Dave Woodmont
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 29, 2004
- Messages
- 49
I'm interested in hearing from people who have experimented with at least two of any of the following:
4-HO-DET; 4-AcO-DET
4-HO-DiPT; 4-AcO-DiPT
4-HO-MiPT; 4-AcO-MiPT
How would you compare the potencies, effects, and dose-response curves of the 4-HO's you have sampled?
Shulgin lists the following in TiHKAL for dosage and duration:
4-HO-DET: 10 - 25 mg, orally (as the indolol, the acetate or the phosphate); 4-6 hours
4-HO-DiPT: 15 - 20 mg, orally; 2-3 hours
4-HO-MiPT: 12 - 25 mg, orally (as the indolol or the acetate); 4-6 hours
Additionally, one of the reports in TiHKAL says that 4-HO-DET is probably less potent at 20 mg than an equal amount of psilocin, and another says that 20 mg of 4-HO-MiPT was stronger than 50 mg of psilocin. But who knows whether these observations would hold true in all subjects? Different people probably have differing receptor subtypes, etc.
Shulgin and others have noted that the acetate ester of 4-HO-DiPT seems to be a bit more potent and have a slightly longer duration. He also notes that the indolol acetates, being sufficiently nonpolar to cross the blood-brain barrier, may be active drugs in their own right.
Someone Who Isn't Me compared two trials each of 4-HO-DiPT and 4-HO-MiPT, +/- 10% on dosages given: SWIM found that 4-HO-DiPT at 20 and 22 mg was roughly equivalent to 13 mg of 4-HO-MiPT, with a nearly identical chronology: very rapid climb from about 15 minutes to half an hour, with a decline beginning before the two hour mark and a notable drop in visuals. Psychedelic effects were mostly gone by the four-hour mark, with residual effects noticed for a few more hours, and difficulty sleeping until at least the eight hour point (likely an idiosyncratic response; SWIM is a lightweight). Both substances were enjoyably visual, with morphing and patterning OEV's and Persian-carpet-type CEV's, and highly prosocial at the dosages tried, with a great deal of mirth (setting was near-ideal, a small gathering of close, experienced friends). One notable difference (apart from which SWIM could not have distinguished the two, aside from milligrammage) was the body load: 4-HO-DiPT produced annoying muscle twitches, with 22 mg being about the max SWIM felt he could tolerate. 4-HO-MiPT, by contrast, produced relatively mild tremors. 4-HO-DiPT may have been a little more euphoric, but that may have been placebo.
Fascinating stuff. Comments?
peace,
Dave
4-HO-DET; 4-AcO-DET
4-HO-DiPT; 4-AcO-DiPT
4-HO-MiPT; 4-AcO-MiPT
How would you compare the potencies, effects, and dose-response curves of the 4-HO's you have sampled?
Shulgin lists the following in TiHKAL for dosage and duration:
4-HO-DET: 10 - 25 mg, orally (as the indolol, the acetate or the phosphate); 4-6 hours
4-HO-DiPT: 15 - 20 mg, orally; 2-3 hours
4-HO-MiPT: 12 - 25 mg, orally (as the indolol or the acetate); 4-6 hours
Additionally, one of the reports in TiHKAL says that 4-HO-DET is probably less potent at 20 mg than an equal amount of psilocin, and another says that 20 mg of 4-HO-MiPT was stronger than 50 mg of psilocin. But who knows whether these observations would hold true in all subjects? Different people probably have differing receptor subtypes, etc.
Shulgin and others have noted that the acetate ester of 4-HO-DiPT seems to be a bit more potent and have a slightly longer duration. He also notes that the indolol acetates, being sufficiently nonpolar to cross the blood-brain barrier, may be active drugs in their own right.
Someone Who Isn't Me compared two trials each of 4-HO-DiPT and 4-HO-MiPT, +/- 10% on dosages given: SWIM found that 4-HO-DiPT at 20 and 22 mg was roughly equivalent to 13 mg of 4-HO-MiPT, with a nearly identical chronology: very rapid climb from about 15 minutes to half an hour, with a decline beginning before the two hour mark and a notable drop in visuals. Psychedelic effects were mostly gone by the four-hour mark, with residual effects noticed for a few more hours, and difficulty sleeping until at least the eight hour point (likely an idiosyncratic response; SWIM is a lightweight). Both substances were enjoyably visual, with morphing and patterning OEV's and Persian-carpet-type CEV's, and highly prosocial at the dosages tried, with a great deal of mirth (setting was near-ideal, a small gathering of close, experienced friends). One notable difference (apart from which SWIM could not have distinguished the two, aside from milligrammage) was the body load: 4-HO-DiPT produced annoying muscle twitches, with 22 mg being about the max SWIM felt he could tolerate. 4-HO-MiPT, by contrast, produced relatively mild tremors. 4-HO-DiPT may have been a little more euphoric, but that may have been placebo.
Fascinating stuff. Comments?
peace,
Dave
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