Positive The Tapering Support Thread v 2.0

[Squeaky]

I have been coughing up fresh blood along with major mucus.
I am scared because for weeks, I had this weird crackling sound coming from my lungs. Had the worst cough and sickness.
I think that black stringy stuff was lung tissue.

There are many things I am not trusting about the medical system right now.
I don’t want to go to the hospital and have them put me on a ventilator, drug me and kill me.
Lots of testimonies out there of this kind of thing happening.
I do not trust them anymore!

This is no normal flu either.
we have been too sick to go to the hospital!
I am just taking longer to get over it than my mom and I am wondering if it has gone into pneumonia.
Pneumonia is a symptom of serious withdrawal for me. I have had that happen before.
So that is why I was wondering about that.

I know opiate withdrawal won’t kill me.
But my underlying conditions might.

I am just confused as to what is happening and I am asking, is this to be expected from just the move in medications?
From 90 mg morphine a day to 24 mg suboxone a day?
It has been 3 months now...shouldn’t I be through the “adjustment period”?

Changing opiates don’t cause the problems you’re describing. The general ‘shitty’ feeling from the meds is likely making it harder to figure out what parts of your current illness are more serious.

The ‘crackling’ sound is fluid in your lungs. That’s bad…. Really bad. Pneumonia in healthy people can generally solve itself over the course of a few weeks, up to 2 or 3 months. Opiates can weaken your immune system, making it harder to fight a bacterial or fungal infection like pneumonia. And you have enough other health problems to amplify all of the potential negatives that come with an illness. But coughing up blood is a guaranteed trip to the emergency room (as far as I am concerned).

Please take this seriously P.O. If you see any bluish coloration to your lips, fingernails, or skin, it means you’re not getting enough oxygen and your lungs are more full of fluid than you realize. When it becomes that extreme, you could easily fall asleep and never wake up.

 

[Fungus_Am0nguz]

I have been coughing up fresh blood along with major mucus.
I am scared because for weeks, I had this weird crackling sound coming from my lungs. Had the worst cough and sickness.
I think that black stringy stuff was lung tissue.

There are many things I am not trusting about the medical system right now.
I don’t want to go to the hospital and have them put me on a ventilator, drug me and kill me.
Lots of testimonies out there of this kind of thing happening.
I do not trust them anymore!

This is no normal flu either.
we have been too sick to go to the hospital!
I am just taking longer to get over it than my mom and I am wondering if it has gone into pneumonia.
Pneumonia is a symptom of serious withdrawal for me. I have had that happen before.
So that is why I was wondering about that.

I know opiate withdrawal won’t kill me.
But my underlying conditions might.

I am just confused as to what is happening and I am asking, is this to be expected from just the move in medications?
From 90 mg morphine a day to 24 mg suboxone a day?
It has been 3 months now...shouldn’t I be through the “adjustment period”?

Hey Painful, as Squeaky is telling that doesnt sound like some opiate wds stuff, sounds very serious, be careful, i dont know how old are you or how long have you been using opiates but pneumonia has taken out a few of my OG friends, im not tellin u this to scare you but in a way i am. Im hoping today you manage to explain this to your dr and you got admitted, because what you are describing isnt something u can "fix" with a couple of antibiotics and you are good to go, sounds serious.

Also 3 months of switching from a short active opiate such as Morphine to 24mg of Subox you should not only be stabilize on the medication but also feeling the benefits of it (i know you switch to subutez because of the headaches, i used to get em for the first month or so then they stopped) so yeah this aint some opiate wds shit. Are you taking more meds? Benzos, pregab, seroquel, clonidine?? Any other shit like that, the ammount of the dose and how long have you taken em if that is the case.

Take care Painful and let us know how did it go with the dr, he should run a lot of tests and leave you there for a day or two. Big hug.

 

[Painful One]

Thank you guys!

