The Big & Dandy 25I-NBOMe Thread (2nd edition)

[Ekstasis-//7]

Need help double checking safetly stuff on mixing with a bulking aget

Hi I am needing some help from those experienced with the procedure of mixing pharmaceuticals. After last time dosing out 25c using a milligram scale and liquid measurements (vodka) to the correct proportions it was a fidelley and time consuming exercise to dehydrate and scrape up each dose to a dry or sticky powder (I suspect voda residue for the stickiness) for snorting. This time I have a new idea. I have heard in the pharmaceutical industry they have machines that mix binder with the active drug (often in very small dosages). This is what I want to do. Here is what I'm thinking. I use glucose powder and stain it with with food colouring. After that dries I grind it finely in a mortal & pestle back to a powder (which hopefully keeps the colour). I weigh out 9X the glucose to the dosage of 25i weighed out. So for example using (eg 180mg glucose to 20mg 25i) I then stir in and mix thoroughly the two powders. Hopefully if the 25i isn't evenly mixed I will see the white colour 25i in the coloured glucose powder and mix longer. Then done I can fairly accurately just measure out say 5mg of powder for a 500µg 25i dose to snort, or 10mg for 1mg of 25i.

Does anyone have any safety issues worth raising about mixing in this way? I can grind both 25i and glucose in a mortar and pestle to get them hopefully similar in grain size so they mix evenly.

Please if you are able PM what you think that would be greatly appreciated!! Thanks

 

[MescalMan]

Can the freebase form be insufflated by itself? That's without making a solution.

Edit: Also what amount would you suggest a 160 pound subject try out just to test the waters. I also tried out some 4-MEC today is it still safe to go ahead with testing tonight?

 

[Mela]

@ekstasis

Theoretically is sound, and the dye method is one way to assess the homogeneity of the formulation.

Give in pharm tablet formulation dry mixing is in the main the prolonged 'stirring' using a kenwood-style mixer (some obviously >2m height). And the checking would involve pressing tabs and using simple analytic chem (e.g., HPLC-UV) to measure consistency of dosage. I've even known smaller batches made in bottles and simply placed on a tumbler apparatus.

Just spend lots of time mixing the active and excipient in some appropriate manner (and you have a basic method to assess consistency). You could also build up the dilution.

 

[Transform]

I would be very careful doing that. If the particle sizes and powder densities are not similar then it is very easy to get hotspots in the blend, and the tiny amounts of active present will make it very challenging to visually asses purity. If cyclodextrin does indeed complex NBOMes effectively then you should have a good chance using that, as it would have little choice but to be consistent.

 

[Unelmaporsas]

Finally got around doing some. Last week I shared a dropper containing 1,5mgs of 25i with my significant other. The drops were administered nasally in the space of maybe two hours and we both agreed that it was nice - a bit rough come up emotionally, but otherwise quite smooth and more psychedelic than we had anticipated. Exceptionally clear too, and pretty euphoric but overall we were a bit underwhelmed - propably due to the fact that we had consumed something like 35mg+ of 2C-B two days before. When the effects of 25i started to clear off a bit - maybe 4 hours after the last dose - we dropped some DOC (maybe around 2-3mg). They combined well, and I'll have to explore this further (though maybe another way around - DOx compounds seem to be nice stable platforms for building combinations due to their long duration).

I seriously believe 25i will become a small time classic due to it's pleasant and recreational nature and small doses.

 

[Mela]

'Tis true. Normally 90-110% of the expected dose is aimed for in pharm formulation (and is generally achieved easily enough when done properly). So if we talk in mcg - if you aim for, say, 500mcg you could achieve 450-550mcg if done well. IF this route was used I would use gradual dilution. So say 20mg+20mg, then 40mg mix + 40mg, then 80mg mix + 120mg (so total 180mg excipient). The mixing should be slow (steady) and prolonged (at every stage). I did something similar with 4HO-MET & lactose (and it worked well).

I think given the main issue Ekstasis has seems to be due to residue issues from solvent on drying - try a different solvent. Perhaps dilute in methanol/water solution (of course, knowing methanol is quite flammable but evaporates readily - and NOT good for nasal spraying!). Effectively, aqueous dilution is certainly going to be easier and less likely to be ballsed-up (although already seen many horror stories even with the aqueous method - derp).

 

[MescalMan]

Can the freebase form be insufflated by itself? That's without making a solution.

Edit: Also what amount would you suggest a 160 pound subject try out just to test the waters. I also tried out some 4-MEC today is it still safe to go ahead with testing tonight?

