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Cream Gravy? said:
Do y'all believe it's possible to go your whole life using opioids on/off and never become so addicted that it causes you problems in life? Is it inherently a trap or can you once in a while get noddy and blissful and be okay?
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I think it depends on what you're intention behind using them in the first place is. As was mentioned, pain patients can use them and stay functional or come out of hospital without cravings for more - they don't have the criminal element / risks / costs / or as much stigma to deal with as those who use to cope with their own pain. Think of the soldiers in Vietnam who all became hooked due to the trauma they had to endure, only to return home and get on with their lives. It really is a case of a rat cage / park environment a lot of the time.

Some people get nothing from opiates whatsoever. I on the other hand, used them in a time of desperation and it became my go to crutch. It took a long time before I got over it, sadly by watching those around me die or get progressively worse with their habits - and I felt I owed myself more than that. During any 'relapse' I'd always realise it didn't offer me the same feeling as before and it was just a numbing of how I felt / who I was.

If you were going to use any I'd go for codeine or kratom, something weaker - but it's such a slippery slope, everyone thinks they can have a grip on it to begin with.

Apologies for the rant - but essentially, you know how disciplined you are, your attitude and reasons for using other drugs - I wouldn't just take opiates for the sake of curiosity. I always just had a 'gotta try everything once attitude' - which isn't necessarily the best course of action...they're a godsend when you're ill - but having gone through withdrawals so many times, I can't bring myself to do it any longer.

Stick to psyches :D

ps: What I tell most people 'just wait till you're 80' :)
 
When I first tried heroin, I knew I was going to be a daily user right from the start. I had been suffering spinal agony for 2 years and my life was falling apart.

It takes a long long times to get seriously physically addicted with chronic use, at least for me, it took a good 18 months before I had to commit 10 days to laying in bed suffering if I wanted to get anywhere at all. Before that, I would go on a dilaudid binge for a month and feel like having the flu for 3 days afterwards.

Emotional attachment can happen to anyone immediately though, and it can be a sneaky thing. Half a perc (2.5mg oxy) used to get me higher than I wanted or needed to be. I don't even know how it happened. One day you just wake up an addict. My tolerance to opiates is at least 30 times what it was several years ago, and I can never experience that same high I used to get whenever I wanted.
 
I put this is the social thread b/c I wanted more personal and less clinical information.

4-Aco-DMT !!!! I finally got around to trying a synthetic tryptamine, the aforementioned one. First impressing is: wow a synthetic psych that is a natural psych pro-drug! Amazing.

I got the fumarate yesterday and being impatient, after twenty minutes of pharmacological research I hovered up about 5-mg. My balance isn't very accurate b/w 0- 10-mg.

What's the best solvent for Aco? Does PG work for the fumarate? And any idea how stable it is, and if it degrades to psyclocin? And stop there?

In recall reading years ago, in the Merck Index Ver 11 (~1994) that psilocybin isn't stable in water, wondering if the same is true for this cmpd. Degradation by loss of the Acetyloxy group would seem fine as we'd then have psylocin, which is what does the trick, where the magic lies!

As with mushrooms, I find this a drug more suited for social situations with like minded, intellectually tight group of maybe four, five people.

My issue is that I've discovered these new(er) to me cmpds and as far as use goes, and I'm getting older. College was a long time ago. So finding people to trip with as busy adults, responsibilities, bad mindsets due to bad weeks, relationships etc... Is difficult.

Anyone create a solo journey in the outdoors with this cmpd or the like and got through the rough part to break through to the (to me) MDMA backside that is imo the best feeling ever! Both that prerequisite puking and two hours holding on for fear (dear) life to get to the backside seems a bit rough going it alone. But worth it?

Doses also seem very low and very important, the difference of 7-mg at any level seems the boundary: 7, 14, 21, 27, 34. Being doses that roughly correlate to different levels of comparison to 'schrooms and each other, from what I've read.

So, I'd like to dose volumetric. Does this cmpd re-dose well? Or do you need to hit it right from the start, obviously differences would exist b/w a T 0:00 14-mg & a 14-mg redose at T 2:00 can't in my estimation match the intensity of 28-mg at T 0:00. I guess that's a pointless statement. ? is does redosing do anything to the trip but extend it?

Say we took 14-mg at 9AM and decided it wasn't enough, if we ate another 20-mg would that likely be felt as anything close to 34-mg in one snort?

Does this one cause nausea at doses < 20-mg? I'm ok with it, I usually puke then almost immediate begin to trip really hard, not a problem just something I wish i knew was coming.

