The Benzodiazepine Thread v. IV

[psytaco]

A few of you might have remember some posts I made in the past about being diagnosed with ADD at 22. Since then I have been prescribed dexies. I probably take 10 a day as prescribed (Mon-Fri). Works great for concentration, motivation and but at the end of the day I'm burnt out and usually take 1mg of Xanax at around 430 PM.

Basically what risks of physical addiction taking 1 mg a day Monday to Friday?

How much is that risk increased with 2 mg instead of 1 mg (in one dose).

Thanks fellas

There is a good chance if you start taking 2mg xanax everyday for over a few weeks or months then you will become addicted to them and be in a world of pain if you try and stop. Have a read on this thread and look at what the withdrawal symptoms are.

now I'm not your doctor, but I wouldn't recommend increasing your dosage. Consult with your doctor too, but if you are not already addicted it might not be a bad idea to have a few days off xanax a week. that way it is not constantly in your blood stream which will help reduce the chance of addiction.

BTW, 2mg xanax is equivalent to 40mg valium which is quite alot. I had to taper off that amount and was only taking benzos everyday for 2 months. It was very uncomfortable to say the least. If you stick to 1mg then if you do get addicted, coming off it won't be that bad. you'd certainly feel it but it won't be excruciating.

 

[pinkanga]

I would add that theres no need to take 2mg at once unless you really need it for panic or whatever. If youre using xanax like I do (to calm down after dex and for social anxiety) then 1mg is usually fine, but if I take 2 then next time I have any 1mg just doesnt feel like it cuts it. Stating the obvious I know, but if you feel the urge to have 2mg at once just compromise by having 1mg then another 1mg a couple hrs later.

BTW referencing the dex posts above I agree theres no need to be having 50mg dex a day. Thats 10 pills for fucks sake. Ive been on dex for years now and although Ive built up a tolerance I still find 10mg is a satisfactory dose. I prefer 15mg, and if Im sitting down for a fun gaming sess I might indulge and have 20mg with a top up of another 2pills (10mg) an hour or two later. Then thats its for the day. Anything higher and you burn through the months supply too quick and honestly if you arent desperately looking for a stim high then 10-15mg with a nice strong coffee is a nice solution. For me anyway.... I know everyones different.

 

[Ashley]

Fuck australia and there no bulk billing psychiatrists that cause this.

There are psychiatrists that bulk bill, just get your GP to request it also on the referral anyway and some will make an exception.

A.

 

[tyrael]

....Fuck australia and there no bulk billing psychiatrists that cause this.

Initially, if you go see your GP - and obviously explain your situation - they will fill out a Mental Health Treatment Plan. The end result of this is a referral to a psychologist/psychiatrist which will heavily subsidise your visits (via Medicare) for up to 12 visits a year. This is a government program. These visits can be taken in any time frame you feel necessary! If you feel you need 12 visits for 12 days, that'll be fine. Or maybe 1 visit per month. And anywhere in between! This link might help with some information about this program > Fact sheet 24 - Getting help - How much does it cost?.

Following this program as previously said, there are quite a few which do bulk bill. And as Ashley said - and I've noticed this in my experiences with psychiatrists/psychologist - most are pretty flexible! If you explain your situation often they will come to some sort of deal - payment plans, reduced rates, etc. Mine was quite understanding after seeing him and him understanding my mental state at the time and my living/social/financial/work situation(s), we can to an agreement which ultimately meant I could keep seeing him.


(not)Surprisingly after about 5mins search I found these two link - they'll return exactly the same results, just one is text-based and the other a little more graphical (easier to use however I've found it doesn't work in Firefox, so use IE when opening the first link!)

http://info.beyondblue.org.au/MAHP.html

http://www.psychology.org.au/FindaPsychologist/Default.aspx


Good luck and be strong goonbag! There's many BL'er who've been in (more or less) your exact situation and can offer help. At the very least, someone to talk to who've been through, and understand, where you're at!













However, as with any form of help (psychological or pharmacological), if one is an addict than one must WANT to get off the drugs and start living clean. There is absolutely no point going there* if one hasn't come to the realisation - in their own mind - that the way they're currently living is essentially detrimental - to themselves, their mental state, physically, spiritually (if one is), to family/friends/partners, work, etc, etc. - in every way.


* "there" being any place to help overcome an addiction - psychologist, psychiatrist, councillor, GP, and so on.

 

[Halif]

Hey Tyrael, thanks for that post. It's good to see informative posts with very practical links like that.

Sometimes it's not obvious what first steps to take, especially when one's head is clouded in the way that only benzos can. Posts like that can act as a signpost for people who are ready to work their way back to health and clarity, but are not sure where to start.

 

[tyrael]

Hey Tyrael, thanks for that post. It's good to see informative posts with very practical links like that. ....Sometimes it's not obvious what first steps to take, especially when one's head is clouded in the way that only benzos can....

