The best way to take Baby Hawaiian Woodrose or Morning Glories WITHOUT getting sick?

[Mycophile]

Many years ago I was stupid enough to just eat an entire package of Morning Glory Seeds and an entire package of Baby Hawaiian Woodrose seeds to trip and I got Really Really sick.

I did trip for a while however. What happened was that I ate them a few hours before bed, waited and nothing happened so I went to sleep and woke up at like 5AM tripping. I tripped for about an hour then fell back to sleep, woke up later the next day with a seriously flushed face and flushed hands and a BAD stomach ache.

I then threw up about 6-8 times in a row and had blurred vision for 3 days. Finally after 3 days my blurred vision went away and I was fine.

Now I am obviously VERY reluctant to try again, but I have no sources for any conventional psychedelics and so I'd like to try Baby Hawaiian Woodrose again (not Morning Glories because supposedly you need a LOT more of those to trip) but the only way I'd do it is if I could pretty much GUARANTEE that I wouldn't get sick.

I still don't know why I had blurred vision for days.

At the time internet research made me believe it was cyanide coating on the seeds but now people on here have made me believe that maybe it was just ergot in the seeds.

Either way, what is the SIMPLEST and most effective way to take Baby Hawaiian Woodrose seeds WITHOUT getting sick??

Keep in mind that I have ZERO knowledge of chemistry and I also can barely even cook more than the simplest shit so I wouldn't be able to do any process that involves any complex or even semi-complex chemical extraction or whatever.

I just want a way that I can simply get rid of the shells and any poison or whatever and trip.

I'd preferably like a way to drink a liquid I'd soaked them in because I think that might make me a bit more confident that I wouldn't get sick as opposed to swallowing whole seeds which I don't know if I'd ever try again.

Does anyone know a really simple effective way to eat or take the LSA from BHW seeds without getting sick?

Thanks

 

[DrGreenthumb]

Do a cold water extraction, get some bottled water (don't use chlorinated tap water) & leave it in the fridge. Crush the seeds with a pestle & mortar, remove the shells, put the white seed powder in the bottle of cold water, a bit of lemon juice might help too. Shake it well & put it back in the fridge for a few hours. Pour out your water into a glass & strain the seed mush through a t-shirt or some other fine filter. Drink the water & throw away the mush. You can use a coffee grinder or something like that if you don't have a pestle & mortar.

Morning glory seeds seem to have less physical side effects than hawaiian baby woodrose seeds & you're doing an extraction so you're not eating the seeds. Don't have too many & you wont get such harsh side effects either, 30 average sized heavenly blue morning glory seeds was a threshold dose for me, 100 was more of a standard tripping dose & I wouldn't want to consume over 150.

The cold water should extract the LSA & leave most of the nasty stuff that makes you sick in the seed mush. It can still cause a little nausea, some sedation & some vasoconstriction, but a cold water extraction is a lot better than just eating the seeds.

 

[Mycophile]

Do a cold water extraction, get some bottled water (don't use chlorinated tap water) & leave it in the fridge. Crush the seeds with a pestle & mortar, remove the shells, put the white seed powder in the bottle of cold water, a bit of lemon juice might help too. Shake it well & put it back in the fridge for a few hours. Pour out your water into a glass & strain the seed mush through a t-shirt or some other fine filter. Drink the water & throw away the mush. You can use a coffee grinder or something like that if you don't have a pestle & mortar.

Morning glory seeds seem to have less physical side effects than hawaiian baby woodrose seeds & you're doing an extraction so you're not eating the seeds. Don't have too many & you wont get such harsh side effects either, 30 average sized heavenly blue morning glory seeds was a threshold dose for me, 100 was more of a standard tripping dose & I wouldn't want to consume over 150.

The cold water should extract the LSA & leave most of the nasty stuff that makes you sick in the seed mush. It can still cause a little nausea, some sedation & some vasoconstriction, but a cold water extraction is a lot better than just eating the seeds.

Thanks.

So have you done this without puking?