Finally does this cause extreme tolerance. I did 5-mg yesterday would taking 15-mg today do much?

All opinions and experiences, with a little science thrown in, so I thought the new OD social "forum" was where this belongs. If not t many of my questions area addressed in the mega thread, but I wanted a more personal take on this from people? And the fumarate is newer I believe.

Is this the magic cmpd that is mushrooms distilled to its core or are there even better schroom imitators out there? 4-OH? Etc...
 
Captain.Heroin said:
Stay strong man.
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Thanks man. I freaked today. Extreme panic... 50mg diazepam, 60mg baclofen, 2mg clonazepam, 18mg bromazepam, valerian extract, chamomile tea, melatonin... and I still feel like I'm having a heart attack. Haven't slept since Sunday and I'm at my breaking point.

I have a priority tomorrow and I gotta keep strong and stop fucking around with so many sedatives. In opiate withdrawal, I seem to develop an immunity to anxiolytics. Normally, 2mg klonopin would probably be fine for the day. This happens every time. I can handle a shit kicking but the moment that anxiety kicks in and I feel like I'm having a heart attack.. I guess I need to learn how to deal with that. Because I can't, at all right now. I freak out every time, it's a major deterrent to quitting. I bought that flight for a reason though. I have to fight.
 
ShroomySatori said:
Thanks man. I freaked today. Extreme panic... 50mg diazepam, 60mg baclofen, 2mg clonazepam, 18mg bromazepam, valerian extract, chamomile tea, melatonin... and I still feel like I'm having a heart attack. Haven't slept since Sunday and I'm at my breaking point.

I have a priority tomorrow and I gotta keep strong and stop fucking around with so many sedatives. In opiate withdrawal, I seem to develop an immunity to anxiolytics. Normally, 2mg klonopin would probably be fine for the day. This happens every time. I can handle a shit kicking but the moment that anxiety kicks in and I feel like I'm having a heart attack.. I guess I need to learn how to deal with that. Because I can't, at all right now. I freak out every time, it's a major deterrent to quitting. I bought that flight for a reason though. I have to fight.
Click to expand...

Wow that's some intense insomnia. Have you tried going out for a walk? Exercise can really help wear you out.

I'm really glad to be 2 years, 4 months and a day off bupe/needles, etc.
 
speedballs_over said:
I put this is the social thread b/c I wanted more personal and less clinical information.

4-Aco-DMT !!!! I finally got around to trying a synthetic tryptamine, the aforementioned one. First impressing is: wow a synthetic psych that is a natural psych pro-drug! Amazing.

I got the fumarate yesterday and being impatient, after twenty minutes of pharmacological research I hovered up about 5-mg. My balance isn't very accurate b/w 0- 10-mg.

What's the best solvent for Aco? Does PG work for the fumarate? And any idea how stable it is, and if it degrades to psyclocin? And stop there?

In recall reading years ago, in the Merck Index Ver 11 (~1994) that psilocybin isn't stable in water, wondering if the same is true for this cmpd. Degradation by loss of the Acetyloxy group would seem fine as we'd then have psylocin, which is what does the trick, where the magic lies!

As with mushrooms, I find this a drug more suited for social situations with like minded, intellectually tight group of maybe four, five people.

My issue is that I've discovered these new(er) to me cmpds and as far as use goes, and I'm getting older. College was a long time ago. So finding people to trip with as busy adults, responsibilities, bad mindsets due to bad weeks, relationships etc... Is difficult.

Anyone create a solo journey in the outdoors with this cmpd or the like and got through the rough part to break through to the (to me) MDMA backside that is imo the best feeling ever! Both that prerequisite puking and two hours holding on for fear (dear) life to get to the backside seems a bit rough going it alone. But worth it?

Doses also seem very low and very important, the difference of 7-mg at any level seems the boundary: 7, 14, 21, 27, 34. Being doses that roughly correlate to different levels of comparison to 'schrooms and each other, from what I've read.

So, I'd like to dose volumetric. Does this cmpd re-dose well? Or do you need to hit it right from the start, obviously differences would exist b/w a T 0:00 14-mg & a 14-mg redose at T 2:00 can't in my estimation match the intensity of 28-mg at T 0:00. I guess that's a pointless statement. ? is does redosing do anything to the trip but extend it?

Say we took 14-mg at 9AM and decided it wasn't enough, if we ate another 20-mg would that likely be felt as anything close to 34-mg in one snort?

Does this one cause nausea at doses < 20-mg? I'm ok with it, I usually puke then almost immediate begin to trip really hard, not a problem just something I wish i knew was coming.