Okay, so I got to the doctor (saw the other doctor at this clinic because my doctor was out), this other doctor at least listened to me and checked things out. She sent me to the hospital to get a chest x- ray due to bad sounds in lungs, left lung especially bad.
It was f-ing Martin Luther King day yesterday and the hospital was closed for the “holiday”. WTF?
But, I did manage to get some antibiotics (doctor wants to do a full 12 day course) along with some nausea medication.
That black stringy stuff was definitely lung tissue.
I have something bad. It isn’t any kind of withdrawal either.
Others at the clinic who have had actual experience with suboxone told me it wasn’t from withdrawal.
So, I did get some information and some help.
I am just waking up and I have to try and get back over to the hospital to get the x-ray.
This other doctor would not refill my suboxone until Thursday, so I only have 8 mg for today and 8 mg for tomorrow.
I threw up some of it and had to use more.
I don’t know if I can make it to get the x ray until I get my refill.
At least I have got the antibiotics.
Hopefully I will get feeling better soon.

Thank you guys for the help and concern,
Much love to you all.
I will keep you updated,

 

[Painful One]

PS: isn’t it horrible that my withdrawal from opiates is so severe that I can’t tel, the difference between that and almost dying from pneumonia? Is it that bad for you guys?

I am going to stay down and rest, sleep today.

 

[4meSM]

PS: isn’t iy horrible that my withdrawal from opiates is so severe that I can’t tel, the difference between that and almost dying from pneumonia? Is it that bad for you guys?

Can you describe your symptoms?

What could you be WDing from? Buprenorphine? Because there's no way you're experiencing morphine WD after 3 months on 24mg of sub. Actually 90mg of oral morphine isn't a super high dose, I think 2-4mg of buprenorphine dividend into 3-4 doses a day may have covered most of your symptoms (at least the main ones).

24mg is a lot but you're probably used to it by now. It sucks that you're having issues with the refills though, those things can really be a pain in the ass, especially when you're sick as well.
That being said, I think you'll be OK for the next 2 days since buprenorphine has a pretty long half-life. I would personally take 4mg twice a day.

 

[Squeaky]

PS: isn’t it horrible that my withdrawal from opiates is so severe that I can’t tel, the difference between that and almost dying from pneumonia? Is it that bad for you guys?

I am going to stay down and rest, sleep today.

I have the same experience. Wd makes everything suck so much that you can’t tell what’s wrong. They numb the entire nervous system, and when it comes back online…. I get everything from headaches and shortness of breath to muscle cramps/weakness/spasms etc. The list of side effects is 100x longer than they tell you.

It feels like you got Covid during a severe car accident while bathing in battery acid.

 

[papercuts]

PS: isn’t it horrible that my withdrawal from opiates is so severe that I can’t tel, the difference between that and almost dying from pneumonia? Is it that bad for you guys?

I am going to stay down and rest, sleep today.

The dosages are different depending on whether it is transdermal or sublingual. I remember reading oral biovavailability is close to 1%, so it's considered safe if swallowed by accident.
Wikipedia has this;
...when used sublingually, the potency of buprenorphine is about 40 to 70 times that of morphine. When used as a transdermal patch, the potency of buprenorphine may be 100 to 115 times that of morphine.

Bioavailability	Sublingual: 30% Intranasal: 48% Buccal: 65%

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

Trying to keep on the methadone taper myself. Not easy.

 

[papercuts]

So @Painful One if wikipedia is right, letting it absorb through your cheeks is twice as effective as it absorbing under your tongue. Cut up your doses. Wait as long as you can, then place a small piece, like 2mg, between your back molars and your inner cheek. Don't swallow it, don't swallow what dissolves off it, swish it around both sides, meditate for a moment on how it is moving cell by cell into your body if it helps you concentrate on not swallowing any of it.
Anything swallowed is lost.
From the info, seems transdermal absorbtion is about the same as buccal (cheeks).
Is there any reason for you not to move to a transdermal patch for buprenorphine?
I get bupe pain patches and if you're looking for a good painkiller that doesn't get tricky to take, this is it imo. Very hard to find any good way to abuse it and you're already on bupe.
That would stabilise the opiates and then maybe you'd figure out what is wrong?
I got really ill the first time quitting, I underestimated withdrawal, thinking the little hangovers after a week's use were real withdrawals, oh no, I was in for a beating, in every way from the inside out, so it won.
It's thrown up something else every time since, I don't want to risk my status as a good patient, so I take something, making myself well just so doctors don't look too close.
Whether it's weird things in my pee or blood pressure going crazy, a good dose of morphine and my body solves the problem without doctors intervening. But you can't take anything extra atm because it's not what is wrong and you need to get into a hospital while being a compliant patient on subs.