You're right actually. Not just the clouding of the mind due to substance, the psychological state of mind can have a HUGE influence on how one does (or doesn't), the type of help they seek, by which means they obtain and so on!

....Posts like that can act as a signpost for people who are ready to work their way back to health and clarity, but are not sure where to start.

This is true also. Re-reading it does sound a little harsh however tbh I wasn't quite sure in which tone your post was written in (I obviously misread it). It's often hard to discern the posts of (at best. warranted or not.) "just venting" vs. (at worst) dickheads (dick-sizing, winging ["oh why won't x doc give me y drug / z number of scripts / etc"]). My apologies goonbag, you seem to be in the former!




Hey goonbag; If you're from Adelaide, I'm more than happy to help you with help/assist in which direction in seeking help. Alternatively, feel free to hit me up even just to chat if needs be! I'll try to be as much help as I can!

 

[tyrael]

If you want help here. Maybe if we can clear a few things up?

....This is when I really did want to get clean for the first time in a loooooong time....

If you want to get off the drugs - replacement therapies are free! There's really no excuse in Australia not to check themselves into a program to get off substance abuses (if they want to).

....A psychologist and a GP can not work together for patients that have serious drug and other issues....

You're referring to the mis(missed)information which can/does happen between each doctor? Information going missing, lost, mis-explained, etc. right? Obviously every case is definitely different and in many cases this may not work but it can. (By the sounds of it it's not in your situation, right?)

....why don't they make it instead of 16 visits with a psychologist for free (now dropped to 10 a year by the government) 8 and 8 or now 5 and 5 with a psychologist and psychiatrist?....

I haven't heard these number you're referring to. Are you able to link me to/tell me which program this belongs to?

....Because psychiatry is were all the money and drugs are!....

This isn't quite true (for the psychiatrist POV)*. Their prescribing law are the same as "regular" GP's. Of (many) which includes no benefits in 1. scripting anything at all 2. scripting one brand over another (no kickbacks).

....Single GP's can't dose some patients at the level they need.

What do you mean by this mate? Afaik there's no drug your local GP can't prescribe that a psychiatrist can't.**




Edit:
* Unless I misunderstood the question?
** I'm sure someone will find a drug. But I highly doubt in (more than) normal situations they'd be equal.

 

[tyrael]

Yeah I am in the former, I hate being a pill addict almost worse than a regular drug addict....

EVERY drug addict will tell you - it's not [necessarily] the drug [itself], it's the process* leading up to the high!

* This process is generally referred to/by the parenteral (needle) ROA addict but it holds true for all addicts!

This is a well documented phenomena! And part of drug-seeking behaviour(s) and has measurable psychological and physiological response.

 

[tyrael]

Make sense, maybe best for PM

Yup, This all makes sense!

Now what's your question? If seems you've got an understanding of what is available to you in terms of therapy/treatment in your area.

 

[tyrael]

My question is why can't I see a bulk billed psychiatrist without going off the planet and having a psychotic episode that causes involuntary incarceration? SIMPLE really

Not that simple unfortunately! Considering how Aus healthcare is at the moment.

Firstly, someone from your area may be able to give you a list of psychiatrist which can bulk-bill. Stay patient, hopefully someone will come along soon!

Regarding why you can't now. Well; (apparent) low in health care workers/under-staffing, low/redistributed budgets (read: Government), bed shortages, policies/legislation and more I'm sure I can't think of right now!

The problem is, these things exists now and there's nothing which can be done (on the individual level). So....(get a piece of paper if you have you even) layout your options - pros and cons of each (physical and mental; cost, time, duration, effects, efficacy, safety, etc.) (including keep going how you are now). My point being, if you want to stop being an addict, something - whatever this may be - has to be done!


IMHO? At least see mental therapy of some sort! Majority of an addiction is psychological. Fix this - obviously making sure you're 100% entirely honest with the therapist about your addiction - and I'm confident he/she will be able to help you with (at the very least reduce if not cease) your addiction.


Good luck and best of wishes bro!

 

[Hektissity]

Hey guys got a question for ya's. I got some Xanax a while back and im Not sure when it expires and have no way of finding out when it does. Just wondering if expired Xanax could be harmful? Also I'll be having some GHB (1,4-B to be exact) and MDMA tonight and was considering a zany when I got home if I couldn't sleep but I think I saw somewhere GHB and benzo's are a no no? I wouldn't have it until after the effects of the G have worn off but there might still be some in my system so should I not risk it?

 

[rm2x]

Hey guys got a question for ya's. I got some Xanax a while back and im Not sure when it expires and have no way of finding out when it does. Just wondering if expired Xanax could be harmful? Also I'll be having some GHB (1,4-B to be exact) and MDMA tonight and was considering a zany when I got home if I couldn't sleep but I think I saw somewhere GHB and benzo's are a no no? I wouldn't have it until after the effects of the G have worn off but there might still be some in my system so should I not risk it?

