US Politics The Mueller Investigation - report is out

[Nicomorphinist]

Isn't screaming and crying about Modi and Putin and Rouhani, and the two major US parties having major institutes that help out with elections around the world, and all the American fingers in the pie trying to get rid of Netanyahu and everything the US media does including lying about shit "meddling in elections" and so forth? Double standards and Slavophobia -- someone would have found a way to do it if HRC were elected instead too, because starting the Cold War again is even more profitable than owning a rehab clinic. Anderson Cooper should be making little rocks into big ones for all the false crap he put out about Syria over the last eight years . . . people actually died because of that shit.

 

[JGrimez]

Which is what trump is. And the sooner we get rid of him the better.

Why? Because you don't like his personality? Such selfishness. He's doing good for the country. Results speak for themselves. There are more important things in the world.

I'd never have thought I'd miss George W Bush.

Such US-centrism and American exceptionalism. You know who doesn't miss Bush? The 500,000 women and children that suffered and died in Iraq under the sanctions his admin enacted. Or the Iraqi people in general whose country was destroyed.

A more tolerable personality > war crimes?

Right..

 

[somnilicious]

Isn't screaming and crying about Modi and the two major US parties having major institutes that help out with elections around the world and everything the US media does including lying about shit "meddling in elections" and so forth? Double standards and Slavophobia -- someone would have found a way to do it if HRC were elected instead too, because starting the Cold War again is even more profitable than owning a rehab clinic. Anderson Cooper should be making little rocks into big ones for all the false crap he put out about Syria over the last eight years . . . people actually died because of that shit.

We're talking about actual crimes committed by a standing President not hypotheticals from a, what if presidency, and drawing attention away from those crimes by bringing up imagined hypotheticals and stuff said by a citizen, political, news pundit is besides the point. It's rather like saying the kettle isn't black because there is a pot and a spoon that may or not be black, if given the chance.

Russia is a hostile power that covertly, influenced our elections through espionage and lies to weaken us and advance their agenda.

There was a time in this country when we tried to stand for truth because it was morally right. Now we fall for lies to prove who is more morally righteos in being wrong.

 

[Nicomorphinist]

I am not sure how closely Mr Trump could resemble Der Führer because of Mr Trump's short attention span, but some of it all does seem to look familiar to a lot of people right or wrong . . . There is also a comparison to Germany 1923 and what happened to the Hungarian Pengő in 1946 . . . one of these days it may take a wheelbarrow of cash to buy an 8-ball of C-Jam . . .

The amount of hot air in the equity markets reminds me of the part in Fear & Loathing In Las Vegas in which HST put 75 psi of air in the tyres and claimed they were special tyres from Sandoz Laboratories:

". . . they could take 100"
--Please don't do that here
"Not now. I want to see how it handles with 75 . . ."

there was enough borrowing from the future for political featherbedding for there to be enough blame to go around in Washington DC and Wall Street; they couldn't wait a few bloody weeks and let the market form a natural bottom in 2009, For people who follow retracements, the bottom of the post-1929 crash was 42.33 in July 1933 I think it was, on the Dow Jones Industrial Average, and, if one works backwards and calculates the average for the Panic of 1893, that was started with a 25+ per cent crash in a single day to right about 30 points. Going 38.2, 50, 61.8 per cent of the way back there would make quite a mess.

 

[TheLoveBandit]

I don't have time to go back through and find all the specific quotes but a lot of you guys obviously didn't watch this, haven't read the report and have no idea as to what is actually going on. This article succinctly goes over the evidence, as per the Mueller report, regarding Trumps involvement in direct obstruction.

Thank you for the links. I obviously have my view, but readily admit not having read the report. However, a cursory look at your links proves bite-sized to get a handle on the obstruction as viewed from a perspective that differs from mine. As such, I'll refrain from posting in this thread until I've read them, so thank you.

I agree with what Jess said

Lol...it's like the mantra most folks end up saying in here repeatedly.