 

[papercuts]

I finally felt well enough on 18g to move to 17g and removed the last old bupe patch yesterday as well, I kept that half sized patch on 21 days then woke this morning in mild withdrawal from the lack of it. 21 days and it was still giving out the good stuff, impressive and it was out of date!

It's encouraging I can feel that tiny amount of bupe missing, still feel it missing now after my tea, means it might be strong enough to get me off pods now I've got enough saved to use about four at a time, more than enough of them already, but more is good. Four patches would be 100mg M equivalent and I've also got together a kick box, all my comfort meds in one place and I'll write instructions for myself because I get muddled in wds and I'll ask my husband who would be there with some of my old cure instead.

He quite likes me out of it most of the time, I don't mind him being messy or forgetful because I'm on my cloud with headphones being thoroughly useless except for in bed, that's automatic and very welcome almost anytime, he told me more than once in arguments it's what he married me for, so what does he expect? lol
I dunno, after 30 years I know he loves me and is very protective of me.

I'll still be out of it a lot because I vape weed all the time, he needn't worry I'll suddenly wake up, decide I don't like it here and leave. I'm going nowhere, it's very cosy here. Who else would lift my pipe from my chest and put it on the bedside table for me while I sleep? Up to three times in the one night because I lift the sodding thing in my sleep too. It's fairly spill proof on purpose, lol.

All my family ask me IF I can drive when we are making arrangements, everyone else can drive all the time, I'm only a sometimes. I taught them well on DUI, well done me,
I'm ok tapering for now, still about 20 weeks until I go anywhere and I might have a no fly option, slower but better I think, just incase I blow it again like last year.

I want to say I'll jump 1st of March, but what if the weather is nice and we can get outside without a million layers of clothing?

I guess there's always something more appealing than wds.

 

[Squeaky]

I finally felt well enough on 18g to move to 17g and removed the last old bupe patch yesterday as well, I kept that half sized patch on 21 days then woke this morning in mild withdrawal from the lack of it. 21 days and it was still giving out the good stuff, impressive and it was out of date!

It's encouraging I can feel that tiny amount of bupe missing, still feel it missing now after my tea, means it might be strong enough to get me off pods now I've got enough saved to use about four at a time, more than enough of them already, but more is good. Four patches would be 100mg M equivalent and I've also got together a kick box, all my comfort meds in one place and I'll write instructions for myself because I get muddled in wds and I'll ask my husband who would be there with some of my old cure instead.

He quite likes me out of it most of the time, I don't mind him being messy or forgetful because I'm on my cloud with headphones being thoroughly useless except for in bed, that's automatic and very welcome almost anytime, he told me more than once in arguments it's what he married me for, so what does he expect? lol
I dunno, after 30 years I know he loves me and is very protective of me.

I'll still be out of it a lot because I vape weed all the time, he needn't worry I'll suddenly wake up, decide I don't like it here and leave. I'm going nowhere, it's very cosy here. Who else would lift my pipe from my chest and put it on the bedside table for me while I sleep? Up to three times in the one night because I lift the sodding thing in my sleep too. It's fairly spill proof on purpose, lol.

All my family ask me IF I can drive when we are making arrangements, everyone else can drive all the time, I'm only a sometimes. I taught them well on DUI, well done me,
I'm ok tapering for now, still about 20 weeks until I go anywhere and I might have a no fly option, slower but better I think, just incase I blow it again like last year.

I want to say I'll jump 1st of March, but what if the weather is nice and we can get outside without a million layers of clothing?

I guess there's always something more appealing than wds.

Sounds like you have someone in your life who deserves to have you at your best. The question then becomes: Am I at my best when I’m completely sober, high on weed, weed and opiates, etc.

Personally, I know I’m a better person after a little of anything (alcohol, pills, weed). The problem is that a little always turns into a lot. I’m not such an awesome husband after a lot. So I always desperately try to make myself better with a little, then always take a lot, then I’m useless. I’m starting to understand that my plan is completely upside down and I haven’t really ever fixed anything with mind-altering substances.

