• The Dark Side 💕 Welcome Guest 💕
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
    Notable Threads Urgent Hotlines
    Bereavement Mindfulness
    Suicide Support Anger Management
  • TDS Moderators: AlphaMethylPhenyl | paranoid android

Positive The Tapering Supportive/Social Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
I am in a very grim mood. I feel like an idiot... the doctor minimized the effect of the major surgery on my body, and I really believed by today... day 3 of this surgery debacle, I would be feeling fine. But I am not, not by a longshot. And the nurses at the surgery center stated that very high levels of pain at day 3 is considered normal. That I need to give myself two weeks before I will feel significantly better. So, I was prescribed 5 mg hydrocodone... a whole 20 of them! Wow! Are they kidding me?
I am prescribed 2 every 4 to 6 hours, but doing the math, I would have run out already. So, I am taking only 1 at a time... waiting at least 6 hours between doses in order to get 2 hours of pain relief and a quick nap. I called my doctor's office for a refill, but will probably not get one.
I tried advil, but threw it up (tmi...sorry!) So, I am in pain due to puncturing of stomach muscles to complete the surgery, and very depressed b/c I believed I would have an easy breezy time. I will not have surgery again.. I would rather suffer and then kick the bucket, you know? It is such a money making racket... what they charge the insurance companies is ridiculous.
And it is over 100 degrees F today... that doesn't help. This is as bad as going through my oxy withdrawal, mentally speaking. I am trapped in the house, due to pain and limited mobility... I can't drive yet, it would hurt too badly, so here I am with my own thoughts. And they are not nice.
I am just grateful that I have a place to come to to process and air my thoughts and feelings.

And, one more thing... I have no cravings... in fact I don't like the way hydrocodone and tylenol make me feel... it sure isn't oxy. It takes the edge off the pain, but my head is all fuzzy... not good. So I don't have to deal with that issue at this time.
 
Pokemama wishing you a swift and pain free recovery.

Please keep in mind that hydrocodone is considered really good stuff by a lot of people, especially those who like oxy.

Just felt the need to be the nagging voice here, you need to be pain free and it sounds like hydrocodone isn't working (not surprisingly, it is a highly abusable short acting opioid that feels mostly like oxy crossed with a little hydromorphone).

I know it's for pain but you were addicted as all hell before. Your addiction was in line with mine (sorry if that offends you, but oxymorphone is hardcore stuff) and you should be extremely careful. Pokemama it makes me nervous you have those. You have been clean long enough that the drug doesn't affect you the same until a few times later, it does. Hydrocodone is considered a stimulating opioid like oxycodone and a 10mg is like a 5mg percocet. I don't know what they are thinking not just scripting you ER morphine pills to take every 12 hours as that would control your pain and morphine is never stimulating.

Those affects we chronic pain people like. In other words, feeling normal, energetic, and able to deal with life disabled. That's all I was ever after with heroin it's the same thing, so were you, limited by mobility. I was never after a stupid high I smoke pot for that. When I overdosed a couple times and people were around and stuff, the high felt pleasurable but it was disgusting. What they call "nodding" - what many opiate addicts revere. I hated it I couldn't function so yeah it might have been H but nobody ever would have guessed.

Otherwise I am wishing you a speedy recovery if I didn't write this and you got a second script (you easily could) I wouldn't be happy to read about that as you have made it so far. Hydrocodone is good shit though it's not codeine, I preferred it to oxy as it felt a little less edgy with the same energy. When I first started taking oxy it made my head all clouded, sort of overwhelmed me I didn't really like it for a while.
 
Shroomy, I really like your post to me! I am not at all offended... I am an addict, I was addicted for a very long time, so everything you wrote is applicable. Good news is: I did call for a second script, and since they are paper scripts and cannot be called in, and my doctor's office is 45 minutes away, I was unable to get that. I was offered, and I said no, I can't drive and I certainly won't ask my daughter to pick it up ( she would be beyond disappointed in me).
Anyway, I have 2 hydrocodone left, and I have been putting ice packs on my abdominal area and I have to say I do feel much less pain today. I guess I am glad I never caught a buzz from the hydrocodone this time around, as my only concern when the last two are gone is the quantity and quality of sleep.
 