Do you prefer the mental effects of Morning Glory Seeds or Baby Hawaiian Woodrose?

Also, this shouldn't have any bad interactions with an SSRI should it?

I've never heard that LSA has any effect on serotonin before.

 

[sekio]

Woodrose seeds and morningglory are touchy at best, even with extractions you can experience nausea and the like. LSA is just much less selective for causing hallucinations. But you can't make any guarantees as to whether or not it will make you sick.

Also, this shouldn't have any bad interactions with an SSRI should it?

I've never heard that LSA has any effect on serotonin before.

LSA is a serotonin & dopamine receptor agonist. Treat it like LSD in terms of interactions. The interactions are variable between individuals, some people say being on a SSRI messes with the headspace, some say it doesn't effect them, some say it dulls the effects somewhat.

The rule of thumb for best experiences is to not take any serotonergic psychedelics (anything that acts as a serotonin receptor agonist or serotonin releasing agent) within 2 weeks of your last SSRI/SNRI dose. However, don't stop your SSRI just to trip unless your doctor OK's it.

 

[Mycophile]

Woodrose seeds and morningglory are touchy at best, even with extractions you can experience nausea and the like. LSA is just much less selective for causing hallucinations. But you can't make any guarantees as to whether or not it will make you sick.



LSA is a serotonin & dopamine receptor agonist. Treat it like LSD in terms of interactions. The interactions are variable between individuals, some people say being on a SSRI messes with the headspace, some say it doesn't effect them, some say it dulls the effects somewhat.

The rule of thumb for best experiences is to not take any serotonergic psychedelics (anything that acts as a serotonin receptor agonist or serotonin releasing agent) within 2 weeks of your last SSRI/SNRI dose. However, don't stop your SSRI just to trip unless your doctor OK's it.

Hmm, I don't know what a "serotonin & dopamine receptor agonist" is because I have no real knowledge of chemistry or neurology, etc.

I had always heard that LSD was safe to take with SSRIs however, is it not?

I have taken LSD a number of times on SSRIs without experiencing ill effects and would not hesitate to do so again as is didn't seem to have any negative (i.e. dangerous) interactions with it so if LSAs are no different I would probably also try that.

Of course I would never stop taking my SSRI so any drug I want to use must be combined with it.

So when you say "the rule of thumb for best experiences is to not take any serotonergic psychedelics (anything that acts as a serotonin receptor agonist or serotonin releasing agent) within 2 weeks of your last SSRI/SNRI dose" do you mean that it is actually DANGEROUS to combine LSA/LSD with an SSRI as it would be to combine an SSRI with an MAOI, or only that it may effect your experience??

As you know almost every medication under the sun is "contraindicated" with SSRIs yet only some are truly DANGEROUS to combine with them, and that is why I come here, because I don't feel that people on SSRIs necessarily need to avoid all psychoactive substances.

 

[Erikmen]

If you are in doubt, maybe you should not use LSD. Unfortunately or no, I don't have a single positive event to share when it comes to to psychedelics.
IMO when the effects of a certain substance depends more on the surrounding ambience than itself I normally pass.

 

[sekio]

If you've combined LSD with SSRIs then there's no reason you can't try LSA and your SSRI.

So when you say "the rule of thumb for best experiences is to not take any serotonergic psychedelics (anything that acts as a serotonin receptor agonist or serotonin releasing agent) within 2 weeks of your last SSRI/SNRI dose" do you mean that it is actually DANGEROUS to combine LSA/LSD with an SSRI as it would be to combine an SSRI with an MAOI, or only that it may effect your experience??

I mean the latter, but at the same time, don't expect tripping on a SSRI to be exactly the same as doing so without.

 

[Xorkoth]

The best way I've determined to use HBWR seeds is to chew them up and absorb them sublingually over the course of 30-45 minutes. They really don't taste bad at all, some people seem to have an issue with them but to me they just taste like seed husk. Then spit the slurry out after you've held it in for a while. The resulting experience will be weaker by dose than if you had swallowed them, but the bodyload is tremendously less and no nausea. I have read that adding a drop or 2 of real peppermint extract converts some LSA to LSH but I never learned whether that was accurate or not.

