Lysergamides The Small & Handy 1V-LSD thread

[Listening]

I find it funny that some people are upset when a new lysergamide comes out and its a 1x-LSD. Imagine saying to someone a decade or two ago "In the future people will complain about RCs because some of them are too similar to LSD."

I have the same reaction. Hard to understand the entitled attitude of the enlightened living in the land of plenty.

 

[Xorkoth]

I've seen that report. It's on Erowid. I wish he would have done more tests though to give it some real statistical significance. Obviously AL-LAD and ETH-LAD easy to tell apart so it was basically just one round of LSD vs ALD vs 1P.

I find it funny that some people are upset when a new lysergamide comes out and its a 1x-LSD. Imagine saying to someone a decade or two ago "In the future people will complain about RCs because some of them are too similar to LSD."

Yeah it's true, past me would slap present me upside the head for some of the stuff I've said about this topic. I have lived through the times when ANY lysergamide RCs was basically inconceivable. But a lot of younger people have never experienced a time before the advent of lysergamide RCs.

I still would like to see some more interesting ones though, it's hard to get excited about another 1-sub now, especially given actual LSD is cheaper than any of them, and plentiful

 

[Buzz Lightbeer]

An old PD mod (PsychaStevic) did do a blind test, had his girlfriend randomize which he took, he even included ALD-52, LSD and 1p-LSD (also AL-LAD and ETH-LAD), and was right with each one. Of course it's just one data point. he wrote it all up in one long report with 5 mini-reports and the results of the blind test.

I can't find the report though, BL's search engine sucks big time since the software upgrade in 2019.

I would like to do a blind test experiment sometime but haven't ever gotten to it, as I don't trip super often these days and it's never conducive to that sort of thing when I do. But for the sake of science I will try to do that at some point in the future.

Ah yeah I remember this report it's on Erowid

AL-LAD, ETH-LAD, 1P-LSD, ALD-52 & LSD - Erowid Exp - 'Lysergamide Blind Test'

An Experience with AL-LAD, ETH-LAD, 1P-LSD, ALD-52 & LSD. 'Lysergamide Blind Test' by Psychastevic

www.erowid.org

 

[Gandalf-]

Here is a report from Reddit. Looks like the first published report on 1V-LSD. Sounds pretty intense!

Not sure about linking rules so I’ll quote it below.

1V-LSD 150mcg experience report

This report documents my first time taking the brand new 1V-LSD to assess its potency at 150mcg and similarity to other lysergamides.

[structure](https://imgur.com/Fg27zno)

Set: in good spirits, expectations not very high despite being quite excited to be one of the first people to test this compound. I was not particularly well prepared mentally but I have reasonable experience with 1P-LSD, 1cP-LSD and AL-LAD and can generally handle 150mcg of those well.

Setting: at home by myself. Full stomach (ate a big salad 50 minutes before dosing). I have a very mild headache.

Dose: one 1V-LSD 150mcg blotter swallowed with water, as advised, to let stomach enzymes do the work of cleaving the rather long carbon chain that hangs off the LSD molecule.

I dosed at 8:30pm. I prefer tripping when it is dark and quiet.

+40 minutes first alert. A subtle (placebo?), sense of wellbeing presents itself.

+1 hour. The same feeling is still present but in no way do I feel any intensity building. I am not expecting this to suddenly take off.

+2. Not much change. A slightly fuzzy head and it feels like \~50ug of 1(c)P-LSD.

I spent the first two hours mindlessly surfing the internet until I made my first note that as expected, this chem is a dud. There was the classic LSD energy and 'fluffiness' but nothing visual or mind altering. Taking into consideration that my full stomach might delay things a bit I waited for another half hour and vaporised some weed to see if this would kick things off. Sure enough the weed affected me more strongly than usual and half an hour after that I started wishing I hadn't taken any!

+3. Suddenly it became obvious the onset is just long and that i probably didn't need weed for potentiation. Things started to get intense soon after. I have a pretty good idea of what 150mcg of 1(c)P-LSD feels like and this was definitely on its way to a similar intensity, which caught me off guard and prompted some minor anxiety. The visuals started getting more pronounced. Heavy colour saturation and pattern shifting was everywhere but stayed at a manageable level. An enormous amount of energy started building up and made my hands tremble as I attempted to type down notes. The stimulation was a bit uncomfortable along with some mild nausea and stomach discomfort which could have been due to eating prior to dosing. This was suddenly a solid +++ experience!

I have tremors and a lot of pent up energy. My mind feels jittery and all over the place. Some nausea and general discomfort has been there from the start but I can manage it. Drank some water, jumped around a bit and even played some games in VR but it was all a bit uncomfortable and too intense.