 

[somnilicious]

I am not sure how closely Mr Trump could resemble Der Führer because of Mr Trump's short attention span, but some of it all does seem to look familiar to a lot of people right or wrong . . . There is also a comparison to Germany 1923 and what happened to the Hungarian Pengő in 1946 . . . one of these days it may take a wheelbarrow of cash to buy an 8-ball of C-Jam . . .

The amount of hot air in the equity markets reminds me of the part in Fear & Loathing In Las Vegas in which HST put 75 psi of air in the tyres and claimed they were special tyres from Sandoz Laboratories:

". . . they could take 100"
--Please don't do that here
"Not now. I want to see how it handles with 75 . . ."

there was enough borrowing from the future for political featherbedding for there to be enough blame to go around in Washington DC and Wall Street; they couldn't wait a few bloody weeks and let the market form a natural bottom in 2009, For people who follow retracements, the bottom of the post-1929 crash was 42.33 in July 1933 I think it was, on the Dow Jones Industrial Average, and, if one works backwards and calculates the average for the Panic of 1893, that was started with a 25+ per cent crash in a single day to right about 30 points. Going 38.2, 50, 61.8 per cent of the way back there would make quite a mess.

Thanks for not getting up in arms over my statement Nico. I had actually deleted my post because I didn't want to cause a furor(no pun intended) by comparing his rise to that guy that I shall not name but to me the similarities are uncanny.

I am really trying to stay away from over inflated hyperbole because I don't want to cause divisions or push people away. This is extremely important to me. I believe the threat to be real and I believe this election to be a matter of national security. Trump is a danger to America and our allys in so many ways.

Unfortunately I don't like many of the Democratic candidates or their agendas either. We need to get away from identity(tribal) politics on both sides. We have more commonality than differences.

I am extremely torn because I have deeply conservative tendencies and I am often disgusted with stuff coming from a lot of the left. I am going to reserve final judgement but it would take an extreme candidate from the left for me to vote for Trump.

 

[JGrimez]

Russia is a hostile power that covertly, influenced our elections through espionage and lies to weaken us and advance their agenda.

To be fair, other countries did much worse. Israel, China and possibly others did more than Russian to "influence" elections. Also what evidence do you have, is $4,700 of FB ads worthy of grandstanding about the evils of Russia? Definitely not, it's propaganda. If I fart in a stadium, I'm "influencing" the smell of that stadium but is it significant at all? Democrats would say yes - I've just chemically attacked everyone in the stadium. This is the equivalent of how they've acted with Trump and there's no disputing it sanely now after Mueller's embarrassing testimony.

There was a time in this country when we tried to stand for truth because it was morally right. Now we fall for lies to prove who is more morally righteos in being wrong.

Agreed, the lie (which I could tell was a lie from Day 1 based on the timing) was that Trump was a Russian agent, that Trump was colluding with Putin, that Russians significantly altered the election, that Russian activity was worth all of that media hype. ALL LIES. Many people believed this bullshit because they simply don't like Trump and they lack discernment. The truth be damned. I was accused of spreading "conspiracy theories" for a year on this site for telling the truth.

 

[JGrimez]

Thanks for not getting up in arms over my statement Nico. I had actually deleted my post because I didn't want to cause a furor(no pun intended) by comparing his rise to that guy that I shall not name but to me the similarities are uncanny.

I am really trying to stay away from over inflated hyperbole because I don't want to cause divisions or push people away. This is extremely important to me. I believe the threat to be real and I believe this election to be a matter of national security. Trump is a danger to America and our allys in so many ways.

Unfortunately I don't like many of the Democratic candidates or their agendas either. We need to get away from identity(tribal) politics on both sides. We have more commonality than differences.

I am extremely torn because I have deeply conservative tendencies and I am often disgusted with stuff coming from a lot of the left. I am going to reserve final judgement but it would take an extreme candidate from the left for me to vote for Trump.

