its usually accepted meaning.
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I'm definitely not imagining the migraine-like headaches and horrendous loss in motoric abilities I get when off coffee for more than a day.
 
Tramadol w/d is not in the imagination, good lord. I've been through Tramadol w/d a few times and it's complete hell. Every w/d symptom you get from regular opiate withdrawal you also have with Tramadol. You feel ok the first day, day and a half and than it hits you and OMG!!! Thank god it's easy to get so usually i only had to suffer a few days.

But now i only use it as a back up and for w/d. But, i still enjoy the same dose as i did when i only used Tramadol. At first my tolerance did go up but after a while the same dose worked and still works and it's been two years I've been taking the same dose. I never need to increase but i take more than the average dose or person. And yes I'm aware of the seizure threshold issue. I've never had a seizure. And I'm not saying i won't ever have a seizure, you never know.

But Tramadol w/d is NOT IN THE IMAGINATION, that is ridiculous. Just because you didn't experience it doesn't mean it doesn't exist and it doesn't happen, everyone is different.

RPG
 
morphiquet said:
i said ACTIVITY, not AFFINITY.
that means, assuming that morphine would activate the receptor to about 100% (meant as a reference value), then o-desmethyltramadol and buprenorphine would do the same in the range of 20%. these values mean maximum stimulation, that's also the reason why buprenorphine has a ceiling effect at higher dosages, when all receptors are saturated but all do only 20% of what they actually were capable of doing.

@jamshyd: well, your definition of withdrawal might be another one than mine. but i insist on the fact, that tramadol-withdrawal does not produce any real existing symptoms, just like caffeine-withdrawal doesn't.
of course, if you stop your daily tramadol (or coffee) consumption, you are going to be in a bad mood, unmotivated for most things, quickly upset and sometimes even aggressive. but that's not what i would call a "withdrawal" in its usually accepted meaning.

for further reading regarding the fact that even the withdrawals of harder opiates are in their most extent not much more than conditioning, i.e. imagination (or in a larger sense, maybe mass psychology), i suggest this:

amitai et al.
discrete cues paired with naloxone-precipitated withdrawal from acute morphine dependence elicit conditoned withdrawal responses.
behav. pharmacol., 2000, may p. 213-222

this article basically reports about inducing an opiate "withdrawal" out of pure imagination. maybe you find more such studies, i'd be glad if you'd post them :)

puuuuuh, you drove me to writing a whole novel with your critizism 8)
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I want whatever you're smoking.

My "definition" of withdrawal is the medical one. Feel free to make your own, but please don't shit it all over this forum.

This is not the first time I tell you to stop spreading misinformation, Morphiquet. This is a harm reduction site, and your posts are simply unacceptable in this context.
 
Jamshyd said:
My "definition" of withdrawal is the medical one. Feel free to make your own, but please don't shit it all over this forum.

This is not the first time I tell you to stop spreading misinformation, Morphiquet. This is a harm reduction site, and your posts are simply unacceptable in this context.
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Ummm...Murphy pondering...
substance withdrawal a substance-specific mental disorder that follows the cessation of use or reduction in intake of a psychoactive substance that had been regularly used to induce a state of intoxication
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from: http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/withdrawal

I fear it was clearly proven that tramadol DOES provoke withdrawal symptoms in accordanced with the above definition. Numerous (anecdotal) case reports support this.
Like here: http://www.erowid.org/experiences/subs/exp_Pharms_Tramadol.shtml

Of course, such symptoms show up to a different extend within different individuals, as it is normal with actions of pharmaceutical agents, in particular the ones with a psychoactive component.
The plain existence of tramadol-induced withdrawal can't be seriously part of a discussion.

About the "activity vs. affinity"-part I agree. I think such ligands are called "partial agonists". And yep, too, morphine is of course the usual measuring scale here.

Peace! Murphy
 
Stopping tramadol after a prolonged period of use can certainly make someone ill. As with anything else, the severity is probably dose dependant, but in this case, is limited by the ceiling dosage. While I am sure there are people who don't find it "that bad" (especially if they have experienced WD's from more powerful opioids), to say there is no withdrawal is untrue.