Choose one or the other to be safe

 

[Halif]

Yeah, as rm2x suggests, I think the more pertinent issue is mixing GHB and Xanax.

As far as I know there isn't any risk in taking old alprazolam (Xanax). Perhaps the efficacy will be lessened if it's ancient but I don't think those things can go off like food.

 

[Hektissity]

Thanks guys I'll stick with the safer option

 

[Ashley]

I love my new psychiatrist.

There is 150 2mg alprazolam tablets in that photo, I am swimming in them.

A.

 

[Ashley]

I don't know your experiences, but go easy with no blister packs its hard to keep track of how many bars you go through, I've started a small journal so I know everytime I take one plus I'm trying to regulate to only 6-8mg's a day.
I hope they work for you and help you with getting off the H (I hope my memory is right about reading something like that you wrote)

I appreciate your concern goonbag. You're not wrong, it's very easy to lose track of how many bars you go through. These days I will take maybe 10mg tops, a few times out of a script and then get rid of the rest because I if I take them, I usually end up in a cell or a hospital. I used to have a severe addiction to alprazolam, for at least six months my ex and I were consuming 50mgs of alprazolam a day. I kept having tonic clonic seizures and waking up in hospital or on the pavement somewhere bruised and battered, finally kicked that habit about 12 months ago. Now I just stick to diazepam to manage my day-to-day anxiety.

Cheers,

A.

 

[opi8]

If my anxiety isn't being treated by my current prescription, what's the best way to tell my doctor I'd like to try a higher dose? I feel too anxious to bring it up, which makes it a problem. I can't very well go into the doctor drunk, which would be my normal approach.

 

[Halif]

If my anxiety isn't being treated by my current prescription, what's the best way to tell my doctor I'd like to try a higher dose? I feel too anxious to bring it up, which makes it a problem. I can't very well go into the doctor drunk, which would be my normal approach.

I'll chime in for this one because I've read opi8s posts for ages and believe he's asking out of genuine need.

If you have been seeing the doctor for a while and have a civil rapport, I think honesty* is the best approach. Tell your doc that although the current prescription has had some benefit, it simply isn't enough (or isn't the right one) to adequately maintain a level of functionality which can see you continuing your day to day requirements.

The second part of your post which I quoted I think is relevant information. I was lucky enough to recently find a reasonable GP who listened to what I said and prescribed diazepam, which I asked for directly. The consensus that we came to was the it was ultimately better and safer in the short term for me to use diazepam than to self-medicate with alcohol.

*honesty does not necessarily mean telling every single detail which could end up being counterproductive if it's recorded. For instance, I told my reasonable doctor that I had been drinking excessively as a way of dealing with anxiety, when in truth I had been using opiates rather than alcohol. Good doctors have to consider the repercussions of what they prescribe and will be encouraged to help out if they can see that you honestly want to better your life and that the current self-medicating (with legal drugs) is not sustainable. I don't see any benefit in introducing illegal drugs into the discussion unless you have a very special, open-minded doctor who you have great trust in.

I don't want to put this information here as a way to help people doctor shop or pressure their doctors into writing scripts for things they don't really need. But I think it helps to know a bit about the GPs perspective, because I've had way too many cases where I was in genuine need of something and was dismissed by a GP and given some unhelpful and unrealistic advice which indicated that they didn't believe anything I'd said. Those moments are very, very frustrating and can make you want to rush out and stock up on illegal drugs in an attempt to take control, but that can quickly get out of hand.

Anyway, if the mods feel this post in inappropriate or would have been better sent by PM, just delete the post and let me know for future reference.

 

[tentram]

^i don't see anything wrong with that post. it's what anyone should do, really. people seem to be inherently scared into asking their doctors for a rise in dose especially when it comes to benzo's and opiates and it shouldn't be that way. you're already halfway there with the script, you just have to bring up the matter to him and discuss the options.

otherwise pick up a slab or bottle of his liking, sit down for a few and get to know him better on your next visit

 

[opi8]

Thanks for the replies.

What pisses me off is the fact that I went through years of jumping through hoops, being treated like a sub-human, prescribed a bunch of totally useless anti-depressants, when my scores on the mental health thing never showed any depressive symptoms, just anxiety. Finally I was referred to a psychiatrist, followed by regular psychotherapist sessions, and the psychiatrist (after two very high cost sessions which I can't afford) prescribed me diazepam as he obviously is more of an expert in this kind of thing. I thought that was it, but no, the never ending merry-go-round of political doctors being scared of prescribing drugs to patients in need goes on.

Doubt I'll be heading to my GP with a slab or a bottle though, but thanks for the thought!