Israel loves Trump. Jews more or less love Trump (it's split but I'd say the majority). Why is Trump like Hitler? Who is he planning to genocide?

Such an amusingly ridiculous opinion.

 

[JessFR]

I am extremely torn because I have deeply conservative tendencies and I am often disgusted with stuff coming from a lot of the left. I am going to reserve final judgement but it would take an extreme candidate from the left for me to vote for Trump.

Well I sure hope we don't end up with an extreme left candidate.

I think the democrats can definitely win against Trump in the next election. But not if they put up someone like Hillary Clinton again.

An ultra left or widely disliked candidate would be handing Trump reelection. They need to put up a moderate.

Those far on the left are likely to vote Democrat anyway, especially with Trump as the incumbent. They need to make sure their candidate isn't completely unacceptable to people further in the middle. People who aren't strongly left but don't like Trump either.

And I'm sure many people like that exist because I don't see Trump as a true republican. He is his own ideology that's in an alliance with the Republicans, but he's not one.

 

[JGrimez]

I think the democrats can definitely win against Trump in the next election

?????????

Fuck that's really funny. This opinion has no basis in reality.

I also understand the irony here as many laughed the same way about Trump winning (not me I won $200 bet), but Trump did have a good chance back then it was only the MSM and their zombie followers that thought he didn't.

But name one Democrat that can beat Trump? The party is so fragmented, and all of the candidates make even Trump look presidential.

 

[JessFR]

?????????

Fuck that's really funny. This opinion has no basis in reality.

I also understand the irony here as many laughed the same way about Trump winning (not me I won $200 bet), but Trump did have a good chance back then it was only the MSM and their zombie followers that thought he didn't.

But name one Democrat that can beat Trump? The party is so fragmented, and all of the candidates make even Trump look presidential.

We've still got over a year till the next election, that's a long time in politics.

I'd rather not speculate, but I believe it's doable.

A lot of people don't like trump, on the left and right. So long as there isn't a viable ultra left candidate around to split the left wing vote, I think it's a safe bet that the far left will vote against trump no matter who's put up. Plus theres quite a few people like me who aren't strongly left or right, but hate trump so much they'd vote for nearly anyone else.

So the question is getting enough of the more moderate voters on the left and right to feel theres an acceptable Democrat candidate that they'd rather take a chance on than trump. The kind of people who don't despise trump, but don't love him either and would like an acceptable alternative.

I think that's doable, though I'm not sure who would be best for that position.

I believe it's possible to beat trump in 2020,but the democrats can't put up someone like Hillary Clinton again. They need to accept a compromise in a more moderate or center right candidate who can appeal to center to center right voters who don't like or trust trump, and want an excuse to get rid of him.

 

[somnilicious]

To be fair, other countries did much worse. Israel, China and possibly others did more than Russian to "influence" elections. Also what evidence do you have, is $4,700 of FB ads worthy of grandstanding about the evils of Russia? Definitely not, it's propaganda. If I fart in a stadium, I'm "influencing" the smell of that stadium but is it significant at all? Democrats would say yes - I've just chemically attacked everyone in the stadium. This is the equivalent of how they've acted with Trump and there's no disputing it sanely now after Mueller's embarrassing testimony.



Agreed, the lie (which I could tell was a lie from Day 1 based on the timing) was that Trump was a Russian agent, that Trump was colluding with Putin, that Russians significantly altered the election, that Russian activity was worth all of that media hype. ALL LIES. Many people believed this bullshit because they simply don't like Trump and they lack discernment. The truth be damned. I was accused of spreading "conspiracy theories" for a year on this site for telling the truth.

Read the Mueller report. I don't have time to do a Mueller report for dummies. There is nothing I can say to you and I'm not going to waste my time.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Dems face a serious victory lap coming up. I think Trump will get re-elected but Repubs will slip up on house/senate races.

 

[cduggles]

This article is by Benjamin Wittes, who is a journalist who covers a lot of law.

