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The Ethics of Fronting

K

k.dre

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 20, 2010
Messages
76
Location
lowell ma
This should have been a straight forward front. Everyone does it. Supplier A provides customer B with X amount of material for Y dollars. A couple days later custie B pays supplier A, Y dollars for X amount of material. But my situation is not as black and white as that.

A supplier had become a pretty good acquaintance over the the past few months, almost a friend even. At my age and experience I should know that these 2 don't mix, especially if he was a supplier first.

So the supplier had been fronting the material for the past 9 days. He had been keeping a tally of the amount I owed him and now I'm am able to repay him.

The problem is that for more than half the period in question, he dropped the quantity by about half though he represented it as the full amount. The material in question is very small to begin so it's a little difficult to notice changes of weight, though when you looked closer you could notice a change in weight. I visually noticed the change and I even weighed the material and logged the weight. There were times that the amount in question wouldn't even be half of the typical expected amount, half would haven been rounding up.

I said something to him. I just said "hey man, they are looking light", to which he wouldn't really respond or just change the subject. I mentioned something 3 times. I didn't want to accuse him of ripping me off, though maybe I should have.

If you said to me "you didn't confront him because you didn't want to lose a supplier who fronted you, otherwise you would get sick", you wouldn't be totally mistaken.

Having said all that, when I go to pay him should I only pay him what I think is a fair portion of the amount he think is owed. In other words, should I only pay him for the weight actually supplied rather than weight he claimed was supplied?

I can completely cut ties with this guy no problem. All I have to do is avoid his neighborhood, which isn't too hard because I live a good 30 mins away and he doesn't drive nor know where I live.

What would you do?

What is ethically correct?

What should I do?

- thanks
 
Sounds like he ripped you off. Show him the evidence and pay him for what he gave you.
 
The only problem with that is at this point it's my word against his. For all he knows I could have made up those numbers, ya know?
 
^^^ there might not be any evidence to show...

I think it was kind of your fault for letting it slide...i know what you're saying sometimes it hard/weird or whatever to straight up tell the dude that he ripped you off, but if it really wasn't possible to straight up tell him that the material was light, then you should have stopped there. I would have cut connection right there before he did it again. Try to confront him when you gotta pay him and either he'll understand, or he won't. If it's the latter, don't do business with him anymore. Because that's shady as fuck.
 
You're talkin about dope then right? I mean maybe he straight up didn't know, I don't know where your at in the US but some places dope dealers buy their shit already bagged up (like stamps) I mean if you didn't straight up confront him I'd just pay him. It's kinda hard to judge the situation when you're bein so vague cuz if you were buyin like grams and he was baggin it up and givin you half grams, I mean that's a different story.

Around here though you might get 8 stamps that are super fat, and then 2 that are like fuckin nothin in the same bundle. Same dope, same name, same supplier its just the nature of the game.

Plus even though you think you can avoid dude I mean you never know yo, I don't know hard your boy is or whatever but the last thing I want is to be at the fuckin mall or somethin with my girl like 3 years from now and some mufucker starts lickin shots at me cuz I burnt him 3 years ago.

And you never know next time you might be sick and broke and even some shitty bags on the front is better then no bags at all. I'd pay him but let him know shit was fucked up, he might just break you off somethin.
 
should've got got him to weigh it up then and there..
spose it werent possible though..

when you pay up tell him you know you were shorted and pay just barely over what you gots worth.
 
B & S - you make excellent points and I was almost convinced that yeah I should pay the amount he claimed to have sold me. And yeah, I was intentionally trying to be vague but I am talking about dope and I do buy in bundles. I do know that bag to bag can fluctuate but he clearly was cutting a bundle and spreading it out over 2 bundles, I have the numbers to show it. He didn't even add new cut, he just rebagged it. Though for my safety, I'm glad he didn't add cut.

I say almost because I went over to his place to pay a portion of what I owe him and that's when I read your response and was like "yeah, that's the right thing to do, to pay the full amount and then call him on his shit, and then take my business elsewhere from now on".

But while I was there I asked him to pick up a gram of some coke. What he sold me was something that was both light in weight and very very very stepped on. There is too much cut to even IV this coke - it just leaves a slurry in the spoon. The gum test just leaves very mild numbing. And before I ready-ed mine for IV I asked if he wanted some, enough to cook up a hit of it, and he said yes. But he didn't cook his while I was prepping mine, instead he stepped out to get something to eat. In the past he alllllways did it at the same time (I know that isn't necessarily indicative of prior knowledge, but it's suspect behavior).

I still left him his portion of the gram. When he came back I told him "that it was $60 worth of shit, it just left a slurry in the spoon; I couldn't even use it" and he just did the same thing he always does, "oh uh uh uh. ok. so, hey can you drop me at the place so i can get some dust"?"

So in light of that I'm back to I'm paying for what he actually sold me instead of what he claimed to have sold me. He's got some balls to do that while I'm repaying the front (I would have to repay him over the course of 2 days).

titstypedthis - yeah, he doesn't weigh it in front of you. In fact I've never had a dealer weigh in front of me - doesn't matter what I was buying, they've never weighed for me. Maybe I'm odd man out with that??
 
its your fault for keeping going back to him and buying more of his shit when you know you are getting ripped off and he knows he is ripping you off.
 
So your boy is baggin up bundles him self or you mean he's buyin 2 bundles, doin 1, then puttin half the other one into a bundle full of his empties? That sounds like some nut ass fiend shit yo, if your boy is that strung out I would def be like look yo if you want this bread your gon have to break me off and if he don't then fuck it. I mean any time I ever had a front and the bags were super small I at least knew for sure it wasn't my boy dippin in the bags cuz he would never fuck with d, so I always paid and said somethin about it when I paid, usually his response would be to break me off somethin for free.
 