 

[Squeaky]

All my family ask me IF I can drive when we are making arrangements, everyone else can drive all the time, I'm only a sometimes. I taught them well on DUI,

I have everyone trained as well. I get away with saying it’s my back pain and I can’t sit in the car long enough to drive (which is actually true). It gets me time off work occasionally too. I usually leave out the part about being high on pills.

 

[smokeymcpot42088]

I think most of us could benefit from a chill pill an introspective trip or a good spliff with a friend. On that note 4.5 mg clonazepam, 2.5 mg yesterday and the day before...but that will not be continued. FTR although alcohol should, nay im sure does tickle the gaba receptor a little bit I have found it useless in all practical ways.

Benadryl however-- Im jammin on a bit of a benadryl habit I am quite sure. hopefully i wont come crawlin to ya'll about that.

weed-- smoke it all. no more still. Only your pocket book is taking a hit in the end. (look into the safety of MJ, im not a doctor)

Subs -- if your scripted em now would be the time to take your scripted dose. (you can count on me to come crawlin back about those)

*edit and at some point in this thread learned that tylenol can be physically addicting. Wonders if opi habit actually started with hydro at all. nope thats a subconscious scapegoat (the tylenol). but none the less learned aceteminophen is dependence causing.

 

[Squeaky]

*edit and at some point in this thread learned that tylenol can be physically addicting. Wonders if opi habit actually started with hydro at all. nope thats a subconscious scapegoat (the tylenol). but none the less learned aceteminophen is dependence causing.

Addiction and dependence comes in countless forms. Just because it doesn’t get you ‘high’, doesn’t mean it can’t be addictive. Even Tylenol wd’s can be significant. Talk to anyone who ever tried to give up caffeine.

 

[Squeaky]

I’m finally stretching out ny Kratom doses. It’s been 18 months or so, since I quit using oxy every day. This whole time I have been propping myself up with Kratom every 3 hours (and taking huge amounts of Percocet for 3 days every month). But now I’m making it up to 12 hours every night with nothing. Even just a couple of months ago I was taking Kratom in the middle of the night.

That’s a long f’ing time to be in wd. I’m sure it would have gone a little faster if I had done it cold turkey and never looked back, but something tells me that it still would have taken an eternity.

 

[Painful One]

Hey friends,

Sorry for my not responding. I just have been sick. Down.
I have never gotten to the bottom of what is wrong yet. I am pretty sure I have pneumonia. At the very least. I have been so damn sick for so damn long now, Months.
My mom was really sick also, had the same symptoms as I did. I guess we had some kind of bad virus and mine turned into pneumonia. I never heard back from the doctor about my chest x- ray yet.....I have come to understand that the so called “doctor” I have now is not really a doctor, just a suboxone prescription station and DONT fucking call for anything else or even one day early!
Next time I get sick I am going elsewhere for medical care. I will just get the damn suboxone and make sure it lasts for the entire exact 30 days. You would not believe how I have been treated (or maybe you can) ......
What a joke our “Health Care System” has become.

The antibiotics are helping slowly but surely. I am still coughing up gobs of goo, like huge handfuls. OMG!
But that is starting to get less, fever is still there at times. PAIN level is back on high. I keep finding myself taking 800 mg ibuprofen a day and that is bad for me. Suboxone does not do much for pain.
I wish I would have seen your guys responses on how to stretch out my suboxone better. I just got well enough to even speak on computer today. I was surprised how long it did actually last and I was only in miserable hell withdrawal for a about 12 hours.
It kinda helped me to feel what the withdrawal was like and to compare. I was bummed that I really didn’t feel too much better when I got my refill, I also found that I could get by with less suboxone. I am going to save some for times like I just went through.
Wow. That is the sickest I have ever been from a “virus” or “flu”. That was crazy.