+5. I hadn't prepared for my trip well so I just listened to music for hours until some introspection suddenly demanded my attention. I had been laughing a lot at random internet stuff as well as at my own mental fabrications but the 1V made me aware of some repressed feelings of loneliness and pain which presented themselves like lightning strikes whenever I made associations between memories, alternating between happy, beautiful, heart breaking etc. In short moments of sadness I let my tears flow and allowed myself to be with the feeling of grief intently, without lingering too long. This is why I find LSD and its analogues to be so therapeutic sometimes. There is a ruthless directness to it. Things aren't sugar coated. It is just raw honesty. Maybe at times I felt slightly detached from my feelings and emotions whereas I might otherwise feel too identified with them, so this was useful and much needed.

Most of the spectrum of existentialist drama made an appearance: feeling inadequate, feeling sorry for myself, feeling that I don't honour my friendships enough and that I wish to strengthen relationships in general, that my self image needs working on etc. It wasn't all depressing though. I also felt deeply alive and capable of putting my mind to great things.

Besides all the emotional stuff, the 1V-LSD made me acutely aware that I am in poor physical shape and that this is having a serious effect on my mental health as well. I wrote ''I want to be better and I want to love without fear, I want to have a purpose in life''.

My back pain prompted me to step out onto my balcony in the cool damp air where another wave of regret hit me as I saw my gorgeous cannabis plants that I am treating as THC factories rather than the divine organisms they are. I apologised to my plants, kissed them, inhaled their incredible aromas and went back inside after trying to take some artsy photos, which proved impossible due to my shaking hands. I contemplated going cycling but I was too far out.

''Acid is good spirited but so wonky''

''I am selfish, ego driven, vain, attention and validation seeking''

''I can accept myself as I am regardless''

''I am a caveman''

My friends have lives/are asleep because none of them reply to my ranting. While I enjoy solo trips, acid does make me want to talk people's ears off.

+6. Let's vape some more cannabis.

+7. Look who forgot to vape cannabis. I am normally quite distracted and scatter brained without specific tasks to do and the LSD amplified this 100x.

+8. Deadly silence everywhere. Outside and inside. Standing in the door opening to the terrace I wonder ''Am I the only person who listens to music?''

RIP sleep as foretold.

I'm outside on the terrace again with my plants. I imagine myself a pitchfork wielding southerner protecting his crop, scanning the horizon for movement and listening intently to odd sounds in the night.

[https://www.incedigris.com/entitiesgallery/2018/11/30/m-o-m]
This piece blows my mind, again.

Music is my other companion. Kula Shaker, Zero 7, The Doors, Ott, Carbon Based Lifeforms, Massive Attack and a bunch of other great bands give rise to fantastic ideas and associations.

My cat is going a bit bonkers too I worry. She has been with me most of the trip and made my laugh so much.

Food! I break down standing in the kitchen eating a piece of smoked fish. First because it tastes heavenly, then a wave of emotions washes over me as I associate good food with good company and memories of late relatives, grandparents. Vivid images of what my identity is consists of, memories of a careless childhood, the good life, feeling at home, real life, ideal life imagined in retrospect, that is gone now and I mourn deeply. More food will comfort me. I'm eating a mix of greek yogurt, cacao and honey and entire stories were written in my mind.

+9. The speed with which my mind is still exploding is unreal. The energy that is created conjures images of the splitting of atoms. I am wide awake and the sun is coming up. No cheating I told myself so no benzo until +12.

+10. Spent an hour in feverish paranoia after finding out I forgot my router password. Resetting it was an ordeal no one should go through on LSD.

+11. Fuck it. I'm not waiting another hour. 0.5mg flualprazolam helped me fall asleep after playing some retro video games

Closing comments: there is no doubt in my mind that 1V-LSD is a prodrug of LSD like all the others before it. Since I had a single experience with 1B-LSD that I found disappointing in its intensity, I had low expectations for 1V-LSD and it ended up kicking my ass. The creator(s) of this compound made these blotters 150mcg with the expectation this should translate to roughly the potency of 125mcg 1(c)P-LSD. Subjectively it felt like more but that could be due to set and setting. I experienced a bit of everything and know that I still love LSD for many reasons.

Onset: 3 hours (with full stomach but it does make sense that the higher molecular weight and long carbon chain requires more time to be converted).

Peak and plateau: 3-4 hours

Comedown: about 5 hours and probably a fair bit longer had I not taken a benzodiazepine.

