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The Da Vinci Code.....

interesting that this topic popped up again, because here's the straight dope:

Dear Cecil:

I just finished Dan Brown's best-seller The Da Vinci Code, about a thousand-year-old conspiracy involving the Catholic church. While the modern murder mystery part of the book is obviously fictional, you're encouraged to believe that the historical background is authentic. As a Straight Dope reader I know otherwise, so I'm not going to ask about hanky-panky between Jesus and Mary Magdalene (unlikely), the Holy Grail (a literary invention), or the Priory of Sion (too much like the Illuminati). What intrigued me was phi, also known as the Divine Proportion, a mystical ratio the book claims shows up everywhere in nature and art. I remember enough about the golden section and Fibonacci numbers, which also figure in the book and are related to phi somehow, to know that some of this is legit. But phi itself is new to me. What's the straight dope on this magic number? --Ryan Joseph, Chicago


Cecil replies:

Brown's exegesis of phi--for that matter, his whole book--is so cartoonish that you're inclined to dismiss it out of hand. (To cite one egregious example of his imprecision, he continually refers to the painter of the Mona Lisa as "da Vinci." As anyone with a semester of art history knows, the man's name was Leonardo; da Vinci merely refers to his birthplace.) Phi is a cool concept, though, and Lord knows I don't get many chances to expound on higher mathematics and dump on a fellow scribbler at the same time. So what I'll do here is go through Brown's often loopy assertions and follow each with the facts.

There's this number known as phi. Yeah, although the term wasn't invented till the early 1900s, by American mathematician Mark Barr. For that matter, synonyms like golden section and golden ratio, notwithstanding their air of antiquity, may date back only to the 19th century. The basic concept, however, was first advanced by the Greek geometer Euclid.

Phi = 1.618. Not quite. Phi is the infinite nonrepeating decimal 1.6180339887 . . . This may seem like a trivial difference, but it's the whole point--phi, like pi, is an irrational number that can't be expressed as the ratio of whole numbers. However, you can see where an explanation like that might not fly in a beach book.

Phi is derived from the Fibonacci sequence 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, etc. It can be, but the original, simpler explanation is this: Take line segment AB. Place point C on AB so that AB/AC = AC/BC. (Thank God we have artistic genius Slug Signorino to illustrate these advanced concepts.) AB/AC = AC/BC = phi = the golden section. Transfixed by the divinity of this proportion, are we? Maybe not, but some claim the ratio is uniquely pleasing in art.

Back to the Fibonacci sequence. Each number in it is the sum of the preceding two numbers (1 + 1 = 2, 2 + 1 = 3, etc). As Brown rightly notes, the quotients of successive adjacent terms (2/1, 3/2, 5/3, etc) converge on phi as you get further out. This is not the miracle some think, but it's still cool.

Your height divided by the distance from your belly button to the floor = phi. Get out. Behold the line segment in the drawing. The only people of height AB with their belly buttons at point C are named Igor. On me the ratio is about 1.7, not 1.618+. A huge difference? No, but Brown's hero observes, "Plants, animals, and even human beings all possessed dimensional properties that adhered with eerie exactitude to the ratio of phi to 1." That's just not so. I venture to say there's wide variation among individuals not only for navel placement but also for the other supposed anatomical occurrences of phi Brown cites.

Many natural phenomena exhibit some relation to phi. Up to a point, true. The spiral in the illustration was generated by assembling rectangles out of squares whose sides correspond in length to successive numbers in the Fibonacci series, then drawing arc segments in each square. This gives us a reasonable approximation of the shell of a chambered nautilus, seen in cross section. You can also find Fibonacci numbers in leaves spiraling around a plant stem, in the arrangement of seeds in flower heads, and so forth. Surprising? Not really. The Fibonacci series is a simple algorithm enabling proportions to remain roughly constant (i.e., approximately phi to one) with successive accretions of growth. If it works for a number series, it'll work for plants, shells, etc.

Phi governs the proportions of the pyramids, the Parthenon, and so on. There's little evidence that ancient architects used the golden section, but even if they did, so what? Euclid figured it out, and others could have too. Later creative types have certainly shown an interest--Dan Brown, for one. We know-it-alls may scoff, but how often do you see someone build a popular thriller around obscure concepts in math?