I had just started the suboxone when I got that and so I was wondering if it was withdrawal from being forced to change from morphine to suboxone or what? It was confusing and bad timing because my body was already in shock from that hardcore change in medication.
My lungs are hammered. I have shortness of breath still and my lungs burn and hurt. I am out of energy, dizzy, lots of body aches.
Like a bad flu plus pneumonia on top of withdrawal.
Yup @Squeaky summed it up pretty good.
“It feels like you got Covid during a severe car accident while bathing in battery acid.”.
Exactly.

Sending you all some love, encouragement, and healing vibes.

 

[Painful One]

I’m finally stretching out ny Kratom doses. It’s been 18 months or so, since I quit using oxy every day. This whole time I have been propping myself up with Kratom every 3 hours (and taking huge amounts of Percocet for 3 days every month). But now I’m making it up to 12 hours every night with nothing. Even just a couple of months ago I was taking Kratom in the middle of the night.

That’s a long f’ing time to be in wd. I’m sure it would have gone a little faster if I had done it cold turkey and never looked back, but something tells me that it still would have taken an eternity.

I was going to ask you if you had to wake up in the night and choke some Kratom down.
I had to when I tried it, I found it lasted about 4 hours and then had to take some more.
I hate to have my sleep disturbed like that because of the REM sleep disorder I have, it makes it real hard on me.
I wished it lasted longer.

Well done!
You are right. It took us awhile to get ourselves in this deep. It is going to take awhile to get out of it.
Just keep trying everyone.

 

[Painful One]

I finally felt well enough on 18g to move to 17g and removed the last old bupe patch yesterday as well, I kept that half sized patch on 21 days then woke this morning in mild withdrawal from the lack of it. 21 days and it was still giving out the good stuff, impressive and it was out of date!

It's encouraging I can feel that tiny amount of bupe missing, still feel it missing now after my tea, means it might be strong enough to get me off pods now I've got enough saved to use about four at a time, more than enough of them already, but more is good. Four patches would be 100mg M equivalent and I've also got together a kick box, all my comfort meds in one place and I'll write instructions for myself because I get muddled in wds and I'll ask my husband who would be there with some of my old cure instead.

He quite likes me out of it most of the time, I don't mind him being messy or forgetful because I'm on my cloud with headphones being thoroughly useless except for in bed, that's automatic and very welcome almost anytime, he told me more than once in arguments it's what he married me for, so what does he expect? lol
I dunno, after 30 years I know he loves me and is very protective of me.

I'll still be out of it a lot because I vape weed all the time, he needn't worry I'll suddenly wake up, decide I don't like it here and leave. I'm going nowhere, it's very cosy here. Who else would lift my pipe from my chest and put it on the bedside table for me while I sleep? Up to three times in the one night because I lift the sodding thing in my sleep too. It's fairly spill proof on purpose, lol.

All my family ask me IF I can drive when we are making arrangements, everyone else can drive all the time, I'm only a sometimes. I taught them well on DUI, well done me,
I'm ok tapering for now, still about 20 weeks until I go anywhere and I might have a no fly option, slower but better I think, just incase I blow it again like last year.

I want to say I'll jump 1st of March, but what if the weather is nice and we can get outside without a million layers of clothing?

I guess there's always something more appealing than wds.

How are you able to switch back and forth from Buprenorphine to pod’s so easily?
Sounds like you even mix them at times.
I was under the impression that using anything on top of Buprenorphine wouldn’t work or would put you into withdrawals?
Please help.

I would just take what you need right on the airplane in your carry on bag.
Just put your pod tea stuff into a hydrogen peroxide bottle or essential oil or something bottle and just get on board.
I hate to see you stressing yourself so badly due to one airplane ride.

Thank you for the good information on bioavailability and stuff.

 

[papercuts]

How are you able to switch back and forth from Buprenorphine to pod’s so easily?
Sounds like you even mix them at times.
I was under the impression that using anything on top of Buprenorphine wouldn’t work or would put you into withdrawals?
Please help.

I would just take what you need right on the airplane in your carry on bag.
Just put your pod tea stuff into a hydrogen peroxide bottle or essential oil or something bottle and just get on board.
I hate to see you stressing yourself so badly due to one airplane ride.

Thank you for the good information on bioavailability and stuff.

