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AADD Moderators: andyturbo
The Stolen Generation
- Thread starter syntech
- Start date
My personality is too volatile and my views too extreme and my method of delivery is too immature so I think that I will save myself the anger and get out of this forum before I decide to ruin Backo's birthday present 
Peace y'all, sorry bout the outburst
wHiTeBoY
Peace y'all, sorry bout the outburst
wHiTeBoY
star_beats
Bluelighter
sorry ot hijack the thread, just needed to clarify something...
I believe that you, as well as everyone else should be careful about saying 'the germans'. It was infact the Nazi's. I'm german and am neither nor.
villz said:
I believe that you, as well as everyone else should be careful about saying 'the germans'. It was infact the Nazi's. I'm german and am neither nor.
I don't want to get into a flame war, but look at the Jews, they have had their asses kicked left, right and centre for 5000 years. If anyone is deserving of just giving up completely and demanding apologies its them. But since the end of WWII, and the establishment of Israel, they have pulled together. Little known fact that there are only about 13 million jews worldwide, with almost half of them Israeli's, but look at what they have achieved. They practically own all forms of media in the US, extremely well represented in the entertainment industry and have the most powerful armed forces in the middle east (surrounded by countries that would love to see them annihilated). During the 1967, 6 day war, Iraq, Egypt, Jordan and Syria all started to assemble troops on three fronts of Israels borders. They issued the challenge and Israel beat their arse in 6 days. The Israeli's know what has happened to their people in the past and now that they have their own land they will not give it up. Not bad for a race that was nearly eradicated 60 years ago.
its great to see that some people can see forest through the trees.
i'd like to point out that the maoris, being the "native" new zealanders, where not actually the first race to settle there. they killed out those that were there before them......
and on the topic of they jews, i'd like to say that my nationality was also mistreated....and how many people actually know what happened???
and thank u backo for seeing that we should judge individuals, not races.
i'd like to point out that the maoris, being the "native" new zealanders, where not actually the first race to settle there. they killed out those that were there before them......
and on the topic of they jews, i'd like to say that my nationality was also mistreated....and how many people actually know what happened???
and thank u backo for seeing that we should judge individuals, not races.
Raving Loony
Bluelighter
^ also it is thought that if whites hadn't invaded New Zealand, the Maoris would be extinct by now, in much the same way as Easter Island. Not that I want to use that as a guide for Aborigines, but it is interesting none the less.
When is someone going to say sorry to;
A friend of mine had a few mates over and had the stereo playing and a passing byer decided to gate crash. They told him politely to leave and he replied by setting my friends car on fire.
To another friend who was by himself one night and was set upon by a group of about 12 people for no reason. Belt the living crap out of him
To the other guy I saw had a bottle smashed on his head and had his t-shirt stolen.
Just as a matter of interest how many people that have commented live in Perth or the NT? One of the first things that stood out in when we got to Melb was that there are no aboriginals here. In Perth people are afraid to walk the streets of Northbridge at night, and that's no accident.
But I know this will be flammed to hell, to I better pull on the silver spaceman suit.
A friend of mine had a few mates over and had the stereo playing and a passing byer decided to gate crash. They told him politely to leave and he replied by setting my friends car on fire.
To another friend who was by himself one night and was set upon by a group of about 12 people for no reason. Belt the living crap out of him
To the other guy I saw had a bottle smashed on his head and had his t-shirt stolen.
Just as a matter of interest how many people that have commented live in Perth or the NT? One of the first things that stood out in when we got to Melb was that there are no aboriginals here. In Perth people are afraid to walk the streets of Northbridge at night, and that's no accident.
But I know this will be flammed to hell, to I better pull on the silver spaceman suit.
dr seuss
Bluelight Crew
this thread baffles me.
and it makes me glad - and here's a sentence i haven't ever said before - that i don't live in australia anymore.
i just can't fathom the puerility of an argument that fails to take into account the socioeconomic contrasts that have led to a distinct line of development that has - whether you like to admit it or not - disadvantaged the aboriginal population.
to deny this problem exists, or even worse - to claim it is of their own making - demonstrates not only a remarkable lack of foresight & historical awareness, but a fundamental ignorance which i just find incredible. it really baffles me, and it shakes my faith in the future of an australia which remains largely isolated from the world.
this is the kind of prevailing attitude that is so disturbing. i really struggle to come to terms with how you can actually say that, let alone believe it. you, personally, are responsible for making australia the fantastic, world-leading nation that it is today: and furthermore, you don't have any reservations about the methods used (rape, institutionalised exterminationism, family breakup & distribution) or the people who suffered.
you know what's mildly amusing about this situation? statements such as the above are what makes australia so loathed. i hate to say it, but there are an awful lot of people i know living in australia who can't stand the endemic racism that infests the country. absolutist, ignorant & self-congratulatory bullshit merely makes your 'great' country our collective embarassment.