Bump I really need an answer on this.

 

[mumar]

hey, i was wondering if it is possible for mould to grow on my 25i nbome water solution because there is a formation in my dropper... i have two theories. the first is that the freebase formed again in the water and the second one is that there is mould in there. the problem is that i noticed it a bit too late but it still works

the color of the solution is a bit yellowish and the formation inside is white.

thanks for the answer guys,
enjoy

 

[Ekstasis-//7]

@Transform - Sorry I don't understand what

If cyclodextrin does indeed complex NBOMes effectively

means. Also I cannot find cyclodextrin well at least not at affordable prices... ebay has Gamma W8 Pharma grade Cyclodextrin for over 3000 bucks for 100g!! or Alpha-Cyclodext​rin 100g for over 400 bucks after shipping!!

I'll try dye some glucose then turn it into powder in a mortar & pestle and see if it retains a strong enough colour with no white. When I used 25C I found about 1mg was a good dose (+/- 30% after weighing accuracy) this amount although small should be noticeable by colour alone I would think especially if the end dosage it spread out very thinly and inspected before snorting. Tell me if you think I'm wrong though or if there is a cheap, easily available and better mixing chemical you know of.

@Mela - I originally used vodka and not isopropanol or some other completely evaporatable solvent because I planned to take the dosages vaporised in a pipe and also orally but not nasally. I found vaporising gave me bad side effects and an unpleasant trip and orally was way too weak. The dilution contained far too much liquid to put up the nose and far too much ethanol to be bearable. I had no solution but to measure and evaporate. The main issue I have is not the solvent residue issue you mention. The main issue is it is fiddly and very time consuming to dehydrate and scrape up each single dose. Not to mention needing access to the kitchen to heat it on a plate. If I'm able to mix it effectively in a filler chemical (like glucose) then I can quickly and easily weigh dosages when needed.

 

[klondike_bar]

hey, i was wondering if it is possible for mould to grow on my 25i nbome water solution because there is a formation in my dropper... i have two theories. the first is that the freebase formed again in the water and the second one is that there is mould in there. the problem is that i noticed it a bit too late but it still works

the color of the solution is a bit yellowish and the formation inside is white.

thanks for the answer guys,
enjoy

was is properly dissolved in the first place? it shouldnt go bad as it isnt really a bacteria-feeding nutrient/chemical, but in future vodka is a far better solvent.

also, if you feel that freebase mayve formed somehow, add a very small amount of acid to the solution. a few milligrams of citric acid, or a drop of vinegar might correct any pH changes like you are suggesting.

 

[klondike_bar]

Can the freebase form be insufflated by itself? That's without making a solution.

Edit: Also what amount would you suggest a 160 pound subject try out just to test the waters. I also tried out some 4-MEC today is it still safe to go ahead with testing tonight?

general dosage according to bluelight is in the 0.6-1.1mg range for first use. as for insufflation, powder form of the freebase is not particularly active for insufflation if i am correct. you need a salt or complexed form. once in the right, water-soluble form, the powder can be insufflated on its own, or better yet in a carrier powder (10-15mg of another active/inactive chem can help make spread the 25I more evenly. MXE or even mdma at this quantity is quite low in effect, but can synergize well)

 

[foolsgold]

well i will be taking the plunge in the morning , now i know smoking weed on trips makes them come out more well with me they do i don't normally get visuals till i smoke but as iv only got am2201 has any one mixed the two ? just wondering as am2201 can get very out of bodyish with me and i'm wanting some one else's opinion on it

 

[klondike_bar]

i wasnt a fan of am2201, but i see no immediate reason why it would be unsafe to combine. keep doses of the cannabinoid low though, as it is a very intensive one, and could feel like a bit much mixed with a psychedelic

 

[RR16]

@Transform - Sorry I don't understand what means. Also I cannot find cyclodextrin well at least not at affordable prices... ebay has Gamma W8 Pharma grade Cyclodextrin for over 3000 bucks for 100g!! or Alpha-Cyclodext​rin 100g for over 400 bucks after shipping!!

HPBCD aka Beta-cyclodextrin. I can find it for 150eur for 100g or 30eur for 10g. Also complexed prelaid blotters cost double the price of 25I HCL.

