Positive The Tapering Supportive/Social Thread

[cj]

Ugh. I'm dropping from 8 to 6mg of Suboxone. Today's day 4. I feel shitty. Not rip my skin off bad but bad enough to not be comfortable. I'm going to the toilet every 30 minutes. Hot cold flashes and just a general blah feeling. I have Ativan but I've been taking it far too often lately. I will feel guilty if I take any. I wish I had some propranolol and Clonidine.

 

[Painful One]

Ugh. I'm dropping from 8 to 6mg of Suboxone. Today's day 4. I feel shitty. Not rip my skin off bad but bad enough to not be comfortable. I'm going to the toilet every 30 minutes. Hot cold flashes and just a general blah feeling. I have Ativan but I've been taking it far too often lately. I will feel guilty if I take any. I wish I had some propranolol and Clonidine.

Sorry to hear that cj.
If you are not on a forced taper, I would cut down way slower. That is quite a big drop.
I bet you don't feel good.

Loperamide/ Imodium helps with the toilet issues as you are probably aware of.

Be careful with the Benzo's. Don't take those for too many days. They have an even worse withdrawal.

You have made it four days! Hopefully things will stabilize soon for you.
Best of luck and I hope you feel better real soon.

 

[Squeaky]

Ash,
What about changing to a different pain mgmt Dr?
Imagine this scenario: You find a new Dr. You show up to your first appt with your story well rehearsed about what medications and treatments have not worked. He askes to see your current prescription and you show the last good one you have (so he can copy it and write you the same one....) Then you tell him some very believable story about how the elevator in your last Drs building was always broken, causing you to painfully walk the stairs. And THATS the reason youre seeking a new Dr.

If it doesnt work you have lost nothing. Doctors are too lazy usually to check further than the label printed on your prescription bottle to see if your story matches. If the new guy doesnt pan out, you go back to the old one and never speak of this to him.

Just an idea....

 

[uncle_jocko]

Ugh. I'm dropping from 8 to 6mg of Suboxone. Today's day 4. I feel shitty. Not rip my skin off bad but bad enough to not be comfortable. I'm going to the toilet every 30 minutes. Hot cold flashes and just a general blah feeling. I have Ativan but I've been taking it far too often lately. I will feel guilty if I take any. I wish I had some propranolol and Clonidine.

Hey CJ - sounds like you're slowly getting off Suboxone. From everything I've read/done/heard, tapering off subs can be very difficult. That said, I'm sure your body will adjust to 6mgs quite soon. Today, I'm tapering from 12.5mgs of oxy to 11.25. I plan on sticking on 11.25mgs for a week, and then going down to 10mgs next Friday. I have some Valium to help with the first few days of my taper, but I didn't take any today. That said, I did have a drink with both of my oxy doses - this afternoon and this evening. One thing I think can really help is exercise. I find that when I do my morning beach jog and then workout (regardless of all the bitching and moaning going on in my head), that it definitely helps!

Painful - I'm glad you had a nice Thanksgiving and enjoyed games with the family - especially the kids. I imagine your spirit with your family and friends is just like it is on here: positive and uplifting.

Ash - thinking about you my friend. Thanks for always being positive.

To the rest of everyone on here - I hope you're all doing well!

 

[ShroomySatori]

Thanks for the messages Ash and Painful one. Xorkoth, if you're around I've been thinking about microdosing low doses of ibogaine in the near future. Finish the year on a positive note.

Things are looking up, finally. The angels are treating me today and the demons are leaving me at peace. I had such a good day, and it was frigid here. Snow everywhere already for a while now. So yeah my day was good, didn't do too much other than go to hot yoga with my friend. But I made it there and it was super chill and an amazing workout and meditation / awareness exercise. A lot of shoulder work, like I never move my body those ways. It's amazing and she is a very therapeutic teacher.

That hot yoga having that discipline is mandatory for me I can't do this without it. I haven't been going enough so I'm finding friends who will want to hit up classes together. Sine I have to go often for my back pain to go into remission and the classes are intense, it ends up being a big part of my life.

Yeah though I didn't just socialize at yoga with my friend, I did with a girl who works there I know and is cute. And also got into this debate with this guy, two girls were around at first but then it was just us aha cause I don't think they knew wtf we were talking about. It was awesome, he was wearing a crazy looking cosmic type nasa shirt. Funny. Nice to see people who seem normal and not vampires like me. Then maybe they could help pull me away from the negativity if I had more friends. And possibly get laid haha well find a girl to do that often with otherwise there is no point I get sketched out and go for blood tests lol and my doctor is starting to think I'm a junkie I think.