--CECIL ADAMS
 
http://www.csicop.org/si/9711/bible-code.html

Some critics of Drosnin say the journalist is just "data mining." Mathematician Brendan McKay of Australian National University and his colleagues searched Hebrew texts besides the Bible. They found fifty-nine words related to Chanukah in the Hebrew translation of War and Peace. But McKay doesn't think someone engineered this remarkable feat for his or anyone's benefit. Since then, McKay has responded to the following challenge Drosnin made in Newsweek:

"When my critics find a message about the assassination of a prime minister encrypted in Moby Dick, I'll believe them" (Begley 1997).


McKay found assassination "predictions" in Moby Dick for Indira Gandhi, Rene Moawad, Leon Trotsky, Rev. M. L. King, and Robert F. Kennedy (see http://cs.anu.edu.au/~bdm/dilugim/moby.html). Eliyahu Rips himself has denied Drosnin's implication that they worked together, and has said, "I do not support the book as it is or the conclusions it derives" (Van Biema 1997).

http://www.csicop.org/si/9803/bible-code.html

At a reporter's suggestion, I downloaded the chapter excerpt of Michael Drosnin's book, The Bible Code, from Simon and Schuster's Web site and began searching away. Even though the chapter was only about 4,000 characters in length, I was able to produce a number of hits. One puzzle held a lunar theme: "space," "lunar," "craft," and several "moon's," all authentic hidden words. I found the ubiquitous "Hitler/Nazi," even though the excerpt did not mention those words directly, talking instead mainly about the Rabin assassination. One puzzle has the hidden message "The code is a silly snake-oil hoax." And I even found "The code is evil" hidden in Drosnin's book (a mixed message he is sending us here).
 
duneonthemoon said:
i betcha hitler killed the great great (for ages n ages) grandson of jesus.

I bet he was one of those jews.

I bet hitler was the devil and he knew this, and did it to piss off god.

Maybe it was a girl.. anne frank?

Hmmm.

This whole topic is awfully ridiculous, noone can prove anything no matter how hard they try.
Sorry for the pessimistic attitude but this a discussion for old men with nothing better to do, surely we can direct our thoughts to more meaningful ideas. :D

Funny you should mention it, this was precisely the reason for the holocaust. The Nazis created the myth of the world wide Jewish conspiracy against the people of Europe as they conducted an exhaustive search for the Biblical artifacts (the Ark of the Covenant, the Holy Grail, Etc ), they poured over public records in occupied countries doing their most efficient German best to exterminate the Jews for the expressed purpose of ending the Merovingian bloodline.
I'd say it's far from ridiculous, it has to do with what is quite possibly the biggest conspiracy in history. Nothing has shaped world history in the last two millennia like the Catholic Church and it's dogma. If that dogma were to be exposed as a lie it would shake western culture to it's very foundation.
I would suggest you read 'Holy Blood, Holy Grail" which is the book that presents the evidence that is merely suggested and eluded to in "The Da Vinci Code", then judge for yourself. One cannot possibly form an informed opinion without reviewing all the evidence.
 
** minor spoiler possibility **





i just finished the da vinci code. i really enjoyed it - it's been a while since a book grabbed me that fast and made me not want to put it down. i read it over a couple of days.

the plot takes the main characters to rosslyn.

i've visited rosslyn (it's just outside my home town) and it certainly is an intriguing place. if you are reading or have read the da vinci code, there are some pictures on the link i just gave which will let you see what rosslyn chapel looks like, inside and out.

i'm sure that anybody who enjoyed this book might also enjoy the hiram key.

alasdair
 
expatriate said:
The Nazis created the myth of the world wide Jewish conspiracy against the people of Europe as they conducted an exhaustive search for the Biblical artifacts (the Ark of the Covenant, the Holy Grail, Etc )

Well, of course, I'd say Indiana Jones movies represent a credible reference for the upper statement. But thenagain there's a lot of stuff circling around Hitler, Nazis, occult powers etc. Whilst it was true that Hitler was inspired with germanic pagan mythology, stating that 'he will make a religion out of Parsifal' etc. true fact remains that germans were more occupied with rebuilding their armed forces, getting into territorial disputes and international crises all leading to ww2 to seriously bother around with some magic artefact hunt.

I'd say it's far from ridiculous, it has to do with what is quite possibly the biggest conspiracy in history. Nothing has shaped world history in the last two millennia like the Catholic Church and it's dogma. If that dogma were to be exposed as a lie it would shake western culture to it's very foundation.

