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The science of a cold water extraction and some solubility questions.

posting in diff threads isn't going to get you the answer you want to hear tad, if you aren't filtering you are risking your life and liver, end of story, stop being a cheap skate and at least use a tshirt if you don't have a filter.
 
tadfish said:
I got question sometime lazy i pour off to layer and drink that once most sludge and shit settles at cold temps. sometiems i even freeze and cut in half thinking the most APAP that i can get in a cold solution of CWE without filtering is 1000mg per 100ml
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This train of thought is incorrect because the 1000mg per 100ml only refers to what is dissolved in the water. Much, much more APAP can be suspended in the water (notice the murky color.)
 
This thread is fuming, refluxing, side-product tar forming, RBFs full of carcinogens-explodingly full of fail.

It's a bloody standard painkiller cold water extraction, which has been covered to death, exhumed, and then covered to death again.

I've managed it with a glass of tap water, 2 pieces of kitchen roll, a cold porch in january and a 2L Coke bottle cut in half.

Go do one, or don't do one, but don't discuss it for days on end!
 
Nightmare Girl said:
Bullshit Rolls and this is Philip Crowley a trained doctor with a degree in chemistry and medicine. Juliet never wanted to get involved anyway but I will. I have read this thread and you guys are as thick as pig shit. Yes you''ll crap on about this and that but why don't you just admit you know nothing. Advanced? What a load of crap! I tell you, ask a pharmacist next time your in the chemist if codeine loses it's salt easily. They will tell you and no they won't refuse you service. Why shouldn't you know these things? So, so long and thanks for the boring conversation.

Philip.
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Not that it matters as the only thing that any info can be verified but there are a couple of points I'll extract from your post

1) As a rule, most doctors know very little about pharmacology - this isn't just from personal experience, but my other half works at a centre that gives advice to doctors regarding poisoning and she's said several times that she never ceases to be amazed by doctors ignorance of all mattters pharmacological.

2) There are plenty of people here with degrees, not that it really matters, because even post doctorate pharmacologists aren't correct all of the time. As they say, the proof of the pudding is in the eating - not the qualifications of the chef


Oh and don't get so abusive with the language or you'll find that the whole post disappears. By all means argue the point with others, but there's no need to resort to expletives & insults; besides they do rather reek of sour grapes that come when an arguement has been settled, but there's a bruised ego still left smarting
 
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tobala said:
Alexander Shulgin here and I just wanna say that Rolls, F&B, and Hammy are THE SHIT! ;)
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I'm waiting for the spirit of Albert Einstein to possess a computer terminal somewhere and then make a post under NG's name, throwing his opinion into the ring and definitively answering all & any questions about life, the universe and everything =D =D =D

It could happen y'know :D
 
i'd like to tack a quick question on here which has never been clarified afaik...

if you use say 1ml of water per 350mg compound tablet mixed to a paste, then force filter the paste (wring it out, push it through a filtered syringe, etc) will the codeine have saturated the solution, or will the binders etc interfere with codeine dissolving in such a small amount of water?

the concept of the tek is saturation from what i understand (also benefit of low volume for consumption). the method seems to work ime, but it's hard to gauge a codeine high objectively %)
 
I asked a similar question once, and the answer was, who knows? different compounds affect the way certain compounds dissolve in different ways. You are probably getting both dissolving at some rate, it'd probably be fairly complex to figure out what the actual ratios are as well, especially as you are using a syringe and not properly mixing them in water.
 
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rolls said:
posting in diff threads isn't going to get you the answer you want to hear tad, if you aren't filtering you are risking your life and liver, end of story, stop being a cheap skate and at least use a tshirt if you don't have a filter.
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I did ask u and have other things to do than study codeine and study only codeine threads. i did have a long chat with u about this.
peace
 
tadfish said:
I did ask u and have other things to do than study codeine and study only codeine threads. i did have a long chat with u about this.
peace
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I still told you filtering was the only option before you posted that.
 
I got some filter papers so don't fret i not even sing codeine the question was more for others i am concerned about. I used to get codeine get it to layer at cold temps filter then freeze then unfreeeze filter and get cold n drink. paranoid but i recon it was safest.
better than just filtering straight away cause it all get blocked in filter paper and the finer the filter paper the slower it goes and since the police took all my chem gear and extraction gear. even filter papers i am a good boy and don't do silly things like have chem gear around.
oh i dreamt of having an old vacuum pump to filter and use a good old solvent and evap and get pure codeine. I am saying too much. anyways.