Up until about 2 weeks ago I was getting stamped green bags. Since then the bags have changed to plain white bags, though I know the guy above him and he still has stamped green bags.

My guy doesn't do dope, he only does dust (I'm sure about this). So he's taking bundles and rebagging it so that he gets 2 bundles out of 1 - doubling his profits.

He only has 3 or 4 customers and I don't know if he is selling light bags to them as well or just to me. I suspect he's only selling the light bundles to me. All his other customers buy smaller amounts; they don't buy bundles.

Like I've said, I've brought it up a couple times that the bags were small. When I bring it up he is suddenly too dusted to act like he knows what I'm talking about let alone know what's going on around him.

Besides fronting me for a quite a few days, he's never "broken me off a piece". Shit a little more than a week ago either he or his guy was using some funky ass cut that made the dope reallly white, but what was worse, it left this hard crust-like residue on the spoon. It scared me to inject this and I told him and I didn't get more than 1 bundle of that product and then I said I was going to have to go elsewhere and then all a sudden his product changed back. Now that I think about it, this is also about the time the the bundles started looking smaller....hmmmm.......maybe he was trying to cut so the bags didn't look small. But now that I bitched about the whack and maybe dangerous cut, he stopped using cut and just left the bags looking light. I guess he hoped I wouldn't notice or that he could just ignore it.
 
this happened to me the other day, but it was only one front. dude told me he had fire for a good price. I paid him about half up front, got the sack, and could tell it was tiny. got home and weighed it out, 0.4g. I called him a million times to tell him what was up but finally gave up and texted him "this isn't even worth what I paid you for, I'm not giving you any more cash"

he later told me the sacks got switched up, but I'm not sure I believe him. going to stay away from him unless I really need to

the problem with your situation is it's over a longer period of time, and it's stamps. if you consistently told him every time it's light, or even better, told him the actual weight you got, it would be reasonable to pay him less. if you only did it once or twice, though, you should pay the full amount for security
 
if you agreed to certain amount to pay then you should pay that much

if the quantity was bad nobody was forcing you to buy it, you agreed to keep buying it after you saw what you were getting and continued
 
take your own scale, as soon as he hands you the bag/bundle set it down on the coffee table and weigh em up, how could he argue then?

also, fuck getting consistently short sacks, find someone else man.
 
^ because there isn't a standard weight for bags in the northeast.
 
If it happens only once it's alright, shit happens and I let it slide. However if I was in your situation I would have definitely called him out on it the second time he shorted me. I would tell him to give me more or I'll just pay for what he gave me (I'm assuming you could have done that, seeing as how he wasn't just a random dealer, you had somewhat established a type of friend-like relationship, so it shouldn't have been too weird to say).

And you know what, I know how difficult it can be to ask a dealer to weigh out his stuff in front of you; most times they won't even have their scale on them (or claim not to), so whenever I'm picking up something I bring my scale with me. I've even done this to first time deals (never met the person before). Once he gives it to me I just say straight up "Listen man, I don't mean any disrespect by this so don't take offense, but I'm gonna weigh it out right here. As long as you give me a proper count consider me your new customer."

I would never say "Yo man that shit looks short" and bust out my scale on a first deal. I always say it in a calm and respectful way, like I mentioned above.
 
yeah the weight of the bags around here fluctuate alot. sometimes a bundle could only way a half g but the dope is good enuf to make up for that so I dont mind. But if you know for a fact that the guy is shorting you tell him whats good if he ignores you just raise your voice a bit and be like yo these are short either stop shorting me or im going elsewhere and leave it at that. He will either let you go or stop shorting you. What do you got to lose if you said you dont need him.
 
Yeah I pretty much fucked myself with this one. I did call him on on it a few times (4 times total now), today included (today was a small coke purchase), and he never has even offered to "look into it" or any semblance of trying to make the weight right.

In a way it seems right, contractually and ethically, to pay him for what he agreed to sell. He agreed to sell me for 10 bundles over the course of 10 days for xx dollars. In fact that is what he sold me.

However, 7 of those bundles were clearly and definitely only half the weight of the first 3 bundles. So it was my mistake for not agreeing to weight, rather than quantity. But since we agreed on count rather than weight, I get screwed.

By that same token however we never stated that I was to pay in US dollars. So it would be ok to pay for 10 bundles with xx dollars but in Peruvian soles. Right?

(I'm playing a bit of devil's advocate here)

PS - I do have a new guy; I'm back to getting good weight and good product. 3 bags will knock me over whereas I swear I could have shot the whole bundle of the other stuff and barely broken a junkie's sweat.

added "contractually and ethically"
 
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I like how you go about it Tiesto, I'll keep that in mind.

As of today I've paid him for 70% of what I owe him. I'm still debating whether I should just ditch him and blow him off and not pay him that balance. Maybe it'll make me get my shit straight so I won't run down to that area to get bundles.

I'm having a problem of doing right by him and the situation while he gets to be the greedy asshole who took advantage of me and the situation and didn't think twice about fucking me about of money.
 
Id forget about him man, I dont know if this guy is crazy and would shoot or stab someone over something minor, if thats the case, pay him and leave otherwise I wouldnt pay him. He doesnt know where you live. This guy sounds dangerous, he doesnt do dope so who knows what he's cutting it with, find someone who knows what theyre doing.
 
Tommyboy said:
^ because there isn't a standard weight for bags in the northeast.
Click to expand...

well that sucks balls man

i mean a .07 or .08 amongst .1's is understandable but the way your saying it is the dealer is literally deciding your dose for the day.


meh:|
 
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