My knowledge of history tells me that, even though immensely influential in the millennia you mention, catholic church is far from being the throne from which all history does unfold (courtesy of Nick Cave ;) ). Ever heard of reformation? Marthin Luter? 30 years war? Treaty of Westphalia? Was Gengish Khan a catholic agent? How about Tamerlan? Attila?
But I guess that viewing historical events, and the history as a whole being a result of a complex sets of circumstances, intricate networks of interests, conflicts, treasons and yes, anomalies (ie Napoleon, Alexander etc.) is a much more difficult task than forming an opinion that everything is happening just because a couple of initiates sit in some underground chamber and pull the strings.
 
expatriate said:
The Nazis created the myth of the world wide Jewish conspiracy against the people of Europe

Oh, and since you mention it, nazis didn't invent very much at all. Anti semitism was always present in christian world, because, after all jews killed Jesus. Pogroms happened now and then.

But the conspiracy thing actually came out of Russia, from tzarist secret service Ohrana, in form of a pamphlet/booklet with a cute title 'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion' which was supposed to be an account of a secret meeting of hebrew elders in which they conceived plots and described the methods used in order to take over the world whatever.

When it appeared it's impact was negligent, but after the 1917, the russian revolution, the defeat of axis powers in ww2 and general decline of the might and glory of the European empires, it appeared that what was outlined in the tract was actually happening... Ergo, evil Jews have put their hideous plan in motion. It was about that time that Hitler himself picked up his anti-semitism.

Then, oh Lord the tricks you play upon us mortals, it was discovered that Protocols were not a jewish world domination plot, but a forgery. Original text was a critique of the dictatorship of Emperor Napoleon III of France, splendidly titled 'Dialogue between Montesquieu and Machiavelli in hell', written by Maurice Joly.

So who would have guessed that a 19th century political pamphlet could become the deadliest book of 20th century?
 
JUST ON A SIDE NOTE:

Anyone that has read the book or researched the topic will be aware that the story of Mary Magdeline and her relationship with Jesus has been passed on in many subtle forms through the ages.... from tarot cards to references in disneys the little mermaid....

Now has anyone watched the matrix movies...?? particularly #3... and made a connection between its story and the magdeline story?????

A savior like character (neo) with a woman who is his rock (trinity).........and the merovingian? its not even that subtle and I found it very obvious.....admitedly i saw the movie like a day after i finished the davinci code .

Am I just mad or is the jesus/magdeline story embedded into the matrix????
 
Finally found time to read The Da Vinci Code and found it vaguely entertaining enough to finish. The theory posed was interesting and I found all the references to paganism and the sacrid femenine really pretty.
The writing, on the other hand, was lackluster to say the least. It seems that Dan Browns only method of creating suspense is to keep the reader in the dark about revelations that are either major influences in the characters themselves or their decisions throughout the book. I found this to be a pissweak technique as it present the reader with what appears to be a puzzle, but then on closer inspection, finds pieces are missing. It also alienate the reader from the main characters because it's hard to empathise with a character's repeated emotional reaction to something (an object or memory) without knowing what it is. The worst example of this is Sofie's reoccuring memory of a traumatic childhod experience. She moans about it for many chapters before revealing it. The time it took to finally be revealed makes it slightly worse than Sauniere's final poetic clue, which is pathetically revealed to the reader one line at a time, each seperated by many pages.
If you aren't familier with this theory, like I wasn't, then this book is worth a look. Then again, I'm sure there are many better places to learn about it.
 
I just wanted to share: About three months ago, I finished the ENTIRE hardbound copy of this book in FOUR HOURS STRAIGHT (ahhh a record for my speed reading skillz!!!) Gave me a slight headache, but it was a good read. That is all. =D
 
crystalcallas said:
I just wanted to share: About three months ago, I finished the ENTIRE hardbound copy of this book in FOUR HOURS STRAIGHT (ahhh a record for my speed reading skillz!!!) Gave me a slight headache, but it was a good read. That is all. =D

PSSHT! Four hours? What is it, 2000 pages? Come on, why so slow.:p ;) :D
 
^well, thats the FIRST novel ive actually taken the time to sit down and read in a really long time...so i guess devouring the entire boook in 4 hours must mean it was really good, plus....i made up for all those times i never got to read anything substantial. =D Nevarrr again! Lol
 
I guess I'll let you off with that one then. Only once though, I'm going to hold you to an impossibly harder to reach standard, because I like you.:p
 
I guess I'll let you you off with that one then. (means I'll accept your excuse)

Only once. (Seriously)

I'm going to hold you to an impossibly har to reach standar. (I'm holding you to a standard, that no-one can reach, in reality)

, because I like you. (what do you think?)