Interesting fact: The tramadol ampules leave a disgusting taste in your mouth when IVed (this thread is already derailed...)
 
oh my goodness. i'm in the best mood ever on ultram. but when i would take it for a week or so and stop, i'd have horrible nightmares, and actually be dpressed for a couple of days. it was def. addicting for me. but i'm not gonna lie, i'll take it again. :)
 
I hope to try antidepressant buprenorphine, with my current memantine and dextroamphetamine.
 
jamshyd, i think you just discredit yourself by not reading posts exactly and generally being that aggressive. and btw:

jamshyd wrote:
Feel free to make your own, but please don't shit it all over this forum.
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i'll shit my opinion on whereever i want in this forum, but in order to avoid any more excitement, this will be my last post in this thread. :)
 
morphiquet said:
for further reading regarding the fact that even the withdrawals of harder opiates are in their most extent not much more than conditioning, i.e. imagination (or in a larger sense, maybe mass psychology), i suggest this:
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You call this a "fact"? Go visit your local psychiatry with a withdrawal-section attached and watch the guys on WD from prolonged ingestion of a highly-potent opioid and then tell me that's "not much more than...imagination". Although I have to admit that the introduction of buprenorphine a few years ago made things way easier. As an alternative you could start a few months binge on diamorphine, oxycodone or hydromorphone und one doesn't have to be a fortune-teller to predict that when you go out of dope, suddenly a thread on a random-drug-board will appear started by a person asking how to soften the withdrawal-syndrome. ;)
negrogesic said:
Interesting fact: The tramadol ampules leave a disgusting taste in your mouth when IVed (this thread is already derailed...)
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I assume this could be in fact caused by conditioning. Intravenous consumption of many substances leaves a taste in your mouth. In case of drugs I like I experience the taste as very pleasant, in case of others (i.e. tramadol) just thinking about it can be disgusting.=D
 
Tramadol has worked well for me as an antidepressant and i also have RSI in my shoulders, tramadol is the only thing that has helped ease that pain. On the side of caution, my partner had 250mg of tramadol and had a seizure which resulted in him fracturing is spine... So be careful...
 
morphiquet said:
i'll shit my opinion on whereever i want in this forum, but in order to avoid any more excitement, this will be my last post in this thread. :)
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No you won't. You either post by the rules or get banned.
 
wittle1010 said:
oh my goodness. i'm in the best mood ever on ultram. but when i would take it for a week or so and stop, i'd have horrible nightmares, and actually be dpressed for a couple of days. it was def. addicting for me. but i'm not gonna lie, i'll take it again. :)
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sister you speak the truth
 
for those of you who have used tramadol regularly as an anti-depressant:
did you use anything else in conjunction?
if so, how did it impact it / what were the exact effects?
someone mentioned tianeptine in the "design your own" thread, and i was considering trying that.
any suggestions?
 
IIRC, production has ceased for both amineptine and tianeptine, no?

I've had both of them, and neither was great. I wanted to see how MDMA + an "SSRE" would work, but never did.
 
Ham-milton said:
IIRC, production has ceased for both amineptine and tianeptine, no?
I've had both of them, and neither was great. I wanted to see how MDMA + an "SSRE" would work, but never did.
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Stablon (tianeptine) is still available it seems. Did you use either of them with opiates? What about modafinil + tramadol?
 
^bummer.

anyone have a winning combo?
i'm looking for mood improvement and motivation primarily.

so far the tramadol alone @ 100mg/day is doing wonders.
 
colors said:
^bummer.

anyone have a winning combo?
i'm looking for mood improvement and motivation primarily.

so far the tramadol alone @ 100mg/day is doing wonders.
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I've been doing 50mg/day and my mood is awesome. I did 100mg/day when I had a kidney infection to get rid of pain and my mood was awesome with no pain! lol

I decreased it to 50mg telling myself it was better. It gets me through my crappy work days that seem to be getting worse by the week. My off-days are the weekends.
 
can you believe this??? someone named colors private messaged me a question about tramadol as an antidepressant, and i cant send a message back to him or her because it says i cant PM a staff until i have "bluelighter status"

because of this i have to embarrass myself and post my reply publically!

colors said:
when using tramadol as an andidepressant, what else works well in combination with it? can you describe how the interactions?
thx
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all SSRIs are incompatible with Tramadol. All antidepressants are incompatible with it, even if its not an SSRI, for instance wellbutrion lowers the seizure threshold just like tramadol does so they cant be taken together

I have to tell you that Tramadol is ending up as a dead end for me. i am an extremely severe depressive. The tramadol helped me to go out and meet people, but no one would have anything to do with me. im not even able to date anyone because of a 100% rejection rate.

so, in terms of your combo with tramadol question, its possible that tramadol could work in combo with Love or having friends or being able to do something you love, but it sure doesnt work if you are a loner.

Thats the very novel and unexpected answer i have for you.

I believe in using anything you can that will relieve depression. any other people on the board who dont believe this, is simply because they dont experience depression, so they arent desperate for relief.

myspace.com/tone303
 
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