It's nice to feel good though. I'm glad I stayed after yoga and somehow got into a debate with this tripped out guy I'll see him around and we had a lot of common interests like knew a lot of the same authors and stuff. Yeah and thanks for the messages ash and painful one and whoever else me xanax and heroin fried brain can't remember at the moment. I'm approaching a year, and I'm still utterly lost tbh. I like the business opportunity but I don't know. I actually just think I need to start doing yoga every day again because even in post-acute withdrawal at like 6 months I was good. Post acute withdrawal seems to be evolving into a later stage that is in my opinion not as bad but still very irritating and cravings begin for the opaites. You start to think about how fucking damn good it would feel to rail a 'bump' of H and you wouldn't need anything more at first. But I can't see myself having the initiative to ever take this on a second time, it's been way too much already I'm gonna have a heart attack or seizure ffs.

 

[ShroomySatori]

Man, I wish I could have tapered opiates. If you don't I feel the post acute symptoms are so damn bad and it isn't healthy. And even after 11 months I am still not functional whereas I could have been getting my shit together, unfortunately suboxone did not agree with my body. It's the only way for me though, with weed too. I am most definitely very addicted to pot, not in the same way, but I know I'd be better off without it and I can't quit. I didn't have the self control with opiates as there was some iv H involved at one point so you know it's never really the same after that. I never had self control from the start, I didn't need very much and it snuck up on me. I was a trainwreck from the chronic lines after years of that anyway. Fucked up thinking back to that. What was I thinking when life was waiting for me to do something other than drugs. Feels like I'm traumatized and I might die young and I will never be the same and I'm so messed up all the time I get happy times but they are always feting and I'm just trying harder. Trying to eat three meals a day, hustle money for more weed so I can function, got a great xanax supply and quitting etizolam I mean that shit was fucking up my life royally. And it was going to start hurting my body.

I am editing this to say I am developing blepharospasm after switching to xan. It's a common long term side effect of etizolam, the eye twitches even though the alprazolam is treating my anxiety fine I still have such dry blinking eyes. It's harder to see. Also, the very serious depression because etizolam has antidepressant effects as well. Another side effect is skin lesions. I don't know. I don't know what those are but I don't think it's healthy for the skin and etizolam causes drastic increase in prolactin levels in the body. Kills the sex drive unlike xanax. It was really messing with me and it's so short acting that I could never properly dose it. Horrible stuff, I still feel off from the switch but being on a legitimate benzo is a better choice for my health as more research has been done. The eye twitches concern me a little. I think they will get worse, then slowly go away over about a year but who knows. The depression is lifting, it seems to get outta here fast.



I don;'t understand why I would want to hurt myself so much wen lI guess I do but it isn't really the drugs. Then you want to get better and I find myself addicted as fuck. I feel like if I lost a bottle of xanax and disappeared for two years, at least a few people in my life would care and maybe pay my seizing body a visit.

 

[Painful One]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propranolol

CJ mentioned this medication and I looked it up and it may help you Shroomy.
Have a look at this information about it. Apparently it helps trauma, PTSD, and anxiety.
Along with being a blood pressure medication.
Have you ever tried it?

Skin lesions huh. There is a product called Nioxin. There is a Nioxin shampoo and a conditioner called scalp therapy that cleans hormones (DHT- the cause of hair loss) off the skin and hair. I used it to clear up severe teenage acne problems for my daughter when she was a teen. It is a product that will strip all drugs off the hair and skin also. I cleared up my sisters psoriasis with this product also. It is an amazing product! It may be worth a try. It also stops hair loss and regrow's hair. It can be used as a face and body wash also. You find it where professional hair products are sold.

Sorry to hear about the eye twitches. Good Lord as if we need any other symptoms eh?!
It sounds like that along with the vision issues will clear up.
Hang in there my friend.