Okay good to hear I was nervous when you mentioned the hydrocodone. I fiend that stuff a part of me is goin crazy thinking about dosing that shit right now and getting high as fuck. A part of me always will. Sounds like a close call to me. You would have caught a buzz the second script. Once you catch a buzz you are screwed.

How were you at 6 months because I slept zero hours again last night. The insomnia after the burning alive sensation is the worst later stage symptom for me. I can't sleep and then I have worse back pain. I'm sleeping today off with weed and benzos or at least trying too; I'm still not even tired. Did you have insomnia problems as well this is messing with my life.

I'm not too worried anymore if I watch it with the sedatives I should be good. I have a job interview soon and that is an exciting step forward for me. Just having a decent one to attend. Been really horny lately it sucks...hormones take abouut 3 months to balance out lol I think it's just me.
 
Regarding insomnia, Shroomy, I continued to be plagued with it. However, I did use caffeine, mostly in the form of coffee, every morning to give me some energy. I guess that could have played a part in finding it difficult to get a good night's sleep. Honestly, though, I think my body and mind were still recovering from the effects of the opioids. I could fall asleep at night, but would sometimes wake up about 3 hours later, heart racing. Then, I would watch some boring tv, and after a couple hours, would go back to sleep for a few hours of sleep. I have arranged my work schedule and basically my life to accommodate the need to sleep in most mornings.
Today, my pain level is pretty high... I think because I am out of hydrocodone and what I did have is rapidly leaving my system. I am depressed... I feel trapped by the pain. I guess all I can do is have some patience.
I do know one thing... I am done with surgeries. Never again. I will take the consequences in the future of managing any issues in other ways, but surgery is too much for me.. too traumatic, for sure.
 
Hi, I need help and I am a greenlighter and I don't think I can start my own post. Hello. I have been on suboxone for 9 months now. I take the pills, not the strips. I've noticed since ive been on suboxone that I am REDICULOUSLY tired all the time. Even if I go to bed early, I cannot wake up until 2 or 3 in the afternoon. I am on 16mg a day. I told my doctor this recently, because I thought it was a normal side effect, and he said that is not normal. So he put me on Requip, saying it's a dopamine antagonist, and releasing dopamine might make me less tired. I haven't taken it yet for one reason. I read the insert and it said Requip can make you extremely tired. Like people were reporting they would be in the middle of having a conversation with someone or be in the middle of driving and just pass out. That's fucking scary man. If I'm already so tired from suboxone and I have low blood pressure, I'm afraid to take anything else like I'm afraid I just won't wake up again (which trust me I wouldnt mind I just don't want my mom to find me dead). Has anyone experienced this with Requip? Or has anyone experienced overly tiredness from suboxone?

Thanks,
Brittany
 
That really sucks Poke. I often wonder though: Would I have been better off suffering through a couple of weeks post-op with no pain relief? That would have meant no dependence on opioids and no recurring cycle of withdrawls.
Maybe you are better off. If hydrocodone makes you feel crappy then you wont abuse it. The pain really sucks, but the misery of addiction...... maybe it is worse. I think you will do really well this time Poke. No good drugs= no good drug habit.
Remember detox? Days become a week, then two. Puking, diarrhea, insomnia, chills, fever, family members acting like youre a loser addict. It all stinks.
I am starting to think that pain is a part of life for some of us. There are people who sleep well, who have never had back pain, who have never broken a bone, who havent experienced real depression, etc. I hate those people. They judge us, and they speak their judgements very loudly. They try to make me feel like I am weak because I use alcohol or oxycodone to help lessen my suffering.
Life hurts for me. My back hurts. I am depressed, and even suicidal, A LOT. I cant sleep well. I have panic attacks that leave me crippled sometimes for hours. It goes on and on. (And this has been my life since I was very young, like 5 years old)
I hear stories like Pokemama. It makes me realize that those of us who have REAL troubles need to look past the judgements of those who have never suffered and decide what is best for ourselves. Then figure out how to get it.
Poke- what do you think would be best for you right now? Different medications? More? Or none at all?
 
