Benzos The similarities between benzodiazepines and valerian root

[Lexx23]

Benzos are much more of a powerful stoning/narcotic feeling with sedation. They are also much stronger.


Valerian root is much more of a strong muscle relaxant in high dosages and vivid dream inducer. It also feels mildly trippy or delirious.


They don't feel similar at all. They both can relieve anxiety. A benzo will reduce anxiety much more than Valerian root.


Valerian root is non-habit forming.


A few good examples are kicking an opiate, a benzo will calm the anxiety but leave you kicking, while valerian will chill out your legs etc. Valerian won't do much to affect a psycedelic trip, but a benzo can take the edge off. Drinking alcohol with valerian root doesn't have that much of an effect, while drinking with benzos magnifies it greatly and can even be dangerous.

 

[Streetcow]

Hummmmm Interesting conversation

I didn't know doctors actually thought Valium was made out of valerian (mind blow) that's some weird stuff right

so also I was wondering is the euphoria similar for both? (My experience with benzos are limited)

-Streetcow

 

[BigG]

Hummmmm Interesting conversation

I didn't know doctors actually thought Valium was made out of valerian (mind blow) that's some weird stuff right

so also I was wondering is the euphoria similar for both? (My experience with benzos are limited)

-Streetcow

I dont think they ALL think that but some people do. It was a poster over in EADD that said that their doctor told them that and the guy couldnt believe that a doctor could be so ill informed....

Of course there's always the possibility the theGirlWithBlueHair suggested that they could just say it in the hope that the patient believes it and therefore doesn't push for a valium script......

I wouldn't put such deliberate lies past some of the doctors I've had the misfortune of coming a cross in the past. The sad thing is that once the patient knows the doctor isnt being truthful then they will discount EVERYTHING the doctor then has to say......even the important bits.

 

[Streetcow]

I dont think they ALL think that but some people do. It was a poster over in EADD that said that their doctor told them that and the guy couldnt believe that a doctor could be so ill informed....

Of course there's always the possibility the theGirlWithBlueHair suggested that they could just say it in the hope that the patient believes it and therefore doesn't push for a valium script......

I wouldn't put such deliberate lies past some of the doctors I've had the misfortune of coming a cross in the past. The sad thing is that once the patient knows the doctor isnt being truthful then they will discount EVERYTHING the doctor then has to say......even the important bits.

ahhhh I gotcha

and it really pisses me off how doctors will do anything to not prescribe narcotics to patients and how most people look down on drug users just because there lives need enhancing by drugs and they don't

you know sometimes the infinite wave of antidepressants antipsychotics and therapy doesn't work and just results in even deeper sorrow about the situation and the only salvation of the person in question is ethier death (suicide) or drugs and I think it's better for the drugs to be there for the person to bounce Off on

not too encourage abuse that usually will put the person in an even worse situation (Iv had this experience with heroin) but for some to smoke weed now and then or shooting up maybe once a moth or even smoking some dmt when times get rough but the ridiculous amount of pressure the government put on the eradication of drugs and not harm reduction like this forum suggests just reinforces how little people of power understand poverty

really grinds my gears

 

[theGirlWithBlueHair]

Isn't it amusing how all the safe and most effective drugs for these conditions are the abusable ones, whilst all the that aren't are the dangerous, and and less effective ones?

 

[Streetcow]

Isn't it amusing how all the safe and most effective drugs for these conditions are the abusable ones, whilst all the that aren't are the dangerous, and and less effective ones?

Erh perhaps your right there but I think it's a matter of discovery of safer drugs and usage I can think of quite a few that work just as effectively as there absuable counterparts

benzos-valerian
painkillers-weed
sleeping pills-valerian
opiates in general- certain strains of weed
anticolvusents-weed
depression meds (yes they have nasty withdrawal symptoms I have experience with that too)-Valerian,weed,PEA,certain MAOIs,most RIMA
Ect

its just a matter of finding them as I think research chemicals are the future of medicine and getting fucked up

-streetcow

 

[burn out]

Anecdotal experience is not evidence neither is the fact that it's been used for centuries. We smoked tobacco for centuries too before we learned it was bad. Just because something is natural and heavily used doesn't automatically mean it has validity, that is the importance of doing double blind studies and research. Placebo has a huge effect on people.

