Dissociatives The Big & Dandy DMXE (3-me-2′-oxo-PCE, deoxymethoxetamine) Thread

[4DQSAR]

Has anyone obtained GC-MS/NMR instrumentation data for this compound? I ask because the tilmetamine wasn't tilmetamine and the OP on the topic admitted that Chinese chemists were not aversed to making something cheaper or simpler if they thought they could get away with it.

I remain confident that the 2-chloro-5-methoxy homologue of K/MXE (it overlays both) will prove to be the best - but I am informed the production cost is high. Maybe so, but if it's activity is high, that need not be an issue.

 

[Esperighanto]

Has anyone obtained GC-MS/NMR instrumentation data for this compound? I ask because the tilmetamine wasn't tilmetamine and the OP on the topic admitted that Chinese chemists were not aversed to making something cheaper or simpler if they thought they could get away with it.

I remain confident that the 2-chloro-5-methoxy homologue of K/MXE (it overlays both) will prove to be the best - but I am informed the production cost is high. Maybe so, but if it's activity is high, that need not be an issue.

The precursor (2-chloro-5-methoxybenzene) should be easy as hell to acquire, Reimer-Tiemanning mequinol allegedly can lead to an ~80% yield on this reaction. Even after cleaning it up and pulling 50% total post re-x, that's still 40% conversion of one of the most difficult to acquire precursors for ket production. That's probably why patents and the sort are grabbing that compound imo. 2-Chlorobenzene is a bitch to make, it involves going through steps involving 2-Nitrobenzene from what I've seen and anybody working at scale is going to want to avoid this like the plague imo.

 

[4DQSAR]

The precursor (2-chloro-5-methoxybenzene) should be easy as hell to acquire, Reimer-Tiemanning mequinol allegedly can lead to an ~80% yield on this reaction. Even after cleaning it up and pulling 50% total post re-x, that's still 40% conversion of one of the most difficult to acquire precursors for ket production. That's probably why patents and the sort are grabbing that compound imo. 2-Chlorobenzene is a bitch to make, it involves going through steps involving 2-Nitrobenzene from what I've seen and anybody working at scale is going to want to avoid this like the plague imo.

Yeah, I think you touched on this before and I provided the GB patent number.

The fact that the -Cl and the -OCH3 moieties are on the opposite sides of the benzene ring may suggest that K and MXE bind in slightly different ways. So it's quite possible that the presence of both will increase affinity. If I were still in a position to have a sample of ANY compound made, that would be at the top of my list.

 

[Liminality]

I've got 1g coming today, will update when I try it. I LOVED MXE in 2013, so I was quite keen when this became available domestically, even at an inflated price, I had to at least try it.
Thanks to all the commenters.

Edit:
Ketamine tolerance from a month ago, I.M but disso tolerance is hard to gauge.
I'm on Sertraline 100mg

All DMXE reports

Allergy test <5mg IN - Recommended for all unknowns.

T+0: 20mg rectal
T+20 min: 40mg rectal
Wasn't feeling much, but slight warmth from T0 dose.

T+45 min: A bit of a wonk reminiscent of MXE.
A Good sign of my old love.
Slightly mxe-like

T+3hrs: 60mg rectal
Hard to do verification captcha
Warmth was there with classic vision effects alA Ket/MXE so I knew it was working. Colours were much more vivid.

T+6hrs
Tapering off stimulation/visual effects

The warmth and stimulation were there. Not much of a trip. Some euphoria. But the lack of psychedelia could be due to me using BDO earlier in the day.
Anxiolysis and anti depressant effects working well. See how long it lasts.

Will trial again soon

Has anyone combined this with suboxone yet? I'm on 12mg of Suboxone a day. I've mixed buprenorphine with plenty of dissos; 3-cl-pcp, 3-fl-pcp,mxpr, fxe, etc. I just always get paranoid when mixing it with a new disso. I know respiratory depression issues are rare with dissociatives, but I imagine any respiratory issues would be more of an issue with a close MXE analogue than with Pcp analogues

I'm on Buvidal, 64mg bolus S.C. No issues with DMXE. (Once month stable levels from bolus released slowly)
Equates to about 16mg Suboxone if I vaguely recall.


Oh and special thanks to SuperPsych for the combinations post. Very useful!


And yes, CMXE would be very interesting.
Any data or research sources for that?
Explain info on CMXE


I don't want to have a running trip report in the mega but I might post to trip reports if I find a good psychedelic experience. Considering combining with LSD once more acquainted.

I'll be sure to post again on how my 1g goes in some format.

Edit 2: Well I couldn't sleep. It's now 5am and my last dose was at 10.30pm I believe. I did however write a very insightful essay (683 words) on my own health and situation with drug use, and future focus.

 

[4DQSAR]

I've only tried ketamine and MXE a handful of times, but for me at least, MXE was the much better product. The fact that dozens of other homologues have turned up and each one seems worse than the last does suggest that cost is considered more important than subjective activity.

Ketamine is produced on a massive scale which is why it's still the only common arylcyclohexylamine.

Why CMXE hasn't turned up is cost. If I were still in the RC business I would at least have a sample made. Because if it turns out to be 2-3x more potent than MXE, as long as consumesr know, you could sell 250mg of it for the same price as a gram of K since they would yield the same number of doses.

Of course there are other compounds. Ones that aren't arylcyclohexylamines. Diphenidine was only ever meant to be a prototype. We discovered some much better analogues but due to some poor business decisions (like buying 1000Kg of piperidine!), we were stuck making N-piperidine varients.