**TL;DR: 1V-LSD is an exciting new lysergamide that packs a punch at 150 mics. It is nearly indistinguishable from LSD and almost certainly a prodrug like other analogues.**

 

[tired of crap]

Off OP topic but re ETHLAD

This David Nichols interview is pretty interesting. It turns out that ETH-LAD is a full agonist and activates 5-HT2A more strongly than serotonin. It's amazing what replacing a methyl with an ethyl can do.

 

[Xorkoth]

Generally speaking going from a methyl to an ethyl won't make any real difference in a drug (inb4 methanol-ethanol comparisons), especially in a molecule as large as LSD. They are for all intents and purposes the same, and all "differences" should be attributed to placebo or just the standard case of trips being different each time.

I think a lot of this just comes down to people wanting there to be more psychedelics, so they attribute minor molecular differences to experiential changes.

Relevant info that just got posted in the ETH-LAD thread:

This David Nichols interview is pretty interesting. It turns out that ETH-LAD is a full agonist and activates 5-HT2A more strongly than serotonin. It's amazing what replacing a methyl with an ethyl can do.

 

[unodelacosa]

I have lived through the times when ANY lysergamide RCs was basically inconceivable.

I've always held out faith that this age would arrive eventually, given that Tim Scully and Nick Sand were allegedly manufacturing ALD-52, not LSD-25, in the infamous Orange Sunshine acid case from the late 70s. By the mid-to-late 1990s, TiHKAL had been published and talked at length about LSD analogs, homologues, isomers and other lysergamides. But I feel you – these kind of drugs just seemed like they were on official LEGENDARY status somehow. I guess b/c LSD is so epic…

 

[prince_igor]

same here Xorkoth same here.

there was a time when we took what ever was given and were thankful that we got something.

how the world changes because of technology.

 

[HearWhalesLaugh]

Seems like a lot of folks might be too young to remember the dry spell after William Pickard got railroaded. Half the acid I got in high school was bunk af or 5 meo amt

 

[unodelacosa]

Seems like a lot of folks might be too young to remember the dry spell after William Pickard got railroaded. Half the acid I got in high school was bunk af or 5 meo amt

I was already out of high school and was dealing rave drugs heavily at that time. After the Wamego, KS lab bust in 2000, it took a little under a year for the rest of that LSD flow to run dry. This coincided with the 9/11 Attacks on the World Trade Center in NYC, and suddenly every law enforcement budget saw a huge boom in budget. That George W. Bush / Dick Cheney /Rumsfeld & Wolfowitz era with no LSD fucking sucked. And it was dangerous to boot what with a sudden influx of 25X-NBOMe drugs being placed on blotter and having the unfortunate side-effect of randomly being lethal to some individuals…

There's a good book about the strange and tragic tale of the Acid King, William Leonard Pickard called Operation White Rabbit: LSD, the DEA, and the Fate of the Acid King. It came out this past October. I highly recommend it. It's a great read.

 

[HearWhalesLaugh]

I was already out of high school and was dealing rave drugs heavily at that time. After the Wamego, KS lab bust in 2000, it took a little under a year for the rest of that LSD flow to run dry. This coincided with the 9/11 Attacks on the World Trade Center in NYC, and suddenly every law enforcement budget saw a huge boom in budget. That George W. Bush / Dick Cheney /Rumsfeld & Wolfowitz era with no LSD fucking sucked. And it was dangerous to boot what with a sudden influx of 25X-NBOMe drugs being placed on blotter and having the unfortunate side-effect of randomly being lethal to some individuals…

There's a good book about the strange and tragic tale of the Acid King, William Leonard Pickard called Operation White Rabbit: LSD, the DEA, and the Fate of the Acid King. It came out this past October. I highly recommend it. It's a great read.

Ill
Have to check that book out. I just finished the novel Pickard wrote in prison “The Rose Of Paracelsus” what a dense and entheogenic forest of prose

 

[AutoTripper]

New on the market, being released just as the German NPS ban goes into place. The ban stipulates that at the N1 position, a carbonyl group can be no longer than 4 carbons. The obvious step is just to make one with 5 carbons!
This gives us 1V-LSD, the V for Valeroyl, an alternate name for a pentanoyl group (I guess 1Pe-LSD would be more confusing and sound less flashy). No reports of consumption yet but speculations and eventual bioassays can go into this thread! I speculate it will be a similar prodrug to LSD like all of the other N1 substituted lysergamides, though this still remains to be seen (I am also an adherent to the hypothesis that LSD prodrugs aren't fully metabolized and some of the original material crosses the BBB, yielding a unique experience). What this one is like however, remains to be seen! Potentially a very exciting develpoment

1cP-LSD is much better than 1PLSD, but was only whipped out two years ago despite having been synthesised and tested at the same time as 1P or at least years prior, when the German legislation came in banning nothing about 1PLSD except it’s import.