Who says tobacco is bad? I am going to show you how deceptive "double blind studies" can actually be using this example. Tobacco also, is a wonderful herb/medicine/teacher plant. The native americans used it for centuries in healing, religious rituals and for enjoyment. They did not experience the disease or addiction associated with it that we do.

You can use "studies" to prove that tobacco is bad, but that does not make it true. Let me ask you, do these "studies" account for the intention with which people use it? Do they account for the amount of knowledge of how to use plants and herbs the people who use it have? Do they account for cultural attitudes associated with the plantt? Do they account for the setting in which it is used (ei, out in nature vs near the entrance to buildings? Do they account for natural tobacco vs commerical tobacco with added chemicals? Of course not. One man's poison can be another man's cure. I have used tobacco for years with no addiction or health problems, for me tobacco has been a teacher plant as it was for the native Americans. Yes, its true americans have been harmed by their abuse of tobacco but does that mean tobacco is bad or maybe americans dont how to use it responsibly?

Now even if studies could account for all those variables, which they can't, they still wouldn't be trustworthy because the scientific research industry (especially as it pertains to medicine) is corrupt. watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWpdW4DugPg

you criticize me for posting my anecdotal experience as evidence. Did you read the OP? The OP asks for "anecdotal" experiences. I was simply providing what was asked for. And funnily enough, the experiences of random people on bluelight have been far more useful to me than scientific studies when it comes to learning about how to use drugs. Let me give you an example, years ago when suboxone came out the "scientific" literature recommended a dose of 8 mg two or three times a day or something ridiculous like that. I came on bluelight and people told me, from their experience (not studies, mind you) that was way more than was needed. Who was right? The bluelighters of course.

I am not saying you should just believe any claim you read on the internet. When someone posts an anecdotal experience, you note it with the understanding that your mileage may vary.

and I never said "valerian is good because its natural. It's true that I have found natural herbs to work way better with my mind and body than the crap churned out by the pharmaceutical industry, but thats another debate and not a claim I made in this thread.

 

[Slow_Mobius]

ahhhh I gotcha

and it really pisses me off how doctors will do anything to not prescribe narcotics to patients and how most people look down on drug users just because there lives need enhancing by drugs and they don't

you know sometimes the infinite wave of antidepressants antipsychotics and therapy doesn't work and just results in even deeper sorrow about the situation and the only salvation of the person in question is ethier death (suicide) or drugs and I think it's better for the drugs to be there for the person to bounce Off on

not too encourage abuse that usually will put the person in an even worse situation (Iv had this experience with heroin) but for some to smoke weed now and then or shooting up maybe once a moth or even smoking some dmt when times get rough but the ridiculous amount of pressure the government put on the eradication of drugs and not harm reduction like this forum suggests just reinforces how little people of power understand poverty

really grinds my gears

Very well said

 

[Streetcow]

Anecdotal experience is not evidence neither is the fact that it's been used for centuries. We smoked tobacco for centuries too before we learned it was bad. Just because something is natural and heavily used doesn't automatically mean it has validity, that is the importance of doing double blind studies and research. Placebo has a huge effect on people.

Who says tobacco is bad? I am going to show you how deceptive "double blind studies" can actually be using this example. Tobacco also, is a wonderful herb/medicine/teacher plant. The native americans used it for centuries in healing, religious rituals and for enjoyment. They did not experience the disease or addiction associated with it that we do.