'one smart fellow' indeed. i'm not sure whether smart in this case is supposedly indicative of ANY kind of higher intellectual function, but i severely doubt it. the only thing more disturbing than blanket generalisations & pointless reiteration of tired supremacist arguments is the misinformed cheerleading from the sidelines. it really does you & your country a great disservice.
sure. that's about as myopic as is humanly possible - these people, even though their previous generations have been systematically killed, abused & segregated, are still afforded exactly the same chances in life as any white australian? and you really believe this?
they are still disadvantaged. and here's why: because of the people who posted in this thread. i mean, i'd hate to cast doubt on any ambitions held by those who feel incapable of compassion; good luck with your lives, because you WILL need it... the fact remains that aboriginal people have to put up with the self-inflated acrimonious ill-informed wank that colours people's prejudices EVERY DAY.
it's easy to sit behind a computer screen in a big city & talk about problems which you'll never have to encounter. it's easy to take the egotistical, insensetive & facile view that 'i didn't do anything wrong, so why should i give a fuck?'. it's easy to allow prejudices to become convictions, it's easy to laugh along at the racist jokes, and it's easy to sweep it all under the carpet & pretend it doesn't exist.
it takes real courage - the kind of courage that made australia the country where people escaped to to get a fair go - to stand up against this bullshit. i must say i am both shocked & saddened by the opinions i have seen so proudly, so thoroughly endorsed in this thread. it's no wonder the government won't even say sorry - here, in what one would assume to be a bastion of social liberalism (after all, we are a drug discussion board) - to see such intolerance & prejudice so happily displayed on bluelight makes me worry for australia's future.
how hard is it to say sorry on a national level? what will it cost you? will you have to surrender your backyard to hordes of natives? good god no. it merely requires a semblance of national compassion, a sense of duty that outweighs any so-called patriotic agenda. do you know that south africans look down on australians because of their inability to acknowledge the problems of their past? this from a country that imposed apartheid; that should give you a good glimpse at what happens when people aren't prepared to examine issues from anything other than one-dimensional, exclusivist terms of reference.
this will be my last post in this forum. mods, i'd appreciate it if you could leave this intact please.
to those who expressed such intolerance: god forbid anything bad should happen to you. in the hopelessly optimistic spirit of leading by example, i'd like to say that if you ever experience any problems or drug-related issues, feel free to drop into The Dark Side. the posters in that forum will be there to help you, no matter who you are or where you're from.
i just wish the same could be said of australians today.
and it makes me glad - and here's a sentence i haven't ever said before - that i don't live in australia anymore.
i just can't fathom the puerility of an argument that fails to take into account the socioeconomic contrasts that have led to a distinct line of development that has - whether you like to admit it or not - disadvantaged the aboriginal population.
to deny this problem exists, or even worse - to claim it is of their own making - demonstrates not only a remarkable lack of foresight & historical awareness, but a fundamental ignorance which i just find incredible. it really baffles me, and it shakes my faith in the future of an australia which remains largely isolated from the world.
this is the kind of prevailing attitude that is so disturbing. i really struggle to come to terms with how you can actually say that, let alone believe it. you, personally, are responsible for making australia the fantastic, world-leading nation that it is today: and furthermore, you don't have any reservations about the methods used (rape, institutionalised exterminationism, family breakup & distribution) or the people who suffered.
you know what's mildly amusing about this situation? statements such as the above are what makes australia so loathed. i hate to say it, but there are an awful lot of people i know living in australia who can't stand the endemic racism that infests the country. absolutist, ignorant & self-congratulatory bullshit merely makes your 'great' country our collective embarassment.
'one smart fellow' indeed. i'm not sure whether smart in this case is supposedly indicative of ANY kind of higher intellectual function, but i severely doubt it. the only thing more disturbing than blanket generalisations & pointless reiteration of tired supremacist arguments is the misinformed cheerleading from the sidelines. it really does you & your country a great disservice.
sure. that's about as myopic as is humanly possible - these people, even though their previous generations have been systematically killed, abused & segregated, are still afforded exactly the same chances in life as any white australian? and you really believe this?
they are still disadvantaged. and here's why: because of the people who posted in this thread. i mean, i'd hate to cast doubt on any ambitions held by those who feel incapable of compassion; good luck with your lives, because you WILL need it... the fact remains that aboriginal people have to put up with the self-inflated acrimonious ill-informed wank that colours people's prejudices EVERY DAY.