I've had a better trip the one time I used morning glory seeds. I actually got more nauseous at first than with HBWR but the trip was better and the nausea faded after a couple of hours, I just laid down until then.

 

[just say know]

sometimes the nausea can be a spiritual experience in itself. i always say "nausea is the first sign to glory". you could also try counteracting the nausea with ginger, chamomile, cannabis, and various other anti-nauseants.

smoking or vaping a bit of pot works best it also intensifies the experience~!

 

[Mycophile]

The best way I've determined to use HBWR seeds is to chew them up and absorb them sublingually over the course of 30-45 minutes. They really don't taste bad at all, some people seem to have an issue with them but to me they just taste like seed husk. Then spit the slurry out after you've held it in for a while. The resulting experience will be weaker by dose than if you had swallowed them, but the bodyload is tremendously less and no nausea. I have read that adding a drop or 2 of real peppermint extract converts some LSA to LSH but I never learned whether that was accurate or not.

I've had a better trip the one time I used morning glory seeds. I actually got more nauseous at first than with HBWR but the trip was better and the nausea faded after a couple of hours, I just laid down until then.

However, if I used Morning Glories chewing them seems like it would be too much work wouldn't it, since you need so many, as opposed to BHW where I've heard you only need a few?

Or can you really chew up 100 or more Morning Glory seeds WITHOUT swallowing them (I found out years ago how bad the swallowing part was...)?

I just do NOT want to have a repeat episode of heavy vomitting and blurred vision for days.

Do most people here prefer the experience of Baby Hawaiian Woodrose Seeds or Morning Glories?

And is the cold water extraction method really reliable of giving a good experience?

The bad experience I had years ago has me wanting to make sure I don't have repeat before I try it and I'm afraid of whatever toxins were in the seeds.

Do people think that my blurred vision from the last trip that lasted 3 days was due to poison people put on the seeds to prevent people from swallowing them or natural ergot or something?

I don't mind some nausea that passes over time, that's fine, just no projectile vomiting and blurred vision for days...

 

[red22]

Woodrose seeds and morningglory are touchy at best, even with extractions you can experience nausea and the like. LSA is just much less selective for causing hallucinations. But you can't make any guarantees as to whether or not it will make you sick.

How many times have you administered chemically extracted morning glory seeds? Have you reviewed a multitude of experience reports or message board comments; and have you interviewed those who have used morning glory seeds?

 

[Tranced]

Does pure LSA cause nausea?

 

[just say know]

Pure LSA can still cause some nausea; i think it depends on how it reacts with your body/digestive system.

also i prefer hawain baby woodrose seeds over morning glory; but then again their slightly different experiences because they contain slightly different mixtures of alkaloids. so they both have their qualities. i find morning glories more "mind blowing" than Hawain baby woodrose seeds; but i also found that the HBW was SO much more pleasant nausea-wise

there's also olliliquy, sleepy grass, and a few others in the morning glory family that contain LSA try each one and see which you prefer. always buy organic though; try buying online.

 

[CrypticArc]

Step one: grind seeds. Step two: wash with naptha. soak for 6 hours, dry for 24. Step 3: consume dried powder. Should cut down on toxins in the seeds without taking any LSA out.

 

[sekio]

How many times have you administered chemically extracted morning glory seeds? Have you reviewed a multitude of experience reports or message board comments; and have you interviewed those who have used morning glory seeds?

I've had whole crushed morningglory once to no useful effects, and done woodrose twice, both whole and cold water extracted, the latter of which made both me and my GF at the time gut-churningly sick.

From what I've read there is no reason that ingesting a mixture of nonselective ergot alkaloids wouldn't have the possibility of inducing nausea. I haven't done an intensive literature review in some time, but from memory I recall that woodrose and morning glory are regarded as less forgiving than purified LSD.

