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The Dive Social v. CHEERS! 🍻

One happened due to systemic racism and police brutality.

The other happened because Trump is a sore loser and lied about losing.

Storming the heart of our democracy seems like a more noteworthy event than some random courthouse to me.
 
alasdairm said:
but breaking and entering and taking over the u.s. capitol is not?

it's only insurrection when the people doing it are the with which you disagree, i guess?

alasdair
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So then every protest is an insurrection then ? And capturing holding and making demands would be what most people consider a insurrection
 
All social movements, if they get large enough, involve violence and/or property damage to some degree...and that's true whether we're talking about movements on the left (such as Occupy Wall Street, the "alter globalization" movement of the 1990s, the environmental movement and radical iterations of it, etc.) or right (the anti-abortion movement, the militia movement from the 1990s to the present day, the "stop the steal" movement with its most famous action being January 6th, etc.)

One thing that separates BLM from those other mentions though was the sheer size of it in the USA during 2020

www.dailymail.co.uk

BLM protests may be the largest in U.S. history

The figures come from four recent polls - including one released by Civis Analytics - that found that between 15 million people to 26 million people have been apart of demonstrations.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk

So with a movement of that size, especially a street movement...no one should be surprised at all that there's violence and destruction that accompanies it as an unavoidable symptom, but obviously a significant degree of variation across a country as large and diverse as the United States.

Really I don't have a problem with violence as such, as this country was born and reborn in violence during its revolution and civil war. Most of the time when I condemn violence its for utilitarian reasons more than anything, i.e. violence will hurt a movement more than help it in most cases. But the justifications and underlying causes of violence are very important I think, that's why I'm more sympathetic to the BLM folks than I am the "stop the steal" people, because I think the concerns the former group often brought up, involving police brutality and incipient authoritarianism in this country, are more important than Donald Trump serving another term in office.
 
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Pretty crazy that after the Supreme Court decision left wing pro abortion groups like Jane's Revenge have been commiting arson on pregnancy centers that supply free clothes to mothers, while at the same time the feds have warned about right wing attacks against abortion clinics, the opposite of what is actually happening
 
Jerry Atrick said:
Well you specifically attacked a twitter statement attached to a video without watching the video that gives it context. So at best you were just giving an uneducated opinion of the tweet. I honestly don't know what goes on in your mind, so I don't know if the video footage would help you understand or not. But the video does go hand in hand with the twitter statement, so to condemn one without watching the other shows you don't care about the whole story before attacking it.

Sorry to appear American-centered. This kind of goes back to the video though, which you have not watched. And like I said in my post you quoted, I know racism exists in other countries but I don't know if other countries have similar movements to BLM.

Sorry for the long post but the subject is complex and needed explaining. And my post did contain answers to your question, which may have been lost due of the length of the post.

Once again, the story is more complex than what you are saying or what the mainstream media reported. For instance, in Minneapolis, Minnesota, where the riots began, the BLM protestors were PEACEFUL marchers simply walking down the street holding signs. I watched a video on reddit of the first instigator of property damage, it was a white guy with a hammer who broke the windows of an AutoZone store. The PEACEFUL BLM marchers begged him to stop but he threatened them with the hammer until they backed away. A woman came forward and stated that the masked white guy who started all the property damage was her ex-boyfriend who was an off duty police officer. His motive for property damage was to make the BLM protests appear to be violent and once the property damage started, young people unaffiliated with the BLM movement began burning and looting as an opportunistic means to cause trouble. These types of things happened all over, where peaceful BLM protests exploded into riots and looting that had nothing to do with the original protests. But the conservatives and mainstream media made a direct connection with BLM protestors and all the property damage so it appeared that one started the other.

I'm sorry you did not follow my comparison. I did however say that it was an analogy and the rich vs poor had NOTHING to do race. That's what an analogy is meant to be; a comparison of two different things. It was meant to compare the "all lives" vs "some lives" argument without race playing a factor. It had absolutely nothing to do with rich people supposedly being white as you say.

I think Kanye West is stupid for many reasons above and beyond wearing the T shirt. I feel the T shirt fiasco is just further reinforcement of his stupidity. I think he is stupid for how he stalks and lies about his ex wife Kim Kardashian on twitter and instagram. I can't stand the Kardashians or anything they stand for but he is airing his dirty laundry in public and it only makes him look bad. I think he is stupid (and racist) for the antisemitic comments he made last week that got him banned from twitter and instagram. If you haven't seen that, here is the quote:

I’m a bit sleepy tonight but when I wake up I’m going death con 3 On JEWISH PEOPLE. The funny thing is I actually can’t be Anti Semitic because black people are actually Jew also You guys have toyed with me and tried to black ball anyone whoever opposes your agenda.