it's easy to sit behind a computer screen in a big city & talk about problems which you'll never have to encounter. it's easy to take the egotistical, insensetive & facile view that 'i didn't do anything wrong, so why should i give a fuck?'. it's easy to allow prejudices to become convictions, it's easy to laugh along at the racist jokes, and it's easy to sweep it all under the carpet & pretend it doesn't exist.
it takes real courage - the kind of courage that made australia the country where people escaped to to get a fair go - to stand up against this bullshit. i must say i am both shocked & saddened by the opinions i have seen so proudly, so thoroughly endorsed in this thread. it's no wonder the government won't even say sorry - here, in what one would assume to be a bastion of social liberalism (after all, we are a drug discussion board) - to see such intolerance & prejudice so happily displayed on bluelight makes me worry for australia's future.
how hard is it to say sorry on a national level? what will it cost you? will you have to surrender your backyard to hordes of natives? good god no. it merely requires a semblance of national compassion, a sense of duty that outweighs any so-called patriotic agenda. do you know that south africans look down on australians because of their inability to acknowledge the problems of their past? this from a country that imposed apartheid; that should give you a good glimpse at what happens when people aren't prepared to examine issues from anything other than one-dimensional, exclusivist terms of reference.
this will be my last post in this forum. mods, i'd appreciate it if you could leave this intact please.
to those who expressed such intolerance: god forbid anything bad should happen to you. in the hopelessly optimistic spirit of leading by example, i'd like to say that if you ever experience any problems or drug-related issues, feel free to drop into The Dark Side. the posters in that forum will be there to help you, no matter who you are or where you're from.
i just wish the same could be said of australians today.
Prometheus
Bluelighter
get an education cletus
unsure if the word was actually spoken but to this day my polish jewish grandparents are stil receiving reparations from the german govt.
the point is that until inequities are ironed out not doing so constitutes discrimination in this case based on race which(i sure you all already knew this i mean you wouldnt even dream of voicing an opinion in a thread like this if you didnt) is illegal at the international level under the ICCPR and federally also under the Racial Discrimination Act. but im sure everyone already knew this. when the state apologises for attrocities committed by that state its doing so in an official capacity. it's not actually implicating hard done by middle class drug takers with highspeed connections in the carrying out of said attrocities. its a smybolic gesture and is a part of the reparative process. at the very least the state needs to meet its basic legal obligations by upholding human righta YALL if it cant do that then i think we're all fucked.
one other point is that the white australia policy was only scrapped in the mid seventies so the system of quasi-apartheid that many were subject to in this country is not so temporally distant as a lot os you seem to be under the dellusion of thinking. this is a racist fucking country we live in.
(btw: canada apologised to the injuns as did(to the best of my knowledge) the states and new zealand apolgised to to their native population so really if anything by absconding from doing so australia seems to be acting contrary to accepted international practice ie. international law. but really thats nothing new is it?
unsure if the word was actually spoken but to this day my polish jewish grandparents are stil receiving reparations from the german govt.
the point is that until inequities are ironed out not doing so constitutes discrimination in this case based on race which(i sure you all already knew this i mean you wouldnt even dream of voicing an opinion in a thread like this if you didnt) is illegal at the international level under the ICCPR and federally also under the Racial Discrimination Act. but im sure everyone already knew this. when the state apologises for attrocities committed by that state its doing so in an official capacity. it's not actually implicating hard done by middle class drug takers with highspeed connections in the carrying out of said attrocities. its a smybolic gesture and is a part of the reparative process. at the very least the state needs to meet its basic legal obligations by upholding human righta YALL if it cant do that then i think we're all fucked.
one other point is that the white australia policy was only scrapped in the mid seventies so the system of quasi-apartheid that many were subject to in this country is not so temporally distant as a lot os you seem to be under the dellusion of thinking. this is a racist fucking country we live in.
(btw: canada apologised to the injuns as did(to the best of my knowledge) the states and new zealand apolgised to to their native population so really if anything by absconding from doing so australia seems to be acting contrary to accepted international practice ie. international law. but really thats nothing new is it?
dr seuss said:
pffft... id have respect for the individual aboriginal who made an effort, had life goals etc.
So im in a better position because i have come from a better place, yay me.. but i have goals, many aboriginals have goals. The issue I would like you to answer is why should I feel sorry anymore for an aboriginal junky who came from nothing and has nothing to hope for in the future and a trailer trash white person in the same boat.
I dont expect anything extra from my government than what I should get as an Australian. They are also Australians and have been compensated enough for the past. The government does what it can... why should a white person living in squaller not have the same opportunities as an aboriginal living in squaller, why dont they get admission to any uni course they want?