I had done a bit of research on the subject of the strength of different opioids. Drs use the MME scale (milligram morphine equivalent) . Its a bullshit scale because every person reacts to different opioids differently, and even differently to the way in which the drugs are administered (ie oral, intranasal, intravenous, etc). I have read even that there is a genetic test that can be done to determine which opioid would be the most effective for you.
For example: Tramadol has a MME of 0.1, so it is 1/10 strength of morphine. Oxycodone has MME of 1.5, so it is 1 1/2 times as strong as morphine. Hydrocodone has MME OF 1.0, that makes it weaker than oxy by 30%.

I found a good chart here:
https://www.cms.gov/Medicare/Prescr...d-Morphine-EQ-Conversion-Factors-Aug-2017.pdf

Having said that..... its all bullshit. There are so many factors that can effect the way these drugs work on your mind and body. The MME scale is a good place to start, but everyone is different. I myself had zero response to IV morphine, and IV dilaudid worked for about an hour. Dilaudid pills (MME:4)did very little, but oxycodone pills (MME:1.5) work awesome.

Too many times doctors rely strictly on that MME scale to decide what and how to prescribe pills. Wouldnt it be nice if they coukd just give us a script for a couple of each so we could decide for ourselves?
I know, that wouldnt work either. But a boy can dream cant he?
 
Bdogg1252 said:
Hi, I need help and I am a greenlighter and I don't think I can start my own post. Hello. I have been on suboxone for 9 months now. I take the pills, not the strips. I've noticed since ive been on suboxone that I am REDICULOUSLY tired all the time. Even if I go to bed early, I cannot wake up until 2 or 3 in the afternoon. I am on 16mg a day. I told my doctor this recently, because I thought it was a normal side effect, and he said that is not normal. So he put me on Requip, saying it's a dopamine antagonist, and releasing dopamine might make me less tired. I haven't taken it yet for one reason. I read the insert and it said Requip can make you extremely tired. Like people were reporting they would be in the middle of having a conversation with someone or be in the middle of driving and just pass out. That's fucking scary man. If I'm already so tired from suboxone and I have low blood pressure, I'm afraid to take anything else like I'm afraid I just won't wake up again (which trust me I wouldnt mind I just don't want my mom to find me dead). Has anyone experienced this with Requip? Or has anyone experienced overly tiredness from suboxone?

Thanks,
Brittany
Click to expand...
Have you tired only taking half the amount or skipping a day to see if you don't get as tired ? That is def not normal or maybe have your thyroid checked , sometimes extreme fatigue etc is a indicator of thyroid or endocrine problems .
 
Had a amazing day guys. For my mothers bday we got a medium to come do a group reading . Told my husband if she can't tell I'm pregnant then she is a fraud . Well she knew right away . ( I'm def not showing yet.) She kept pointing at me and saying I see 3(I have 2 girls already) , and said it was a boy . Pretty cool.

I'm at 10 mg a day at this point , 5 am ,5 pm .. Prob gonna jump soon . It is what it is , but hey if the medium sees me with 3 kids then I guess this baby will make it ?.
It's been so hot In the north east coast today , almost 100 making my morning sickness so much worse , but all in all I'm in good spirits and excited for the future ?
 
Congratulations Larimar! 10 mg/day is not bad to jump from. Probably not much worse than your morning sickness.
 
I?m tapering Wellbutrin (Bupropion) from 450 mg to 300 mg.

I am also tapering Klonopin (Clonazepam)...currently from 1mg every six hours (not PRN, so 4x a day) to 3.5 mg. Going slowly, but I?ve taken benzos for ten years now.

I have never abused either prescription, not one time, and it?s going fine so far. I don?t think there is a specific ?end goal? as to either med, my psychiatrist and I are seeing how it goes.

For the benzo, the taper is due to possible memory loss down the road. My psychiatrist cited some studies about it. I?m just going with the flow, my experience is that bipolar disorder and memory loss tends to go hand-in-hand. I don?t want dementia, however!