I am too P_d waiting for Albert to come into my mind on some K or DMT trip and tell me all the answers and secrets of the universe.
 
rolls said:
I asked a similar question once, and the answer was, who knows? different compounds affect the way certain compounds dissolve in different ways. You are probably getting both dissolving at some rate, it'd probably be fairly complex to figure out what the actual ratios are as well, especially as you are using a syringe and not properly mixing them in water.
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ok thanks. well judging from the gummy nature of the extract i get using the syringe method, i know that coating and binders are dissolving along with the codeine. i just wonder if they interfering at low volumes, and what volume of water would be optimal.

has anyone ever run proper tests on the various teks to see how much codeine actually makes it through a CWE? i've heard of weighing the powder once evaporated, but who knows how much filler is contributing to the weight. would it be difficult to do an accurate scientific analysis on the contents of a CWE and see what the ratios are at different volumes of water? rolls i know you've said it would be, but i'm just wondering what it would entail. such a test would also be handy for ruling on the activated charcoal debate, as ac is reported to rid caffeine from a CWE but leave the majority of the opiate (has been argued forever due to lack of evidence).
 
tadfish said:
freezing
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at what point does the codeine recrystalize though? that would be counter productive, you'd have to warm it enough to get it to redissolve, right? i know if i leave a CWE in the fridge overnight, there are solid bits suspended by morning. i'm not sure exactly what the bits are, but something falls out of the clear filtered solution if it's left chilled for long enough (this is with a low volume, like 15ml).
 
http://www.chemicalforums.com/index.php?topic=27345.msg103253#msg103253

This was the original question I asked, I figured if anyone would know, then these guys would.

colors said:
has anyone ever run proper tests on the various teks to see how much codeine actually makes it through a CWE? i've heard of weighing the powder once evaporated, but who knows how much filler is contributing to the weight. would it be difficult to do an accurate scientific analysis on the contents of a CWE and see what the ratios are at different volumes of water? rolls i know you've said it would be, but i'm just wondering what it would entail. such a test would also be handy for ruling on the activated charcoal debate, as ac is reported to rid caffeine from a CWE but leave the majority of the opiate (has been argued forever due to lack of evidence).
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I'm sure there are some uni/phd chem students here with access to the correct equipment for doing so, if anyone could do it, it would be them.
 
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A quick question guys, and i hope you could help me. I crushed 16 tablets of Paracetamol Codeine (Paracetamol 500mg, Codeine Phosphate 8mg), did the Cold Water Extraction. I drank extractions. But what I'd like to know is that, what are signs that might lead to me over-dosing on paracetamol, because I've read that max dose is 4000mg? And how long till the symptoms start to show
 
theredundant said:
A quick question guys, and i hope you could help me. I crushed 16 tablets of Paracetamol Codeine (Paracetamol 500mg, Codeine Phosphate 8mg), did the Cold Water Extraction. I drank extractions. But what I'd like to know is that, what are signs that might lead to me over-dosing on paracetamol, because I've read that max dose is 4000mg? And how long till the symptoms start to show
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Not really the right thread for that question, post it in the CWE megathread.
 
First i frozen some CWE to have later now even after double filtering and cold crush and separate. Then i freeze the stuff again that came out clean when i filtered.
now when frozen there is white powder on top like powder seperate.
then defrost and some stuff, sludge, white shit on bottom so what is that binders andw hat is that stuff on top.
I wonder what re freezing it does its seems to get more APAP out i think i make binder bound up so i can filter out.
Or is that white stuff codeine?
 
Just a quick question on the harm reduction side if I may? I've seen it mentioned in one of the hundred or so page-long threads on CWEs but never noticed an accepted answer. If one were aiming for minimal toxicity with a CWE, would it be beneficial to use say 50/50 APAP-Codeine and Ibuprofen-Codeine tablets?

I realise Paracetamol and Ibuprofen are harmful in different ways, but is there any benefit in mixing or using one over the other?

I also saw a mention (in a government link of all things) of less Ibuprofen being soluble in solutions with lower ph. Any truth to that? (Sorry the last Chemistry I did was in school over a decade ago now).

-Santa Claus (doctorate in reindeer wrangling)
 
yep i down that using ibuprofen one day and APAP the next except i fucked my stomach and its easier and safer to use APAP tablets.
why can no one answer the questions i ask and we have threads asking the same qquestions that a fuckin google search or this search engine can answer. fucking hell
 
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