It was survival of the fittest before the English came, it wasnt one big happy family and when we did arrive it was just what was done... invade and if someone gives you shit you killed them... hey politics of the day. Where is the national day of sorry for every other race of people in the world who have had their way of life changed.
Hey im a fair guy, i am compassionate and I embrace other cultures. I am not anti aboriginal, tho i sound like it in these posts. I am just not of the opinion that we owe them an apology.
you know it is easy to say it from behind a keyboard so ill say it again
I dont give a fuck.
I dont wanna blow everyones PLUR objectives, but the world isnt the nicest place, the only person you can count on in yourself, human nature is to fuck over the person sitting beside you to increase your utlity. Its just now that we are in the whole era of realising the effects of our actions and cant just sweep it under the rug.
Personally if the PM was to say sorry to the aboriginal people, it was be so insencere that it wouldnt be worth shit. Dog eat dog, way to get extra votes etc. I suppose we will just continue to fund incentives to help the people to no avail. There is no solution to this problem.
The one attribute of being a member of the self rightious left which i envy, is to be able to distance yourself from anything that caused problems in the past. Padio philosophers and the like. Well atm the Labor party need a new leader, maybe you should come home and teach us all a thing or two.
PS if anyone writes back saying that they pity me can get fucked...
I am inspired and warm towards people with goals, what is the purpose of being on this planet if you dont have goals, I dont discriminate between colour when it comes to no hopers.
This is going to get boring... cause u will call me a prick and ill call u tree hugger... I respect your opinion, respect mine
StoneHappyMonday
Bluelighter
- Joined
- May 10, 2001
- Messages
- 18,084
Backo said:
eze451
Bluelighter
my only point is if we (all australian citizens) have to say sorry for atrocities that were not commited either in our life time, or at a time when we did not live in australia, where does it stop??
should i go back and say sorry to the english primary school that my dad burglarised whist on mushrooms 30 years ago?
i dont deny that aboriginals are mistreated to a certain extent, but its already been pointed out that the govt gives them far more help than your avg white person
why should a aboringal heroin addict with no job receive more assistance than a white heroin addict with no job??
i feel sorry for the aboriginals social plight, but i personally am in no way responsible for it, and feel absoultely no need to say sorry for the stolen generation........... maybe the ppl who ACTUALLY perpertrated those crimes could be brought to justice, but to force other ppl to say sorry for something they had no part in is just plain wrong......
p.s. this was written after quite a few beers.......... plz be gentle in your abuse
%)
should i go back and say sorry to the english primary school that my dad burglarised whist on mushrooms 30 years ago?
i dont deny that aboriginals are mistreated to a certain extent, but its already been pointed out that the govt gives them far more help than your avg white person
why should a aboringal heroin addict with no job receive more assistance than a white heroin addict with no job??
i feel sorry for the aboriginals social plight, but i personally am in no way responsible for it, and feel absoultely no need to say sorry for the stolen generation........... maybe the ppl who ACTUALLY perpertrated those crimes could be brought to justice, but to force other ppl to say sorry for something they had no part in is just plain wrong......
p.s. this was written after quite a few beers.......... plz be gentle in your abuse
%)
Insane Platypus
Bluelighter
Backo, if you don't really give a fuck - why did you post several times (extensively!) in thread?
The term "Aborigines" is a bit of a misnomer but meh. I don't mind them getting assistance - I just hope ATSIC have ironed their own problems out and more progress can be made.
The term "Aborigines" is a bit of a misnomer but meh. I don't mind them getting assistance - I just hope ATSIC have ironed their own problems out and more progress can be made.
a_muse
Bluelighter
^^ i think most people with that sort of attitude need some education on the subject
get over it? RIIIIITTTTTTEEEEEE
how would you like to get over the fact that your family was torn apart? that you don't know where you come from? who you are? where your family is? had your culture stripped from you and were made to feel worthless?
I think you would still be whinging about it too!
doofqueen I think I love you.
Sliip I live in Perth and I have no qualms about going into Northbridge on the weekends. I even end up having great conversations with Nyoongars, but then again, I do not look at them like they are about to rape me or rob me, I smile and they smile back. Most Aboriginal people are very friendly and wanting to share their culture with white folks, it is just sad that we are so apprehensive to them.
get over it? RIIIIITTTTTTEEEEEE
how would you like to get over the fact that your family was torn apart? that you don't know where you come from? who you are? where your family is? had your culture stripped from you and were made to feel worthless?
I think you would still be whinging about it too!
doofqueen I think I love you.