Finally does this cause extreme tolerance. I did 5-mg yesterday would taking 15-mg today do much?

All opinions and experiences, with a little science thrown in, so I thought the new OD social "forum" was where this belongs. If not t many of my questions area addressed in the mega thread, but I wanted a more personal take on this from people? And the fumarate is newer I believe.

Is this the magic cmpd that is mushrooms distilled to its core or are there even better schroom imitators out there? 4-OH? Etc...
Click to expand...

4-aco is awesome stuff. I think it would be fine to keep it in a solution if you aliquoted your doses and kept them in the freezer, but otherwise, I would avoid making solutions for volumetric dosing for the reasons you stated.
 
Captain.Heroin said:
Wow that's some intense insomnia. Have you tried going out for a walk? Exercise can really help wear you out.

I'm really glad to be 2 years, 4 months and a day off bupe/needles, etc.
Click to expand...

Good for you man. Escaping this hell. It's moreso anxiety than insomnia I'm dealing with. I wouldn't mind being up all night if I wasn't so fucking anxious. All those sedatives have not touched me. If this continues I'm just going to come clean and get professional help (my habit is a secret)

A walk is a nice idea, and I did get out today for a like a few minutes. I might try some yin yoga before bed. Freezing outside up here. I fell asleep in a couple yin yoga asanas recently which is kinda dangerous and crazy!!! I woke up an hour later with a completely numb leg, unable to move my knee and limped over to the heroin... haha. All good though, I need a louder ring for when the 5 or 10 minutes are up.

Only good thing about today was I managed to watch a scary movie, called silent house, with elizabeth olson and I actually really liked it, managed to spook me through and through . I watched Candy (2006) and that was alright... didn't like it so much, but the Aussie actress is hot. What is life without celebrity crushes... and cute chics on spring break (don't panic, don't panic... just a few more days)

The insomnia was partly light oral meth induced (like 50mg a day for 3 days, but I doubled my dose last night because my earring plug fell out and I freaked, from the anxiety, had to get revved and go get a replacement... I feel weird without cylindrical tapered metal in my ears now). All that tossing and turning. Yeah... I'm a bright one. I think that's why I freaked though... I am very unfamiliar with stimulants. Weed, benzos, opiates, psychedelics.

I discovered a sweet song too. Big Daddy Kane - Aint No Half Steppin. One of the best raps I've ever heard in my life, and old school. It's not all bad... I'll be alright. At least I didn't fuck with the opiates today, despite everything else which isn't a habit for me, apart from a much less dose of benzo addiction than that.

Never got into needles dude. I think I'd just prefer to sniff my dope. It's everything I want out of a drug... ugh... can't think about that right now. It would probably be the end of me, just my personality type. All or nothing it seems.

edit - so I slept for a few hours. I feel as I should now - like they meant to tranquilize an elephant but got the dose mixed up for little ol' me. I feel woozy, silly, and my vision is blurred. I am fucking wasted. Man, I hope this goes away by tomorrow... I have to drive. It was totally residual ampthetamine in my system. I got the cold sweats, muscle aches, nausea, back pain, and jimmy legs though. Maybe another melatonin is in order. I think if I really need a hit for energy next time it will be snow. Doesn't last for days... I can't describe how strange I feel right now. Like I'm in a blurry dreamworld (and I just had a real weird dream too).
 
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Martyrs is a pretty good movie. It's really graphic (moreso than most mainstream horror films) and depressing though...

It came out during a period of time when French filmmakers were coming out with a number of over-the-top horror/thriller films

 
My all time favorite movies are Spun and Mysterious Skin.

Overall I find movies too drawn out and boring. I'm too ADHD. I literally find books much more entertaining.

On the subject of book/movie cross overs that were 100% amazing: you all have to see The Day of the Triffids. It did justice to the book. Read it first if you can.
 
Oh man, have you read Diary of a Dope Fiend. It's a really interesting book by Aleister Crowley that I read while dopesick recently. It's a love story involving H and C and there is like this holy dude who describes a cognitive approach to withdrawal and helps them after their honeymoon. It was an awesome read. I don't think it would be triggering after so much clean time dude because of course, there is a terrible fallout from their abuse of the drugs which they consider as occult, sacred sacraments at first. Man... really awesome read in my opinion, and I learned a lot of old school english vocabulary. It made me realize that addiction was the same thing way the hell back then as it is today. Heroin has been around for so long... why is it still used? Don't ask me... but it sure is a temporary cure for pain.