You can use "studies" to prove that tobacco is bad, but that does not make it true. Let me ask you, do these "studies" account for the intention with which people use it? Do they account for the amount of knowledge of how to use plants and herbs the people who use it have? Do they account for cultural attitudes associated with the plantt? Do they account for the setting in which it is used (ei, out in nature vs near the entrance to buildings? Do they account for natural tobacco vs commerical tobacco with added chemicals? Of course not. One man's poison can be another man's cure. I have used tobacco for years with no addiction or health problems, for me tobacco has been a teacher plant as it was for the native Americans. Yes, its true americans have been harmed by their abuse of tobacco but does that mean tobacco is bad or maybe americans dont how to use it responsibly?

Now even if studies could account for all those variables, which they can't, they still wouldn't be trustworthy because the scientific research industry (especially as it pertains to medicine) is corrupt. watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWpdW4DugPg

you criticize me for posting my anecdotal experience as evidence. Did you read the OP? The OP asks for "anecdotal" experiences. I was simply providing what was asked for. And funnily enough, the experiences of random people on bluelight have been far more useful to me than scientific studies when it comes to learning about how to use drugs. Let me give you an example, years ago when suboxone came out the "scientific" literature recommended a dose of 8 mg two or three times a day or something ridiculous like that. I came on bluelight and people told me, from their experience (not studies, mind you) that was way more than was needed. Who was right? The bluelighters of course.

I am not saying you should just believe any claim you read on the internet. When someone posts an anecdotal experience, you note it with the understanding that your mileage may vary.

and I never said "valerian is good because its natural. It's true that I have found natural herbs to work way better with my mind and body than the crap churned out by the pharmaceutical industry, but thats another debate and not a claim I made in this thread.

I 100% and whole heartily agree on this

Its not the tobacco itself thats bad its the chemicals that are added it including but not limited to:

acetone,arsenic,(by products of some of the other chemicals being burned create formaldehyde and other poisons related to it),and others with tobacco having over 4000 chemicals added no wonder its getting a bad rap

but natural and also the shit has good properties including

the nicotine (wonderful chemical while it is a poison small amounts can have good impacts on the system), natural MAOIs (which treat depression,anxiety and many more neural imbalances),antioxidants,flavonoids,various nightshade alkaloids (not all are good but the ones in tobacco are relatively harmless unless consumed in large quantities at once which can and will wreck your system) and more

but the basic instructions for safe use is:
1- buy natural uncut tobacco or grow yourself
2- don't take in too large of quantities

all the bullshit thats put out from anti smoking groups is ridiculous and I whole heartily agree with your opinions burn out

-Streetcow

 

[Streetcow]

Very well said

thank you slow mobius

more people need to realize this and become more aware of the struggles of drug users

HARM REDUCTION FO LIFE

-Streetcow

 

[theGirlWithBlueHair]

Erh perhaps your right there but I think it's a matter of discovery of safer drugs and usage I can think of quite a few that work just as effectively as there absuable counterparts

benzos-valerian
painkillers-weed
sleeping pills-valerian
opiates in general- certain strains of weed
anticolvusents-weed
depression meds (yes they have nasty withdrawal symptoms I have experience with that too)-Valerian,weed,PEA,certain MAOIs,most RIMA
Ect

its just a matter of finding them as I think research chemicals are the future of medicine and getting fucked up

-streetcow

I meant that for treating the condition being talked about - benzodiazepines as opposed to antipsychotics. Or narcotics instead of anticonvulsants. I meant prescription products.

And there are things - actual benzodiazepine agonists - to treat insomnia that are OTC such as magnolia bark extract and baicalin that actually work, rather than something that is mostly ineffective for most people such as valerian root, as they are unaware of how to even purchase the product (ie buying the standardized extract)

 

[Streetcow]

I meant that for treating the condition being talked about - benzodiazepines as opposed to antipsychotics. Or narcotics instead of anticonvulsants. I meant prescription products.
And there are things - actual benzodiazepine agonists - to treat insomnia that are OTC such as magnolia bark extract and baicalin that actually work, rather than something that is mostly ineffective for most people such as valerian root, as they are unaware of how to even purchase the product (ie buying the standardized extract)

its true I really want to combat the statement but its absolutely true narcotics are a double edged sword while they can be used for getting high responsibly its almost impossible when using them for non high purposes it really is sad