 

[ShroomySatori]

I'm not too worried about it. Haven't noticed any skin lesions but it will take a little bit for the eye twitches to subside. It's not much of a bother and the blurred vision like overall I think it is good I stopped taking that one. It's too euphoric and unlike xanax which makes me feel burnt out if I do too much it starts to feel amazing and xanax knocks me out easily but that stuff doesn't at all. Bad stuff for a fiend and it has a way shorter duration than xanax as well. It isn't even technically a benzo so I think that was playing a part in how unstable I was but really it was hopefully the worst of post symptoms from opiates. It was around that time, 6 to 9 or 10 months where I went bananas.

It's not just that mediation. I'm happier and more stable.Gonna start taking yoga really seriously again and I'll be in incredible shape, can't wait. I need to be with the chronic pain to get by in this fast paced era.

 

[cj]

Intellectually I knew dropping from 8 to 6 was ambitious but it seems logical when you look at the sub strips. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how powerful Suboxone really is. I take it everyday and get zero effect so I just assume it's not really doing anything. Thats a poor assumption.

On the upside this has taken a lot of the mystic and fear out of opiate withdrawal. I had built it up in my head as this monster after my last experience when I got put into precipitated withdrawal. This is a different animal completely. It sucks but it's doable. Last night was the first night I got zero sleep though so that never helps anything. I just took some ativan so maybe today will be ok.

Be careful Clonidine and propanalol probably shouldn't be mixed together. It will really bottom out your blood pressure

 

[Painful One]

Hey CJ - sounds like you're slowly getting off Suboxone. From everything I've read/done/heard, tapering off subs can be very difficult. That said, I'm sure your body will adjust to 6mgs quite soon. Today, I'm tapering from 12.5mgs of oxy to 11.25. I plan on sticking on 11.25mgs for a week, and then going down to 10mgs next Friday. I have some Valium to help with the first few days of my taper, but I didn't take any today. That said, I did have a drink with both of my oxy doses - this afternoon and this evening. One thing I think can really help is exercise. I find that when I do my morning beach jog and then workout (regardless of all the bitching and moaning going on in my head), that it definitely helps!

Painful - I'm glad you had a nice Thanksgiving and enjoyed games with the family - especially the kids. I imagine your spirit with your family and friends is just like it is on here: positive and uplifting.

Ash - thinking about you my friend. Thanks for always being positive.

To the rest of everyone on here - I hope you're all doing well!

Thank you Uncle Jocko! I appreciated your message. It is good to hear from you. I didn't see your message yesterday.
I'm glad I had a good Thanksgiving too and got to play with the kids. They love it when I come to the family parties!
They are always so overjoyed to see me and have lots to tell me.

Nice work and great job for continuing to taper down the oxy and to get out and walk on the beach and do your exercise routine!

So...it sounds like your body does adjust at some point back to a lower dosage then right? About how long does that take?
Do you suppose "tolerance" can drop back down again?

I probably blew my tolerance out with using the loperamide for too long during the summer. I have been down to 60 mg a day from 75 mg (a bit more on some days) due to being low on medication until my doctor appointment and I am finding that my body is adjusting to that. Like Squeaky said, he found he felt best when he would use less during some weeks.

I guess I will keep on trying to maintain on what I am prescribed. I'm not sure that more would be better. Sometimes it is required though or I would be at the hospital. I think I will just tell my doctor that and tell him that I am doing the best I can and that I absolutely cannot go without the morphine. So on the bad months I may have to ask for a bit of an early refill but for the most part I can and do make it through the month as prescribed.
That doesn't sound unreasonable does it? I mean for a person with chronic pain and injuries I think that is to be expected.

 

[Painful One]

ShroomySatori- you are welcome friend. I am glad I could be here to help you through this horrific time you have been through.
You are doing so well! Keep up the good work!

I mentioned the nioxin not only for "skin lesions" but you mentioned that the etziolam had effected your testosterone in a negative way and you might feel a whole lot better by cleaning those hormones off your skin/hair. Normal soap and water will not clean off hormones, drugs or air pollution. This Nioxin stuff can. You are probably sweating out the etziolam now that you have stopped taking it, your body is detoxing from it but your skin sucks it back in. So that was just an idea that may help you to feel better quicker.
The Nioxin was a life saver for me after Liver Failure due to Tylenol poisoning. My skin was so itchy and felt like it had some kind of toxic film on it and that stuff helped so much!

CJ- I think that was a bit ambitious to drop from 8 to 6 mg suboxone- that stuff is strong! A few times stronger than morphine.
But you have made it to day 5 now. Except now you have not slept at all. Maybe hold tight if you can for a few more days and if it is still this bad then up the dosage just a little and taper down slower. I have heard others talk about tapering off suboxone and they go so far as to taper down to .25 mg doses.
Hope you feel better real soon CJ.