For so much of my life I have been stuck in my mind, hardly able to pay attention to my surroundings. People will talk to me and it's like I'm not even there, recognize social cues too late. I think opiates stop this for me as I feel 100% normal after a small line of H.

I just watched Spun the other day! Never heard of Mysterious Skin. It's definitely movie time when I'm dope sick and bedridden, at least when I am capable of paying attention. My fave I think is Requiem for a Dream. Dark shit right there. Great movie. I am weird with movies though. Can never seem to find the great ones.

I'll check out the triffids. I managed to get a few hours rest and feel a lot better. Did a bump of snow, and it gave me the energy to get up and simmer some wild argentinan shrimp and simmer them with fresh garlic, ginger, and turmeric. Mainly vegetarian these days but when I am starving for food after days of neglecting my health... it was amazing, and wouldn't have happened without the 'caine, so I see that as a decent tradeoff. Time to come down, take another melatonin, and hopefully crash again.

Watching Martyrs tonight. Yay for movie recommendations. Now that I'm this deep in withdrawal, I can't really go back. If I do, it will be later on, but I don't want to think about that because I am not far from 30 and need to get my career going. Addiction / mental illness / chronic pain set me back several years in life and I should be grateful for what I have. The progressive fucking sickness is just miserable though, as most of you probably know. It is sheer torture and I was dropping my dose with percs so it's like it goes on and on and on...

2c-b shocked me with its power. Full blown audio distortion, visuals and geometric patterns overwhelming my whole field of vision so I couldn't really even see anymore... laid down and had a sort of vision quest and woke up a few hours later. Off a low dose too, but I hadn't tripped in a really long time. I prefer tryptamines like 4-ho-met and 4-aco-dmt. I want to try 4-ho-mipt sometime.
 
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I have not. This winter I read Crime and Punishment. Great read. Exceedingly better than The Gambler. I also read The Vicomte de Bragelonne. Not as good, but it had its moments. Turned me off from most of Dumas' other titles (I went into it knowing I don't like The Three Musketeers).

Some of my favorite titles include War and Peace, Gravity's Rainbow, Atlas Shrugged, The Fountainhead. :)

I used to do 2c-I about 3 times a week for an entire summer/fall of a year. Definitely still have visuals. Will probably have them for life. %)
 
I read The Dharma Bums by Jack Kerouac recently, which I thought was good. It incorporated buddhist teachings and philosophy into an interesting novel. A little more engaging then something like the Tibetan Book of the Dead (unless you're on acid and find yourself chanting the hundredfold homage from it lol). Definitely interested in reading more Jack Kerouac stuff. The vivid naturalistic imagery was nice.

I like books by Robert Anton Wilson, like Cosmic Trigger. Aldous Huxley, William Burroughs as well I tend to enjoy. I read Finders Keepers by Stephen King too recently and it was an amazing fiction. Really interesting story, I think it's part of a loosely connected trilogy. When I'm feeling better I have Carrie by Stephen King to get back into reading again.

Sometimes I can't get it out of my mind that the actors are pretending in movies and I'm thinking about how it's all staged, but my imagination with reading seems more real in ways.

I missed out on 2c-i. It seems to have disappeared off the face of the earth. I had the opportunity to get it once :! ... 2c-c is sweet though imo, really chill psych and I've done enough of that one for a lifetime haha.
 
i been trying to stay away from heavy kratom abuse.

shit fucks w my ability to shit. idk how you daily opie users shit.

i hate that retention where i literally don't feel to shit so i unleash the next day.

trying to push my use back to twice a week. then once a week.

it was getting out of hand, man. so easy to slip and justify dosing.

can't trust myself with pharms though. no access and i wouldn't buy pharms off the street anymore.

plus idk what would happen. i binged out my friend's oxy stash and even convinced her to give me the last 6 so i can 'get rid of them so i wouldn't have to think about them'.

vicious behaviour. it probably sparked my thirst for kratom.
 
I've never tried kratom
From what I've gathered it should help with withdrawal from methadone...Im on maintenance and lately I've been thinking about getting off the shit. I know that I'll need something for the kick.
 
I'm not sure why it's different, but for a few months I was taking O-DSMT daily, and I still had normal dumps every morning. Don't get me wrong, when I've used other opioids like hydrocodone daily, I've been unable to shit for days on end; O-DSMT seems to affect my bowels differently for some reason.

I had weird effects from kratom the one time I tried it, so I never touched the stuff again. O-DSMT is a far better cheap opioid IMO. Well, cheap for me at least, my doses never exceeded 30mg.
 
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