VelocideX
Bluelighter
- Joined
- May 26, 2003
- Messages
- 4,745
In lieu of having read this thread it occurred to me that tianeptine could serve as a tolerance-reducing agent.
Barring neurotoxicity, much of the theorisation around MDMA-induced tolerance relates to receptor downregulation. Serotonin can be replaced intraneuronally by tryptophan/5-HTP, but receptor re-regulation seems to occur over much longer timescales.
Even upon cessation of SSRI administration, it usually takes users some weeks to get back to the point where they can feel the MDMA high, and even then it's not usually back to full strengh for some months, or perhaps never again.
Many users on here successfully report taking seroquel or another DA-antagonist to reduce amphetamine tolerance... the theory being that lower DA levels will force the receptors to upregulate. I am not sure whether there is literature backing this, but if you accept this, then my argument logically follows. I will repeat: this is the key step in my argument, and I am not sure of its veracity.
I have always thought that a serotonin antagonist could be used for this purpose, but since no-one really seems to suffer from excess serotonin (bar people with serotonin sydrome) (i.e. there is no analogy to schizophrenia in the serotonin system to my knowledge), they aren't publically available.
Why not target the entire reuptake system with tianeptine, a reuptake-enhancer? It could speed up reregulation?
Hell you don't even have to worry about the potential of ensuing depression: tianeptine is an antidepressant. Some research shows that tianeptine aids memory formation:
Meneses A. "Tianeptine: 5-HT uptake sites and 5-HT(1-7) receptors modulate memory formation in an autoshaping Pavlovian/instrumental task" Neurosci Biobehav Rev 2002 May;26(3):309-19
The aforementioned thread seems to report significant success from one user.
Another thread suggesting potentiation, possibly through upregulation (user had one month of treatment)
Mysteriously this journal article seems to imply that transporter sites are decreased, despite reuptake enhancement... i'm not entirely sure how this would occur
thoughts?
Barring neurotoxicity, much of the theorisation around MDMA-induced tolerance relates to receptor downregulation. Serotonin can be replaced intraneuronally by tryptophan/5-HTP, but receptor re-regulation seems to occur over much longer timescales.
Even upon cessation of SSRI administration, it usually takes users some weeks to get back to the point where they can feel the MDMA high, and even then it's not usually back to full strengh for some months, or perhaps never again.
Many users on here successfully report taking seroquel or another DA-antagonist to reduce amphetamine tolerance... the theory being that lower DA levels will force the receptors to upregulate. I am not sure whether there is literature backing this, but if you accept this, then my argument logically follows. I will repeat: this is the key step in my argument, and I am not sure of its veracity.
I have always thought that a serotonin antagonist could be used for this purpose, but since no-one really seems to suffer from excess serotonin (bar people with serotonin sydrome) (i.e. there is no analogy to schizophrenia in the serotonin system to my knowledge), they aren't publically available.
Why not target the entire reuptake system with tianeptine, a reuptake-enhancer? It could speed up reregulation?
Hell you don't even have to worry about the potential of ensuing depression: tianeptine is an antidepressant. Some research shows that tianeptine aids memory formation:
Meneses A. "Tianeptine: 5-HT uptake sites and 5-HT(1-7) receptors modulate memory formation in an autoshaping Pavlovian/instrumental task" Neurosci Biobehav Rev 2002 May;26(3):309-19
The aforementioned thread seems to report significant success from one user.
Another thread suggesting potentiation, possibly through upregulation (user had one month of treatment)
Mysteriously this journal article seems to imply that transporter sites are decreased, despite reuptake enhancement... i'm not entirely sure how this would occur
thoughts?
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