 

[uncle_jocko]

Thank you Uncle Jocko! I appreciated your message. It is good to hear from you. I didn't see your message yesterday.
I'm glad I had a good Thanksgiving too and got to play with the kids. They love it when I come to the family parties!
They are always so overjoyed to see me and have lots to tell me.

Nice work and great job for continuing to taper down the oxy and to get out and walk on the beach and do your exercise routine!

So...it sounds like your body does adjust at some point back to a lower dosage then right? About how long does that take?
Do you suppose "tolerance" can drop back down again?

I probably blew my tolerance out with using the loperamide for too long during the summer. I have been down to 60 mg a day from 75 mg (a bit more on some days) due to being low on medication until my doctor appointment and I am finding that my body is adjusting to that. Like Squeaky said, he found he felt best when he would use less during some weeks.

I guess I will keep on trying to maintain on what I am prescribed. I'm not sure that more would be better. Sometimes it is required though or I would be at the hospital. I think I will just tell my doctor that and tell him that I am doing the best I can and that I absolutely cannot go without the morphine. So on the bad months I may have to ask for a bit of an early refill but for the most part I can and do make it through the month as prescribed.
That doesn't sound unreasonable does it? I mean for a person with chronic pain and injuries I think that is to be expected.

Thanks for the support, Painful. There's no doubt that my body adjusts ... I can feel it (anxiety, etc) the first few days after a taper, but it's really not that bad. Part of me is curious what things will be like when I get down to 7.5 or 5 mgs a day, but I'm just sticking to lowering the dosage by 1.25 mgs every 7 days. I'm at 11.25mg per day now. Combined with exercise, eating well, etc. ... I'm hoping that will be enough to get me through. As for tolerance - it can DEFINITELY drop down. I was regularly doing 40-50 mgs every day in the summer. At that point, 5mgs would be NOTHING - I wouldn't even feel it. Now, I can feel if I have 2.5 to 3.75 mgs. I was normally taking 25-30mgs in the evening ... and it got to the point where I was quite functional on that amount. Now, if I took that in the evening, I'd be totally "out of it". So, that's the good news - my body (brain) is slowly getting back to normal. If you don't mind me asking, exactly what/and how much are you taking? I think I read that you were taking MS Contin, which I'm assuming is practically identical to Oxycontin, yes?

 

[EPL1]

Hi Squeaky,

Thanks for your reply,

I tried to send you a private message re this situation but I don't see a way to pm you on your profile?

I hope you're doing well my friend,
Ash.

Ash,
What about changing to a different pain mgmt Dr?
Imagine this scenario: You find a new Dr. You show up to your first appt with your story well rehearsed about what medications and treatments have not worked. He askes to see your current prescription and you show the last good one you have (so he can copy it and write you the same one....) Then you tell him some very believable story about how the elevator in your last Drs building was always broken, causing you to painfully walk the stairs. And THATS the reason youre seeking a new Dr.

If it doesnt work you have lost nothing. Doctors are too lazy usually to check further than the label printed on your prescription bottle to see if your story matches. If the new guy doesnt pan out, you go back to the old one and never speak of this to him.

Just an idea....

 

[EPL1]

Thanks UJ!!!
That's very nice of you to say, I am thinking of you and I hope you're doing well my friend,

Hugs,
Ash.

Hey CJ - sounds like you're slowly getting off Suboxone. From everything I've read/done/heard, tapering off subs can be very difficult. That said, I'm sure your body will adjust to 6mgs quite soon. Today, I'm tapering from 12.5mgs of oxy to 11.25. I plan on sticking on 11.25mgs for a week, and then going down to 10mgs next Friday. I have some Valium to help with the first few days of my taper, but I didn't take any today. That said, I did have a drink with both of my oxy doses - this afternoon and this evening. One thing I think can really help is exercise. I find that when I do my morning beach jog and then workout (regardless of all the bitching and moaning going on in my head), that it definitely helps!

Painful - I'm glad you had a nice Thanksgiving and enjoyed games with the family - especially the kids. I imagine your spirit with your family and friends is just like it is on here: positive and uplifting.

Ash - thinking about you my friend. Thanks for always being positive.

To the rest of everyone on here - I hope you're all doing well!