Major trade done via Germany, so a lot of their tact is towards keeping that avenue uninterrupted as long as possible.

They did well, it looked like 1PLSD via and from, within Germany was buried.

Out came 1cP-LSD and hurrah another two undisturbed years of business, they also supplied them with 1cP-AL-LAD, while other countries were able to just stick with regular AL-LAD.

So the same story, 2 years on, new legislation to make X compound technically and uncategorically illegal, and they have, 1V-LSD.

We can’t know how long they have had it. 1B-LSD was the only real flop.

1cP is much better than 1P, more potent per weight. But they no doubt retained 1cP in preparation for the law catching up.

Who knows what they are holding back?

It’s a shame most of all they aren’t just producing tons of ALD-52, since they stopped making it over 2 years ago due to lower yields and bigger costs.

I was glad to get some but in hindsight, I’d have gotten a tonne at the time.

1V-LSD is laid at 150 ug, they say 100 ug of 1cP-LSD is about equipotent to 120 ug 1V-LSD.

Which they say may be slightly more visual too. So the new blotters will likely be stronger, per tab.

Don’t knock it til you try it they say lol.

(although, I knocked 1B-LSD, I had the wisdom to see it wasn’t worth trying with way better alternatives).

 

[unodelacosa]

Ill
Have to check that book out. I just finished the novel Pickard wrote in prison “The Rose Of Paracelsus” what a dense and entheogenic forest of prose

Yeah that's talked about quite a bit throughout Operation White Rabbit. You definitely should read this book, man, just if for no other reason than to sort of give context to Rose of Peracelsus. I think what I found really interesting about Operation White Rabbit is that Dennis McDougal really calls Leonard Pickard out on some of his blatant bullshit, not the least of which is laid on heavy-handedly throughout his own prison-life-paced tome no doubt painstakingly typed out in the prison library of the United States Penitentiary Bumblefuck… poor guy. Don't know why he got so deeply involved with that rat fink piece of shit Gordon Todd Skinner, though. I'm glad he was let out of federal prison though recently after serving two long decades.

 

[Xorkoth]

I've always held out faith that this age would arrive eventually, given that Tim Scully and Nick Sand were allegedly manufacturing ALD-52, not LSD-25, in the infamous Orange Sunshine acid case from the late 70s. By the mid-to-late 1990s, TiHKAL had been published and talked at length about LSD analogs, homologues, isomers and other lysergamides. But I feel you – these kind of drugs just seemed like they were on official LEGENDARY status somehow. I guess b/c LSD is so epic…

That ALD-52 thing was later proven to be false, he admitted he just said that to try to get out of trouble. However I have also read that they were synthing analogues, but not distributing on a wide scale.

Back in the day when the drought happened, the common lore was that the LSD synth was so complex that only a few people in the world had the skill to pull it off. In reality, it's just that the precursors were so highly controlled, and the global supply had been so reliant on one team making almost all of it. Since then, clearly the precursors have become more available, and/or some alternative synth routes were found. Not sure which. The global distribution network just needed some time to regroup and recover.

 

[unodelacosa]

1cP-LSD is much better than 1PLSD […] 1cP is much better than 1P

Agreed. It felt like 1P-LSD was too pushy and I didn't always like where it went with my headspace; whereas I find 1cP-LSD to be pleasant, friendly, super clean and clear, and virtually indistinguishable from top grade LSD like so-called “Fluff”, “Needlepoint”, “Cream”, etc. Maybe this is because 1cP-LSD purportedly acts as a prodrug to LSD, but Idk, I don't feel I could tell them apart in a double-blind study. Who knows? It's definitely kick-ass stuff and I preferred it very much over the pushiness of the 1P-LSD high.

But goddamn, for any of the lysergamides in show business these days, LSD is a tough act to follow when you consider it's broad appeal, longevity in the drug scene, potency, and relatively forgiving safety profile (in terms of its LD50 & overdosing).

Who knows what they are holding back?

Or for that matter, who knows how strategized it really all is and how much of it is just pure dumb luck coupled with a degree of crafting novel designer drugs in reaction to various legislative actions to interrupt this industry?