 

[zn13bt]

I don't know if it's a uniform pitch shift for me, but high doses of 25i tend to distort/muddle the sense of pitch and melody in music for me far more dramatically than almost any other psychedelic I've taken (perhaps the most dramatically, if I thought about it more). This basically exemplifies my general problem with 25i: the dose sweetspot is just too hard for me to hit. When I hit it, everything sounds awesome, very distorted yes, but in a way that really enhances the music/gives it this otherworldly feel and presence, and I experience other positives commonly associated with the drug (laughs, introspection, lack of bodyload, etc). Get the dose too high - which I do more often than not, sadly - and everything gets freaky, uncomfortable, and concerning the sensory, often times just nastily unpleasant. The "otherworldly" distortion of my sweetspot 25i dose ramps up into hypergear and everything sounds incoherent, jumbled, discordant and often malicious sounding - the voices of the songs have often resembled alien, distorted evil whispers snaking their way into my ears. With this change in sound comes a horrible persisting nausea and sensory overload. I will tell you this, I have had plenty of difficult trips that were too intense, on many psychedelics, and I will that there is one thing that is totally unique to 25i overdoses: I will always turn the music off. Every other OD/bad experience with a psychedelic, and the music is always the ONLY positive aspect I can cling to, since it sounds cool as fuck. Not so with 25i.

I've had problems hitting the right dose too. I was on 1.2mg when I posted before, and that was a bit too much for music enjoyment since it made a lot of it sound too weird (though some other songs sounded fantastic). But I've had quite a few 1mg doses, and on those I hardly noticed any change to music at all. I don't really remember what happened the one time I took 1.3mg, I think I was too confused most of the time to operate any electronic equipment. (These are all with buccal admin btw) I guess the next thing to try is 1.1mg to see what happens with that...maybe that's the sweet spot for me.

I think it depends on how much tolerance you have too. I can go a few weekends in a row doing 25I and still hit pretty much the same level with the same dose every time, so I don't seem to need two weeks like other people report to rebuild tolerance. But after about a month and a half of weekly 25I trips, the euphoria tends to go away and I'm left feeling confused and weird the whole trip. When that happens I do have to wait a couple weeks for my brain to reset.

I'm aware that this might be an idiosyncratic or relatively rare reaction to 25i. If anyone has experienced anything similar, though, I'd be fascinated to know. Interestingly, a lot of people have compared 25i to DOI - but with the addendum that 25i is a gentler version of DOI. Interestingly, I did note the similarities, but I thought just the opposite, that DOI was a gentler (but longer) version of 25i.

The one time I tried DOI it was pretty gentle for me too. My 25I trips have been a lot stronger. But maybe I just haven't taken a big enough dose of DOI

 

[foolsgold]

i wasn't a fan of am2201, but i see no immediate reason why it would be unsafe to combine. keep doses of the cannabinoid low though, as it is a very intensive one, and could feel like a bit much mixed with a psychedelic

cheers i was thinking the same thing think i will go with putting it in roll ups in stead of chasing it . iv noticed with the am2201 its got a very dark edge to it of late like a dark entity about it so we will see

 

[Zazen]

well i will be taking the plunge in the morning , now i know smoking weed on trips makes them come out more well with me they do i don't normally get visuals till i smoke but as iv only got am2201 has any one mixed the two ? just wondering as am2201 can get very out of bodyish with me and i'm wanting some one else's opinion on it

Haven't tried this combo specifically but generally AM-2201 powers up trips A LOT (much more than cannabis) with greatly increased visuals and headspace. Saying that it can also add a very paranoid edge to a trip. So as others have said start low, although at least with AM-2201 it hits almost instantly so you know where you're at and if you do too much you're fine half an hour later.

 

[foolsgold]

cheers that's the thing no mater how much we want to thing noids are like the real thing the a totally different beast when it comes down to it . like iv said i get very out of body with them . well we will see in the morning . im now planing what to do thinking a few miles walking listening to tunes for the come up then home just do i do 1 or both tabs as 600ug seems to be the starting dose maybe best keeping the other one for another day .

 

[DjLeo]

25i-NBOMe 550ug tab + MDMA 125mg

Is this a safe combo? Have done LSD and MD many times in the past.

 

[jaurk]

25i-NBOMe 550ug tab + MDMA 125mg

Is this a safe combo? Have done LSD and MD many times in the past.

Personally, with my biology, I'd do it.
The BP/vasoconstriction would be the thing to watch out for, just make sure it's pure MDMA.
It's a low dose of 25i so you shouldn't really be worried with the blood pressure and vasoconstriction, though the added MDMA will add more.

I think you should be fine honestly.
I don't recommend it, I am not a drug doctor.