All I know is that I respond way more favourably to isolated LSD; the seeds have been rather insulting in terms of body load and effects, in comparison. Maybe I'm just not invested enough in the idea, or not "holistic" enough. Maybe I have the "wrong" seeds. Maybe I am just cursed? It's just my 2 cents, either way.

 

[Mycophile]

Best trips I've had have been with chewing them for ages before swallowing.

A forum thread in another site was talking about the pros and cons of different extractions, and one of the proposed early steps was to use a digestive extract to break down the cyanide in the seeds.

So with morning glory seeds i figure eat ~ten at a time, chewing for ten or more minutes, swallow and repeat ad infinitum ad nauseum

Combine that with some lil bombs of mdma and you're on to a game changer

How much of the time do these seeds really have cyanide on them anyway?

And when there is cyanide on them is it enough to kill someone if they take enough seeds to trip, or enough to do permanent damage?

If so I wouldn't want to eat them.

And is there any way to tell if the seeds have cyanide on them?

 

[red22]

They don't have cyanide in them.


Thus, it may be concluded that cyanogenic glycosides are no frequent constituents in the family Convolvulaceae

Source: Eich, E. 2008. Solanaceae and Convolvulaceae: Secondary Metabolites: Biosynthesis, Chemotaxonomy, Biological and Economics Significance (a Handbook), pages 274-278

Tantisewie B, Ruijgrok HWL, Hegnauer R (1969) Die Verbreitung der Blausäure bei den Cormophyten. Pharmac Weekbl 104:1341-1355

Hegnauer R (1964) Chemotaxonomie der Pflanzen, vol 3, Convolvulaceae. Birkhäuser Verlag Basel/Switzerland, pp 547-561, 661-662

Hegnauer R (1989) Chemotaxonomie der Pflanzen, vol 8, Convolvulaceae. Birkhäuser Verlag Basel, Switzerland, pp 321-331, 709-710

Van Romburgh P (1893) fide Hegnauer (1989)

Nahrstedt A, Jensen PS, Wray V (1989) Prunasin-6′-malonate, a cyanogenic glucoside from Merremia dissecta. Phytochemistry 28:623-624

Weehuizen F (1906) Merremia ficifolia, een blauwzuurplant. Pharmac Weekbl 43:907-908

Kaplan MAC, Figueiredo MR, Gottlieb OR (1983) Variation of cyanogenesis in plant with season and insect pressure. Biochem Syst Ecol 11:367-370

Adsersen A, Adsersen H, Brimer L (1986) A semiquantitative screening for the presence of cyanogenic constituents in plants from the Galápagos Islands. Book of Abstracts, 34th Annual Congress on Medicinal Plant Research, Hamburg, Germany, p 33 [complete poster (P29) seen]

Austin DF, Eich E (2001) Synopsis of Stictocardia with another Madagascan species, S. mojangensis (Convolvulaceae) Willdenowia 31:79-85

Jenett-Siems K (1996) Phytochemische Untersuchungen an Windengewächsen der Gattungen Calystegia, Convolvulus, Ipomoea und Merremia unter besonderer Berücksichtigung des Alkaloidvorkommens. Dissertation, Fachbereich Pharmazie, Freie Universität Berlin, Germany

Henrici A (1996) Neuartige Sekundärstoffe unterschiedlichster Struktur aus tropischen Convolvulaceen. Dissertation, Fachbereich Pharmazie, Freie Universität Berlin, Germany

Mann P (1997) Zur Phytochemie und Chemotaxonomie tropischer und mediterraner Convolvulaceen unter besonderer Berücksichtigung des Alkaloidvorkommens. Dissertation, Fachbereich Pharmazie, Freie Universität Berlin, Germany


http://www.bluelight.org/vb/entries/7141-morning-glory-seed-information-archive

 

[Mycophile]

^^^^

I didn't read all of that, but it looks like it's evidence that cyanide doesn't naturally exist in them, which isn't what I was asking because I know that it doesn't.

What I was asking is if the rumors that the government coats them in cyanide or some other kind of poison to prevent people from eating them are true.