 

[Buzz Lightbeer]

Yeah 1p is definitely different, I really don't care what anyone says, this discussion has been had many times but I swear I can pick the 1p out pretty easily, for sure much more pushy, physically and mentally, even on low doses my muscles get really tense,. Haven't taken it for 3 years though

 

[unodelacosa]

That ALD-52 thing was later proven to be false,

Well firstly, my point was just that from a much earlier era, clandestine chemists had already been at least thinking of lysergamide analogs and such. The proving came down to the prosecution stating that the only known way (at that time) to produce ALD-52 was via using LSD-25 as an intermediate. And also since ALD-52 is a prodrug to LSD-25, this was functionally the same thing and therefore illegal. This was before the Federal Analog Act of course, but regardless the jury sided with the government and found the defendants guilty.

he admitted he just said that to try to get out of trouble. However I have also read that they were synthing analogues, but not distributing on a wide scale.

Just that he was talking about ALD-52 gave me a glimmer of hope that there would be a cool Pantheon, if you will, of lysergamide drug gods… Took a while, but lemme just say: goddamn I love RCs.

Back in the day when the drought happened, the common lore was that the LSD synth was so complex that only a few people in the world had the skill to pull it off.

Yeah that sentiment did seem prevalent through forums like The-Hive.ws and the ADC before it, and this is still before the bust.

In reality, it's just that the precursors were so highly controlled,

“Were”? It's still very, very difficult to obtain a nice chunk of clean ergotamine tartrate, the precursor of preference for most LSD producers. (EDIT: also diethylamine is not easy to procure. Nor Lyergic acid for that matter.)

and the global supply had been so reliant on one team making almost all of it.

So that ended up being a little untrue, fabricated somewhere between initial arresting officers and the press. The total seizure was not as large as was first reported. However, there is not a doubt in my mind that it knocked the LSD hustle off the rails for quite a few years. Also, the band Phish stopped touring and were on hiatus around this time, and I think in the U.S., at least, that made some impact on the flow of LSD.

Since then, clearly the precursors have become more available, and/or some alternative synth routes were found. Not sure which.

I'm not really either. I mean, it's technically possible to cultivate one's own ergot by first sampling a little, then allowing it to grow in a larger substrate material before mixing this in with distilled water and misting the heads of rye grain with this ergot-infested water. There's about a two to three week window in the autumn time when it will bloom the best, so if you time it just right, you can fill up giant 55 gallon drums with the ergot fungus you just cultivated and grew… Obviously the site prohibits going into details, so to sum it up and make a point: ergotamine tartrate can be derived from this ergot in the right hands with the right methods and equipment. Where there's a will, there's a way.

The global distribution network just needed some time to regroup and recover.

Yes, and there were a lot of power struggles just after that bust as methamphetamine manufacture began to take off in Mexico and production shifted in the U.S. from domestic to import… this changed some of the distribution networks…

 

[unodelacosa]

In reality, it's just that the precursors were so highly controlled

Also just wanted to add: the difficulty isn't for the chemist in a properly equipped lab. The difficulty is for the clandestine chemist to adequately create facsimile of same environment, replete with being sealed off from light and conducted under low-energy red lights, having a proper rotovap so solvents can be removed quickly and virtually without heat, and you'll need a tank of nitrogen to blow an inert atmosphere over top the initial reaction… It really gets tricky to do this surreptitiously, so it's not for no reason LSD is the Holy Grail of clandestine chemistry.

 

[perpetualdawn]

But goddamn, for any of the lysergamides in show business these days, LSD is a tough act to follow when you consider it's broad appeal, longevity in the drug scene, potency, and relatively forgiving safety profile (in terms of its LD50 & overdosing).

Yes, it's really remarkable how perfect a drug LSD is in a lot of respects, and how it happened to show up as basically the very first psychedelic RC. Its quality of being nearly the most potent (per mass) psychoactive drug, but with this built in safety-valve of not really being possible to overdose in any physically harmful way, makes it unusually perfect as a clandestine, underground mind-expanding drug. Dead easy to transport and distribute, not going to get anyone into tooooo much trouble if they take too much (most of the time.. obviously people can fuck themselves up with it, but it's no where close to as dangerous as nearly any other drug).

Combined with all kinds of coincidences around its arrival in the world, it's hard not to become a little superstitious about it.

 

[Xorkoth]

It was certainly an event of great serendipity, which was also accidental. The stuff of legends. On the other hand, if you think about it, so much of life is that way. The n8mber of accidental random seemingly innocuous events that happen that end up radically altering the course of the rest of your life, and other peoples' lives, it really mind-blowing when you start to think about it. Especially when you think about all the random stuff from before you were born that is the only reason you exist... ever since the beginning of time, really. A butterfly flaps its wings, and all that. The world and our lives all turn on chance encounters.