The significant memory loss that I have is from disassociative amnesia from severe child abuse, not bipolar disorder.

However, I do experience occasional “word drop,” which I think is from Lamictal. It?s a very effective med for mood stabilization on the depression end, so I am ok with that side effect.

As an adult, I think that any other memory lapses are really what I call ?squirrels.? Just busy ?upstairs,? thoughts like the diagram of an atom. I cannot possibly recite five thoughts at once with my personal jukebox playing inside.

I DID have massive memory loss during my active alcoholism due to so many blackouts. That is PTSD-related, however.

I also do not recall a lot of fully-blown manic episodes with psychosis, especially. This is common for mania, I think it?s ... not a bad thing, in a way. I know others that experience the same during mania. I do remember quite a bit and I call it (in retrospect) ?scorched earth.?

Fully-blown mania is the best ?drug? I?ve ever experienced....the world feels like my personal playground, my ?Adult Romper Room,? but it always turns scary and confusing. It is frustrating because I take my meds and no longer use alcohol - but I am prone to episodes, regardless. It can be damaging. Par for the course. I call it scorched earth.

Klonopin is for some anxiety disorders that I have. Klonopln is also known to help with mania. A supplement to an antipsychotic often used temporarily in crisis IP.

I was IP/residential for four months and the residing psychiatrist took me off my mood stabilizer and substantially reduced my Klonopin. He said it was to ?help bring forth memory of my childhood abuse for my daily psychotherapy.?

I said that sounds OK and that is when I began to have tons of fun in residential hospitalization, a novel concept to this day. I was not sleeping or eating much, and I told my visiting friend ?I was having a great time,? yikes.

No insight, Sky-rocketing exhilaration and boundless energy from what was suicidal depression upon admission to crisis hospitalization IP.

I had no insight during nearly all of the non-crisis residential IP. I?m glad staff checked on us every 15 minutes around the clock. I am surprised they didn’t realize the manic episode or perhaps they expected it.

I said nothing, as why ruin a good time? It only cost 20K a week for a stay of four months. It was one of those “country club” places minus the golfers. *facepalm*

I felt so great, the staff thought I was doing great. When I finally checked out, I spiraled into a manic psychosis and it was terrifying. I hope that doesn?t happen with my benzo reduction this time. I think my psychiatrist will know, even if I do not.

TLDR; benzo reduction...I hope I don?t rapid cycle into mania again. Wellbutrin...not concerned.

(I don’t understand why the “?s” appear.)
 
Last edited:
P0kemama said:
Regarding insomnia, Shroomy, I continued to be plagued with it. However, I did use caffeine, mostly in the form of coffee, every morning to give me some energy. I guess that could have played a part in finding it difficult to get a good night's sleep. Honestly, though, I think my body and mind were still recovering from the effects of the opioids. I could fall asleep at night, but would sometimes wake up about 3 hours later, heart racing. Then, I would watch some boring tv, and after a couple hours, would go back to sleep for a few hours of sleep. I have arranged my work schedule and basically my life to accommodate the need to sleep in most mornings.
Today, my pain level is pretty high... I think because I am out of hydrocodone and what I did have is rapidly leaving my system. I am depressed... I feel trapped by the pain. I guess all I can do is have some patience.
I do know one thing... I am done with surgeries. Never again. I will take the consequences in the future of managing any issues in other ways, but surgery is too much for me.. too traumatic, for sure.
Click to expand...

My pain level is pretty high today too. Enough that I am laying down and definitely not getting up. I wouldn't be able to make myself lunch it really hurts. I thought of codeine again, even. Sometimes there are pain flares it may not be the hydrocodone. I'm not sure why but it hurts so damn bad today.

Did the insomnia go away? Mine comes and goes but at least a couple times a week it is zero hours, then I don't really do anything because I'm too tired, and the following day I sleep into the afternoon or a few hours. It is the worst side effect I am experiencing.