 

[EPL1]

Just wanted to wish you luck with your taper cj.

Try to take things slow if you can, so as to ease any discomfort. You know I'm here for you anytime if you ever need or want to talk. You're the best cj.

Your friend,
Ash.

Intellectually I knew dropping from 8 to 6 was ambitious but it seems logical when you look at the sub strips. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how powerful Suboxone really is. I take it everyday and get zero effect so I just assume it's not really doing anything. Thats a poor assumption.

On the upside this has taken a lot of the mystic and fear out of opiate withdrawal. I had built it up in my head as this monster after my last experience when I got put into precipitated withdrawal. This is a different animal completely. It sucks but it's doable. Last night was the first night I got zero sleep though so that never helps anything. I just took some ativan so maybe today will be ok.

Be careful Clonidine and propanalol probably shouldn't be mixed together. It will really bottom out your blood pressure

 

[EPL1]

Hi Painful,

Yes I think that sounds really good to do, and maybe at some point things will calm down a bit regarding our doctors. We can only hope and pray. ; )

I hope you're having a really nice weekend, you sound like you're doing really well and enjoying your lovely family.

All my best you,
your friend,
Ash.

 

[EPL1]

Thanks for that shroomy, it is most appreciated. It is nice to know that all of you understand what I'm going through. I feel like I have real friends in all of you and that's very nice.

You sure all have a real friend in me, I will be here to support you all whenever you need me.

I know I have told you before shroom but I will say it again, you are sounding really good lately. You are a very smart guy and you have so much going for you, I just know that in time you will work through things, and we will be here to help you.

Much love shroom, DJ, UJ, Squeaky, Painful One, cj and everyone else,
your friend,
Ash.

May the wind always be at your back and the sun upon your face
and may the wings of destiny carry you aloft to dance with the stars

.

 

[ShroomySatori]

Thanks for the kind encouragement, I do feel better lately. Doubt it will last forever, I am enjoying myself though. Today I am so lazybones, it is sooo the last day of Neptune retrograde. Today I am a weed burnout with my mind in a daze, and I need to start taking more action and be responsible for my life but not today. I'm too baked and last evening yoga with a friend has left me really tired. I am going back tomorrow morning as well, so today is a day of rest. It is a peaceful time, my mind is nearly blank. I had racing thoughts earlier, more relaxed now. And yeah what you are going through is not fair.

If I can keep myself chill then I'll probably calm down further. My back has been really bad but yesterday there was a lot of shoulder and thoracic work and I don't feel pain today tat is too bad. I will be really tired after tomorrow, but one of the first steps is to get into fitness again and have a discipline. That was helping very much. Haven't done much of anything today I guess it's okay, I am going to be busy tomorrow. At ease, though. Stoned, might watch a scary film and fall asleep early.Thanks for your message though and hope you feel better soon.

Yep, it is nap time for me. Healthy things today, being a sleepyhead. Kind of want one more puff of kush but it is most definitely nap time, the xanax taper dose is kicking in and it is the one I take that is slightly higher. A nap will be very nice, sucks when the pain prevents me from sleeping well. These light sleeps have made my chronic pain bad but I just have to dedicate myself to being active. So drained, though. Neptune retrograde ends tonight, maybe I will feel more energetic. I hope so, cause I have a lot of work to do. Stay well friends don't run out of meds early keep that in mind it's so bad to go through.

 

[Painful One]

https://youtu.be/8RqGfaqjshE


END THIS WAR
"It's not impossible
That we can end this war
Just let your heart explode
Not too late for a miracle"
~Golden State/ "Bombs"

This song is just amazing guys. I thought I would leave it here for you all to draw strength from as I have!

 

[Painful One]

Hi Painful,

Yes I think that sounds really good to do, and maybe at some point things will calm down a bit regarding our doctors. We can only hope and pray. ; )

I hope you're having a really nice weekend, you sound like you're doing really well and enjoying your lovely family.

All my best you,
your friend,
Ash.

Hi Ash,

Hoping and praying here!

I am doing real good the last few days. You know how things go, up's and down's.
It is nice to feel good for a change!
Miracle's

I hope you are feeling better today.
Thank you dear friend for all your compassion, support, kindness, and love!
You have a REAL friend in me!
I love you very much!

Don't give up! Uncle Jocko gives me hope- thank you for that U.J!
Let's kick this things ass!!!