Of course he claims the statement is not antisemitic but Jewish groups feel otherwise and I take their word over his.

Now that I've typed all this, maybe I'm off base calling him stupid because he is clearly and admittedly mentally ill. However, I'm mentally ill and I don't say racist things all the time nor do I stalk anyone. Maybe he is stupid for not taking his meds, I don't know. I guess I should be more sensitive to people whose perceptions are not currently grounded in reality but damn, he makes the rest of us people experiencing mental illness look bad.
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I'll get back when i've made the time to find and watch this video.

I thought it was possible to discuss the fact "famous black man wearing WLM shirt" without watching a video, but maybe the video has some crucial details.

If i were you and the video did contain crucial details that supported the case you're making, i would just describe those crucial details - especially if i was gonna spend energy on lengthy replies anyway. Otherwise it just looks like you're pretending that watching the video matters and your whole argument hinges on me not having watched it.
 
Mjäll said:
I'll get back when i've made the time to find and watch this video.

I thought it was possible to discuss the fact "famous black man wearing WLM shirt" without watching a video, but maybe the video has some crucial details.

If i were you and the video did contain crucial details that supported the case you're making, i would just describe those crucial details - especially if i was gonna spend energy on lengthy replies anyway. Otherwise it just looks like you're pretending that watching the video matters and your whole argument hinges on me not having watched it.
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At this point I don't think it matters if you watch the video as it seems like your mind is made up anyways. Somehow I've now convinced myself that if you do watch it, you will just find another way to defend your argument rather than keeping an open mind. FYI the video is less than 2 minutes long. It took you much longer to read my posts defending the tweet with the video attached to it than it would have taken just to watch it. lol

I'm not gonna describe the video as it would take me longer than 2 minutes to type it up when you just could have watched it for yourself.

Anyways, my entire point with all this was that we could have debated the merits of the video in the context of the tweet text with regards to your opinion on a black guy wearing a WLM shirt. But you decided to have the debate first thereby putting the cart before the horse. No hard feelings, just a little annoying is all :)
 
Jerry Atrick said:
At this point I don't think it matters if you watch the video as it seems like your mind is made up anyways. Somehow I've now convinced myself that if you do watch it, you will just find another way to defend your argument rather than keeping an open mind. FYI the video is less than 2 minutes long. It took you much longer to read my posts defending the tweet with the video attached to it than it would have taken just to watch it. lol

I'm not gonna describe the video as it would take me longer than 2 minutes to type it up when you just could have watched it for yourself.

Anyways, my entire point with all this was that we could have debated the merits of the video in the context of the tweet text with regards to your opinion on a black guy wearing a WLM shirt. But you decided to have the debate first thereby putting the cart before the horse. No hard feelings, just a little annoying is all :)
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Oh did you mean the video you linked in the post i quoted to begin with? Yeah of course i watched the clip before responding. I thought you started talking about some other clip i should watch before being entitled to an opinion. Like a clip of Kanye wearing the WLM shirt. So you're just talking about the video you linked of the white racists we already talked about? And you just decided to pretend i didn't watch that?

And now after deciding that i didn't watch a video that i did watch, you're deciding based on nothing that i "wouldn't keep an open mind" if i watched this video that i already did watch.

Your "feeling" that i wouldn't be open minded is unfounded. I was open minded to the clip in your post - watched it, took it as fact and began discussing the content as fact with you. I was "open minded" to your type of anti racist opinion for decades before starting to see through it.

The lengths people go with mental gymnastics in order to defend their sacred right to NOT THINK, hahahaha

I was too fucking honest to even realize the creepiness of what you were doing while i was trying to have an honest debate, hahahaha

I accidentally played the role of your fictional "Mr Didn't Watch The Clip" by virtue of innocent misunderstanding! I'm glad i was sloppy enough to let your creepy fake argument run on and shine through
 
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The thing democrats have always been terrible at compared to republicans is shit like this



that video clip right there by itself could/will produce an insane amount of GOP votes and they didn't have to spend a penny on it
 
mal3volent said:
The thing democrats have always been terrible at compared to republicans is shit like this



that video clip right there by itself could/will produce an insane amount of GOP votes and they didn't have to spend a penny on it
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Migrants living better than I do.........

Maybe I should revoke my citizenship and move to New York
 
mal3volent said:
The thing democrats have always been terrible at compared to republicans is shit like this



that video clip right there by itself could/will produce an insane amount of GOP votes and they didn't have to spend a penny on it
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Well I for one am relieved our tax dollars are being spent responsibly, I mean if they were spending it on the school system or homeless/mental illness problem I would be furious
 
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