Smoking a lot of weed before bed helps but I can't afford weed right now, although I have managed to stay persistently stoned since last September. I refuse live life not stoned haha I'm cool with it, definitely addicted as fuck, physically and mentally, but it's also a good medicine for BPD and I don't really like who I am as a person without it. Shit mellows me out I'm so high strung, and it's legal here plus I have it medically it's great! My problem with weed right now (and I am in fact having huge problems with it) - it is directly related to finance. I need enough money to be able to smoke a couple ounces a week, not a quarter ounce that's not nearly enough to keep me chill.

I had an interview it was crazy. Very challenging I thought it was for a different job. It was for a management job with serious responsibility. The questions I was asked all had to be answered by thinking hard about my past experience in management which is really complex. I wonder if I will get it because that job would be damn good like a natural progression for my career. I was on a lot of xanax and it slowed me down, but I think that is a good thing maybe. In interviews, I can talk too fast but this time I thought things through comfortably and started explaining my answers. I just kept getting sidetracked because I would forget the precise point I was initially looking to get across.
I thought it was for like this minimum wage thing lol I applied months ago in person there. But the questions were challenging, I had to give a lot of background info to answer them and the one problem I had was that I feel like I got sidetracked or slightly off on tangents. I swear I have adhd or add and need to get that checked out. But it wasn't bad at all if I can interview like that if I try then I can get a job. Maybe it will be this one, that would actually be crazy. My life would completely change.

Today is the 6 months mark as well. I started work at other jobs on this exact date as well. That part I feel is strange because I haven't been applying to any jobs lately and this one actually really is ideal for me right now. it would be as low stress as that type of job could be. But I seem to have a connection to getting hired at this time of year, every year, then not working in the winter.

And Pokemama, I am a coffee / espresso fiend now. It's the only way I can deal with the lethargy unless I wanted to somehow become a cokehead. So I drink coffee all day not just in the morning, I'm sure it keeps me up a little and it does but I stop in the early evenings I should be able to get more than zero hours. I mainly notice that it dehydrates me and I need to drink extra water, already for yoga, and that coke is way more dehydrating and just horrible for the heart. My doctor the one I trust who is smart she brushed off the coffee habit it's not a big deal to me either. Weed and coffee / espresso / various teas I am never giving up. Weed and espresso is like the healthy version of a speedball. That just reminded me I used to mix coke in with my lines of dope by the end of it. So fucked up what the fuck was I thinking. I have 6 months apart from the anxiety med problems and lets just not even go there.
 
Last edited:
My depression today is awful. However, I am off all pain pills. I take regular strength tylenol. I am in pain at the incision sites, as well as other areas associated with the surgery. I am angry as well. I researched my surgery online, and am not alone in how the doctors minimize the recovery time. I will have to call my job early next week and request more time off, unless I miraculously am pain free in two days. I cannot function at work with this much discomfort. The days drag on, I just mostly lie around in pain.
I did force myself out yesterday, as a friend's family member was celebrating an important milestone birthday, and I wanted to be respectful.
I am glad I got out, and distracted myself. However, I had someone there who "couldn't understand why i was in pain". Their experience of the same surgery was "they were better in 5 days.. back to normal".... hmmm... could it be they were 20 years younger than me when they had the surgery?
I am focusing on anything positive that I can find, but the depression skews my reality in such a way that almost everything is negative.
And yes, Squeaky, I am outraged beyond words to those who do not understand suffering, be it mental or physical... I am working on becoming more self affirming and shutting them down whenever they try to minimize or dismiss my experiences. What gets me is that I operate at a high level of effectiveness in my life a lot of the time, so why wouldn't I be taken seriously when I have legitimate cause for concern? I am realizing as long as I take myself seriously, honor and respect myself, and take as good of care as I can for my body, mind, and soul that will be as good as it gets.
 
raintday107- holy crap!!! Your description of the way your mind works sounds exactly like me!. I got really excited when I read:
As an adult, I think that any other memory lapses are really what I call squirrels. Just busy upstairs, thoughts like the diagram of an atom. I cannot possibly recite five thoughts at once with my personal jukebox playing inside.