Pods are better than buprenorphine in most ways but they are dirtier feeling sometimes, I've good ones now, I'm sticking to a routine of one thick mug of pod tea in the morning and then that's my only opiate for the day. By the morning I'm feeling pains and my eyes stream water but otherwise ok. That first sip is magnificent. Morphine floats

How are you able to switch back and forth from Buprenorphine to pod’s so easily?
Sounds like you even mix them at times.
I was under the impression that using anything on top of Buprenorphine wouldn’t work or would put you into withdrawals?
Please help.

I would just take what you need right on the airplane in your carry on bag.
Just put your pod tea stuff into a hydrogen peroxide bottle or essential oil or something bottle and just get on board.
I hate to see you stressing yourself so badly due to one airplane ride.

Thank you for the good information on bioavailability and stuff.

Yeah I try not to mix them much but sometimes it's OK, if the bupe is there first it can potentiate the morphine.

If my dose of pods is high enough then I can just let any patch I'm wearing stay on me for a long time until it has run out. It happens gradually, this time was three weeks.

There is something I feel is missing, it's a sharp feeling that I can't describe but I know it's low grade bupe wds. They last longer than three weeks if I only use one or two, couple of months if I've been using them constantly for any length of time.
Pods are better with full agonists in abundance so it's not difficult going bupe to pods, the other way is not easy at all.

Pods are really long lasting, last all day, by the morning I wake up in pain again, eyes streaming, but not that bad, I often have a coffee first, then that first beautiful taste of the day, also my last now. I enjoy that. I add a bit of dehydration tablet to it so it absorbs quicker in me and tastes good so I down it quicker too. The first sip stays in my mouth long enough to get some absorbing directly, morphine floats in a watery drink like a tea, so it's at the top.
I make a thick tea, have a little nod, remind myself this is good, I have found a way to still feel it after these years of slow decline in the effects. I want to be content, but I want more. I nearly had more, made me cry when I didn't. things go wrong or people are shits, anyway I've a gentle way to get high each day that I will enjoy until I need to switch to bupe to be legal.

 

[Squeaky]

Hey friends,

Sorry for my not responding. I just have been sick. Down.
I have never gotten to the bottom of what is wrong yet. I am pretty sure I have pneumonia. At the very least. I have been so damn sick for so damn long now, Months.
My mom was really sick also, had the same symptoms as I did. I guess we had some kind of bad virus and mine turned into pneumonia. I never heard back from the doctor about my chest x- ray yet.....I have come to understand that the so called “doctor” I have now is not really a doctor, just a suboxone prescription station and DONT fucking call for anything else or even one day early!
Next time I get sick I am going elsewhere for medical care. I will just get the damn suboxone and make sure it lasts for the entire exact 30 days. You would not believe how I have been treated (or maybe you can) ......
What a joke our “Health Care System” has become.

The antibiotics are helping slowly but surely. I am still coughing up gobs of goo, like huge handfuls. OMG!
But that is starting to get less, fever is still there at times. PAIN level is back on high. I keep finding myself taking 800 mg ibuprofen a day and that is bad for me. Suboxone does not do much for pain.
I wish I would have seen your guys responses on how to stretch out my suboxone better. I just got well enough to even speak on computer today. I was surprised how long it did actually last and I was only in miserable hell withdrawal for a about 12 hours.
It kinda helped me to feel what the withdrawal was like and to compare. I was bummed that I really didn’t feel too much better when I got my refill, I also found that I could get by with less suboxone. I am going to save some for times like I just went through.
Wow. That is the sickest I have ever been from a “virus” or “flu”. That was crazy.

I had just started the suboxone when I got that and so I was wondering if it was withdrawal from being forced to change from morphine to suboxone or what? It was confusing and bad timing because my body was already in shock from that hardcore change in medication.
My lungs are hammered. I have shortness of breath still and my lungs burn and hurt. I am out of energy, dizzy, lots of body aches.
Like a bad flu plus pneumonia on top of withdrawal.
Yup @Squeaky summed it up pretty good.
“It feels like you got Covid during a severe car accident while bathing in battery acid.”.
Exactly.

Sending you all some love, encouragement, and healing vibes.

Good to hear you got some help P.O. Opiate wd’s totally suck but what you’re dealing with right now is really serious