:p (indicates the joke I was making.)

Sorry, I guess only a few people understand "nerd" humor.

8)
 
Finally done with the novel... I found it to be a great read.

I think the most important thing about this...is it's exposing some very well known truths, to mainstream escapist (Christian) america who normally get off on reading John Grisham.

#1-- Christianity used to be a very balanced religion, both in word.. and in practice

#2-- B/c of power plays, kings, the vatican, constantine, and various others throughout history.. simply "removed" what they liked and deemed other things heresy.

#3-- Not many people actually realize how much of the Bible and Christianity's culture is really "borrowed", stolen, or was incoporated from other religions to convert them.. or to damn them. Therefore, alot of what most believe.. even historically speaking---putting the superstion aside-- is still a bunch of gibberish.

#4- There are many gospels and scrolls out there that are not included in the Bible.. and those who are in power.. to this very day, refuse to recognize them.

#5-- Most americans need some fucking art history :\ ;)

It's not so much about Leonardo, the Fibinacci sequence, art history, france, the secret societies and conspiracy theories.. as it is an entertaining way to teach mainstream america these little facts.

It's those facts that have.. even today.. inflamed priests, preachers, and the like. Over 20 books have been written in responses to the Da Vinci code.. and it's truly hilarious. These people have their heads in the sand and don't want to realize it.

This book never attacked religion.. but it did the power structures and what they've done with religion. So a plethora of novel responses were insured to come out.. and be properly financed by donations of course :\
 
As i read the book.. i thought myself.. this would make out to be an amazing movie.. especially if alot of the facts that are merely "thought" in the book ..are put into narration.. i hope this movie doesn't flop... but yes.. it's being made into a movie. :) :) :) and yeah.. watch out Passion of the Christ.. Gibson is about to be bitch slapped.

Da Vinci Code Movie



The Boston Herald claims that George Clooney, Russell Crowe, Tom Hanks, and Hugh Jackman are all candidates for the lead role. (ComingSoon.net)

There's an unconfirmed report that Ron Howard is talking to Russell Crowe and Kate Beckinsale about playing the leads. (Cinema Eye)

Ron Howard has signed on to direct, and Akiva Goldsman will write the script. (Variety)

http://movies.go.com/movies/D/davincicode_2004/



iday 28th May 2004: The Da Vinci Code Update:
Huge stars George Clooney, Russell Crowe, Tom Hanks and Hugh Jackman are all possible contenders for the lead in the adaptation of the bestselling book The Da Vinci Code by Dan Brown. Ron Howard is already signed on to direct, Brian Grazer to produce and Akiva Goldsman pens the screenplay, the same lot who did A Beautiful Mind. The story centers on one of the greatest mysteries of humankind, a 2000 year-old conspiracy, clues to which are encoded in the paintings of Leonardo Da Vinci. Brown is currently at work on a third novel featuring the hero, Professor Langdon.
http://www.thezreview.co.uk/comingsoon/d/davincicodethe.htm



Columbia Pictures Breaks "The Da Vinci Code"

Culver City - June 27, 2003
Columbia Pictures has secured the much sought after motion picture rights to Dan Brown's bestselling thriller "The Da Vinci Code," it was announced today by Amy Pascal, Chairman of Columbia Pictures, and John Calley, Chairman of Sony Pictures Entertainment.
"The Da Vinci Code" debuted at #1 on the New York Times Bestseller list and has remained near or at the top of the list for more than 14 weeks.
"The Da Vinci Code" is Brown's second novel centering on Harvard professor of symbology Robert Langdon, who first appeared in his successful "Angels and Demons" published in 2000, and now on the paperback best seller list.
'Da Vinci' centers on one of the greatest mysteries of humankind, a 2000 year-old conspiracy, clues to which are encoded in the paintings of Leonardo Da Vinci. Brown is currently at work on a third novel featuring Professor Langdon.
Viewing "The Da Vinci Code" and the adventures of Professor Langdon as the basis for a potential franchise, Columbia also acquired the right to produce "Angels and Demons," and future Langdon properties.
"Dan Brown is a master storyteller who has created an amazingly visual page turner," said Calley. "'The Da Vinci Code' is a thrill ride unlike any that we have read or seen in a long, long time. The Robert Langdon character is a compelling hero and sleuth and we can't wait to bring this puzzle to the screen."
http://romanticmovies.about.com/cs/upcomingreleases/a/davincicodenews.htm


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