Sliip I live in Perth and I have no qualms about going into Northbridge on the weekends. I even end up having great conversations with Nyoongars, but then again, I do not look at them like they are about to rape me or rob me, I smile and they smile back. Most Aboriginal people are very friendly and wanting to share their culture with white folks, it is just sad that we are so apprehensive to them.
a_muse
Bluelighter
Psycho Kittten, there is a great deal of anti English sentiment in Scotland/Wales/Ireland for the very reasons that you have mentioned. Holiday homes in Wales owned by the English have been burned by the Welsh so if this isnt a way of turfing the Normans out of Celtic land I dont know what is.
dr seuss, I will be sad to see the last of your posts
dr seuss, I will be sad to see the last of your posts
i agree with backo
and Insane Platypus, he might have posted so many times cos people tend to overlook our opinions cos they dont like what they see.
they see our reasoning and will not accept it.
its all conformist PC bullshit, follow the crowd and be ashamed of who u are because ur skin is white.
this world is what u make it and if u feel u need to carry the burden of the injustices set upon another race then feel free. just dont expect me to.
i understand the gesture of saying sorry is symbolic, but isnt there already a Sorry Day? and just cos the prime minister hasnt apologised, they wont let dead dogs lie.
part of reconcilliation is acknowledging the past and working towards EQUALITY and tolerence in the present and future. and thats equality and tolerance on ALL sides. and we all realise what atrocities happened. thats step one down.
and about races saying sorry...we could go on about this forever. how many nationalities did the romans conquer? the hungarians copped it from a) austrians b) turks c) romanians and d) those few hungarian jews copped it from the nazis.
no sorries there....and i dont think anyone gives a shit. i personally dont give a shit that these nations have not said sorry to us (hungarian). i've gone far enough as an individual, even to be here in this country...and an apology makes no difference to me.
and Insane Platypus, he might have posted so many times cos people tend to overlook our opinions cos they dont like what they see.
they see our reasoning and will not accept it.
its all conformist PC bullshit, follow the crowd and be ashamed of who u are because ur skin is white.
this world is what u make it and if u feel u need to carry the burden of the injustices set upon another race then feel free. just dont expect me to.
i understand the gesture of saying sorry is symbolic, but isnt there already a Sorry Day? and just cos the prime minister hasnt apologised, they wont let dead dogs lie.
part of reconcilliation is acknowledging the past and working towards EQUALITY and tolerence in the present and future. and thats equality and tolerance on ALL sides. and we all realise what atrocities happened. thats step one down.
and about races saying sorry...we could go on about this forever. how many nationalities did the romans conquer? the hungarians copped it from a) austrians b) turks c) romanians and d) those few hungarian jews copped it from the nazis.
no sorries there....and i dont think anyone gives a shit. i personally dont give a shit that these nations have not said sorry to us (hungarian). i've gone far enough as an individual, even to be here in this country...and an apology makes no difference to me.
PsychoKitten
Bluelight Crew
aye, I know there is - hence the use of them for the example. The point still remains, they will not win their land back and those who have settled there (I have family amongst this group) have been there for hundreds of years - should they have to give up their heritage because one day long ago their ancestors kings decided to wage a war and take the land?a_muse said:
Why should average australians who have lived in this country with a heritage of up to 200 years say sorry for the atrocities of their ancestors or have to pick up and leave so the "original land owners" can have their land back? Should we allow an all aboriginal government? Since we're apparently on their land, perhaps we should install them in power and live under their rules, do you have the responsibility to turn over any profit made from the land and therefore stolen from the original land owners? I'm sure you'd all love that.
I know it's not that cut and dried, and it's obvious that I'm over-exaggerating my point, but I'm sure those who are so compassionate towards that end would quickly change their mind if they were inconvenienced in any way, it's the nature of the preacher... as long as they can stand in the morally upright position from a distance of 200 years, they'll make as much noise as possible until somebody touches what is theirs.
I think both sides of this debate are spending way too much time getting uptight over things they cannot change, the unfortunate thing about people who are this passionate is that they are also blind to any other option but the one they believe in. Whilst the belief and ability to have that much passion is a beautiful thing, it comes at a price when you refuse to examine something from all angles.
Insane Platypus
Bluelighter
^^^ lol stop acting like a martyr. You're acting EXACTLY the same way as the people you supposedly don't like!
Ashamed to be white? Who's making you feel that way? I don't see anything in this thread that says people should be ashamed of being white. Maybe you should have a white pride day to make yourself feel better.
Ashamed to be white? Who's making you feel that way? I don't see anything in this thread that says people should be ashamed of being white. Maybe you should have a white pride day to make yourself feel better.