The personal jukebox is EXACTLY what happens to me. I have told people (only a couple of people close to me) that its like when you have a song stuck in your head and you cant turn it off. Except its 3 or 4 songs, plus 2 or 3 conversations(often conversations I had days or even years ago) plus maybe arguing with myself about something that I need to get done. Its enough to make the average person go insane, but it happens to me all day every day(unless Im taking medication to stop it). I took Lamictal for a short time and it worked really well, but it turned me into a zombie.
 
Poke- people suck. They only care if it affects them. You will not be taken seriously because you are dealing with idiots. You are the only intelligent, conscientious, responsible, and caring person in the whole world.

If you start there, believing that last sentence to be true, the world starts making sense.

I have a few life rules that I follow religiously because I got sick of becoming tethered to people who are stupid, selfish, mean, etc..... My rules can be boiled down into these two:

1- Never carpool and always park on the street. ??- This means that regardless of how far you are traveling or who you are going with, you always bring your own car. This way you can always politely excuse yourself and leave. You never get stuck staying somewhere that you are uncomfortable.The bad people of the world always want to carpool and then later they change from Jekyl to Hyde and youre stuck riding home with an a-hole. Also you never let your car get blocked by someone else. You park in a place your car cannot get pinned so you can leave at a moments notice. The bad people like to corner you like a monkey in a cage when your car is stuck in the driveway behind anothet car.

2: Always have cash.
We are so used to paying with ATM or Credit cards. I use my VISA for everything. But I make certain that whenever I am out with anyone else I have enough cash with me that I can pay for my share with cash and leave. Like going to a restaurant and just quickly figuring my share, putting cash on the table and going home when the stupid people at the table get to pissing me off.

My life got better and I am less angry now that I have these rules. They are easy to follow and they protect me from being cornered by the jackasses in my life. When the situation becomes too much and I get tired of dealing with stupid people, I just leave.
 
OMG, Squeaky, I am so much like you! When I was still drinking, and it was fun... going to clubs, years ago, I realized I had to drive myself to the bar and was responsible for driving myself home. I would be with "friends" who would pick up a guy and then I got stranded, or worse, they would give me their car keys, and their car, they would go home with the flavor of the evening, and then it was my job to pick them up the next day. After 1 or 2 episodes of that, I made that rule to drive ALONE and meet up with friends. I have never ever regretted it, and that was over 20 years ago!
Wait til tomorrow: I am calling the nurse at my doctor's office, telling her if she thinks my pain level is too high with less than a week out of surgery, maybe the doctor better schedule an appointment tomorrow right away and check my sutures and see if there is a problem. I am thinking she will backpedal, as it will be hard for me to get an appointment 2 days before a holiday. Maybe she will not shame or minimize me for expressing feelings of pain.
 
Congratulations Larimar! I'm so excited and happy for you and your family! I really am hoping and feeling like you are going to have a boy also! How fun!! Very nice job on getting the oxy usage down so much, so quickly! You are going to have a healthy baby and a healthier you!

I know exactly how you feel Pokemama! I have thought that same thing to myself many times- that I have been and am a very responsible person who has always done well in life, always truthful and respectable but when I needed pain control, everyone turned on me. It felt to me like a real betrayal and made me more angry. It's like, noone would accept you at your word any longer!
You know when you need something for pain as opposed to just wanting something. There are only so many sleepless nights and sweaty, horrible, painful days you can take! You do what needs to be done to take care of you! Don't worry about what anyone else thinks. They do not live in your body! Everyone is an individual! What might not have been bad for someone else could be horrible for another etc... Age and lots of other factors are there. I don't want you to suffer! There is nothing at all shameful or wrong with using/needing pain medication for legitimate pain and suffering! Just be careful that you don't cause more suffering for yourself later is all but I know you don't want to go through that again. Hang in there. My thoughts and prayers are with you!

Squeaky- I have the exact same rules as you! I think that those of us whom suffer with chronic health issues that can come on at any time quickly change our lives to make sure we can always exit quickly.
 
Hang in there Shroomi. Youre at least six months ahead of me. I keep running out of oxy, but then I put myself right back into the same spot when I get my new script. You should at least be able to be proud of yourself. Six months is a huge accomplishment by any standard.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top