 

[Liminality]

Very annoying feeling like you need to pee but you can't/don't. Sitting down helps but DMXE is as bad as ket for this.

I I.M'd 60mg today with a micron filter.
Warm fuzzy

Well, it wasn't a very pleasant hole experience. A bit of mania, a blood nose from snorting yesterday in the heat. Hard to control it so blood all over my room / carpet now to clean.
Apart from that kinda ruining it. It lacked the magic for sure of MXE.

But lower doses (20-60mg rectal) for stimulation/socialising were quite good. Not over talkative just relaxed and on point enough.

Might have to wait until further away from my morning BDO usage. Or my 4 week break from it.

Maybe again in 2 weeks at low doses rectally. Cause I wasn't sure about that. But definitely not up the nose again even if the effects were alright / easy to use.

No problems with serotonin syndrome from 100mg Sertraline and bupe.

Oh and it says my bupe is equivalent to 8-10mg bupe daily. No naloxone for quite a while for me for good behaviour.



But bi-weekly pharmacy visits for Subutex were a pain. Buvidal monthly much easier I just thought it was a higher dose.

Anyway that's my review of it for now, until 2 weeks again.

Stay safe everyone.

 

[4DQSAR]

Very annoying feeling like you need to pee but you can't/don't. Sitting down helps but DMXE is as bad as ket for this.

Yep. It's agony.

That's something that has always concerned me about RC manufacturers bringing compounds that haven't even undergone animal testing to market. Nobody really knows what the potential risks are.

I've mentioned this before but I took the time to read through 114 patents assigned to Parke-Davis on the arylcyclohexylamine class of compound. Over 100 patents and the ONLY ring-substituents they covered were the chloro and alkoxy (methoxy, ethoxy, isopropoxy). One of the MOST important things a patent is intended to do is to prevnt other manufacturers from making what are termed 'me too' drugs. There are entire research teams who try to find active compounds that avoid and patent conflict.

So why didn't Parke-Davis patent ketamine homologues with other (pseudo)halogens? Why do all 114 patents only cover -Cl, -OCH3, -OCH2CH3 and O-CH(CH3)2 as ring-substituents? They did try different aromatics hence tiletamine and they did try various different N-substitutions (hence 114 patents).

But WHY did they ignore all the other (pseudo)halogens?

They certainly did test many of them in animal models. Now a weakness of drug studies is that none of them have to be made public. In a few cases this has resulded in disasters but if Parke-Davis with all of it's resources decided not to even patent the fluoro, bromo, alkyl and indeed any other ring-substitutions, I would be asking 'why', because they are in the position of knowing while we are not.

Don't forget, esketamine is an NMDA antagonis, arketamine is a DRI. So the racemate possesses both activities. It's compounds that retain that balance but which are more potent that Parke-Davis were searching for.

1 — Postimages

postimg.cc

Novel cyclohexanone compounds and process means for the production thereof
Publication Number: GB-1202834-A
Priority Date: 1968-05-08

Example 1 is CMXE

People have asked 'well, if CMXE is better than ketamine, why hasn't it replaced ketamine?'. Well, I could ask the same question about MXE. The reason is simple. Ketamine was a revolutionay new medicine able to relieve the most severe pain and be able to produce surgical anasthesia in a safer manner than existing agents. So while research continued, the management of Parke-Davis spent billions on having ketamine tested and introduced into medicine on a global scale. CMXE was only discovered 6 years later and since ketamine had no competition, why introduce something else?

BTW the way Parke-Davis (as US company) only took out a GB patent is interesting. My theory is that they didn't want competitors to be aware of the improved drug. I guess it meant that IF another company discovered a better medicine than ketamine, Parke-Daivs could quicky swap research to CMXE.

Arylcyclohexylamine Derivatives: Pharmacokinetic, Pharmacodynamic, Clinical and Forensic Aspects

Since the 2000s, an increasing number of new psychoactive substances (NPS) have appeared on the drug market. Arylcyclohexylamine (ACH) compounds such as ketamine, phencyclidine and eticyclidine derivatives are of particular concern, given their rapidly increasing use and the absence of detailed...

www.mdpi.com

Reading the above makes me wonder if the other halogens were rejected by Parke-Davis because they produce potentially toxic metabolites. With any ned medicine, one doen't just have to test the toxicity of the drug itself but also it's metabolites. We now know ketamine can damage the bladders. I have no idea if Parke-Davis regonigized this issue and if so, did they try various (pseudo)halogens to find the least toxic? It's all just a guess, but Parke-Davis not patenting 2-fluoro norketamine seems odd. We see it turn up as a 'me too' drug, but we don't know why Parke-Davis seeminly discared it.

 

[Liminality]

Ah great, thanks for that. It is very close to MXE, just with a chlorine and something going on with the CH3 group, not sure. (I'm a physicist who never did chemistry past 1st year.)
Physics was enough for me, nanotechnology, etc. Tokyo nanotech expo was amazing!
That Chloromethoxetamine (CMXE) would be VERY interesting!

Got an update. 85mg Rectal provided lots of stimulated dissociation.
Had a 30 minute shower as it came on. Very relaxed.
Little trouble with motor control.
Lasted about 5 hours.
Etizolam 2mg after that.
Very nice.

Going to try 135mg Rectal next time as the dosage seems a bit higher. (75-80%) of MXE doses from reading this thread