It’s balanced, and yet you can read it and still walk away with your same opinion. ?

I have read the report and watched most of the testimony yesterday, and I think this is a good start.

Five Things I Learned From the Mueller Report

A careful reading of the dense document delivers some urgent insights.

www.theatlantic.com

 

[cduggles]

New Senate Intelligence report shows "extensive" Russia 2016 election interference

It also notes that Russia targeted voting systems in all 50 states.

www.vox.com

 

[JGrimez]

Read the Mueller report. I don't have time to do a Mueller report for dummies. There is nothing I can say to you and I'm not going to waste my time.

The Mueller report is already for dummies. After all those years of hysteria, there is zero evidence that Russians significantly altered the results of the US general election. The purpose of lying and saying that Russians altered the results was a way to deligitimize Trump's win ("Trump didn't win the popular vote, Trump had foreign help" etc)

It kills Democrats to admit that Trump legitimately won and not enough people bought their BS.

 

[JGrimez]

We've still got over a year till the next election, that's a long time in politics.

I'd rather not speculate, but I believe it's doable.

A lot of people don't like trump, on the left and right. So long as there isn't a viable ultra left candidate around to split the left wing vote, I think it's a safe bet that the far left will vote against trump no matter who's put up. Plus theres quite a few people like me who aren't strongly left or right, but hate trump so much they'd vote for nearly anyone else.

So the question is getting enough of the more moderate voters on the left and right to feel theres an acceptable Democrat candidate that they'd rather take a chance on than trump. The kind of people who don't despise trump, but don't love him either and would like an acceptable alternative.

I think that's doable, though I'm not sure who would be best for that position.

I believe it's possible to beat trump in 2020,but the democrats can't put up someone like Hillary Clinton again. They need to accept a compromise in a more moderate or center right candidate who can appeal to center to center right voters who don't like or trust trump, and want an excuse to get rid of him.

Hey look I laugh but any thing's possible and there's still a bit of time. But as things are going now - they don't have much of a chance at all. They lied too much - they stated confidently that Trump winning would be a disaster for America - and it arguably has been the exact opposite (it definitely wasn't the disaster they were promising).

So why would people vote against positive change and progress? And why would you vote for people who have blatantly lied to you about so many important things for so long?

Not to mention Trump's ability to play the media and make Dems look like they keep suffering losses. If they want a chance of winning they should stop talking about Trump at once and start pushing (sane) policies.

 

[JGrimez]

This rotten mob are going down. I just hope it happens soon - it seems to be shaping up nicely.

Sorry I saw this on Page1 and had to quote it.

---------
"Adam Schiff lectured Mueller and viewers on the immorality of seeking foreign help to hurt one’s political opponent.

Two years ago Schiff eagerly tried to get naked photos of Trump from two Russian pranksters whom he believed were Ukrainian officials"

 

[Xorkoth]

The Mueller report is already for dummies. After all those years of hysteria, there is zero evidence that Russians significantly altered the results of the US general election.

The report clearly states that ~$1.2M per week was spent by Russians to influence American politics. What disturbs me is that Trump supporters are so fixated on Trump having legitimately won that they choose to pretend this didn't happen... nah, Russia's harmless, they spent $4,700 total, they're totally not trying to undermine our country so they can firmly surpass us globally.

I'm willing to accept that Trump didn't knowingly collude with the Russians. But I'm not willing to ignore an alarming reality about the intentions and actions of the Russians.

 

[JGrimez]

2019, Wired: Trump Must Be A Russian Agent… (where we were told…ahem: “It would be rather embarrassing… if Robert Mueller were to declare that the president isn’t an agent of Russian intelligence.”)

Embarrassing indeed.

“The walls are closing in!” – we were assured just about every 24 hours.

Not The Onion: NY Times Urges Trump To Establish Closer Ties With Moscow

Cue ultra scary red Trump-Kremlin montage.

theduran.com