 

[red22]

Quotes:


It has been suggested⁶ that the insecticide coating on the morning glory seed might be promoting adverse side effects that have been noted. The majority of commercial seeds are treated with N-tri-chlorete which is a fungicide and seed protectant having a tolerance of 100 parts per million.⁸ Thus, this is quite an inocuous product from the toxicologic point of view and would require ingestion of quantities beyond the capacity of the stomach to absorb, in amounts found as a seed coater, to be considered lethal.⁹ Symptoms involving the nervous system would be lacking if we were dealing only with the effects of this fungicide. Formerly, compounds containing mercury were used extensively as fungicides and there is the possibility that some seeds so treated might pose a toxicologic danger if ingested. This is considered unlikely as the newer seed protectants have been in use for a considerably longer period than the current morning glory fad.

It would seem then, that both the psychological and physiological effects observed in the ingestion of the seed of the morning glory reside in the alkaloids of the seed and not the seed protectant. The LSD-like reaction is most likely due to the LSD-like alkaloids for no pure LSD has as yet been isolated from the seed. As all compounds occurring in the morning glory seed have not been studied intensively enough to inspire confidence in their respective roles, they cannot yet be considered for scientific experimental use much less be used irresponsibly in excitement-seeking self-experimentation.

6. Cohen, S.: Suicide Following Morning Glory Seed Ingestion, Amer J Psychiat 120:1024-1025 (April) 1964.

8. Frear, D.E.H.: Pesticide Handbook, State College, Pa: College Science Publishers, 1963, p 8.

9. Frear, D.E.H.: Personal communication to the author, July, 1964.
JAMA, Dec 28, 1964 • Vol 190, No 13

Ingram AL (1964): Morning glory seed reaction. J. Amer. reed. Ass. 190, 1133–1134. doi:10.1001/jama.1964.03070260045019 (DOWNLOAD)


I just received some seeds that were treated with fungicide maxim apron, I have never planted with treated seeds before, what do you think about health risks? Should i return them?

Thanks,Wendey

Jan 13, 2012 wendeyzee http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/cornucop/msg011631318352.html

here's a cool update for everybody interested in trying this with burpee seeds. As stvip recommended, I emailed the company that made my seeds and this was the reply I got as to my question of: Are the seeds chemically treated at all?:

-----
We do not treat our seed with any toxic chemicals.

Our seeds are untreated and we even have some vegetables in an organic
line.

You can feel free that the seeds you handle will not leave a residue of
toxicity on your hands.

Sue
Burpee Customer Service
-----

08/03/05 MycoMateo http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4490792#4490792


Burpee has NO pesticides nausea stomach discomfort and vomiting is normal on burpee morning glory seeds. (Last year i emailed them and asked) I never got sick off of burpee brand morning glory (flying saucers, heavenly blue)

06/25/07 implee http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7092490#7092490

 

[Mycophile]

I've had whole crushed morningglory once to no useful effects, and done woodrose twice, both whole and cold water extracted, the latter of which made both me and my GF at the time gut-churningly sick.

From what I've read there is no reason that ingesting a mixture of nonselective ergot alkaloids wouldn't have the possibility of inducing nausea. I haven't done an intensive literature review in some time, but from memory I recall that woodrose and morning glory are regarded as less forgiving than purified LSD.

All I know is that I respond way more favourably to isolated LSD; the seeds have been rather insulting in terms of body load and effects, in comparison. Maybe I'm just not invested enough in the idea, or not "holistic" enough. Maybe I have the "wrong" seeds. Maybe I am just cursed? It's just my 2 cents, either way.

Did you actually throw up or just get nausea?

And did you have blurred vision for days like I did?

Unless I can be pretty sure that there's away to be about 95% sure that that won't happen again I don't think I'm going to want to proceed.

Nausea is one thing and even throwing up, so long as I know I'm not in any actual DANGER, just like one might from drinking too much, is something I can stand.

What I don't want is having toxic stuff from the seeds (either natural toxins or coated on them by the govt or whomever) in my body that could be dangerous.

Having blurred vision for 3 days was pretty scary as I never knew if it was going to go away.