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Taking smart drugs

Tronica

Executive Director
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Location
Castlemaine, Australia
NEWS: 27.2.10. Ritalin is students' new drug of choice for parties and studying

Hi Aussie Bluelighters

I've just been speaking with Deborah Snow from the Sydney Morning Herald who is preparing a feature article about the use of smart drugs for cognitive enhancement in Australia.

She's keen to hear from anyone who has any experience with smart drugs. Any comments/stories would remain anonymous, of course.

You can email her at [email protected]

cheers,
Tronica
 
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erwoid's definition "Nootropics or Smarts Drugs are chemicals which are claimed to have mild to moderate positive mental or physical effects such as improvements to memory, cognition, and clarity of thought or "anti-aging" effects. "

ginko biloba i have found is beneficial for memory/study. although perhaps its just placebo. either way i dont care as long as i feel better.
 
^no

face pointed out a few examples.

others would include 5htp/l-tryptophan, etc etc.

check out the erowid vault and you'll have a better idea
 
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Deborah was also interested in the use of pharmaceuticals for studying.

Using drugs for recreation is the usual fodder for media, so I think it's interesting to look at use for other reasons as well.
 
Be very careful with these journos. Although smh shouldn't be soo bad. But they do like to misconstrue and sensationalise...

Don't give permission to have your name printed; you might end up regretting it.
 
can't access erowid from work :\

perhaps I will check the list later.

I reckon fish oil should be included... best damn smart substance ever ;)
 
Yea she'll probably most likely want to focus on the ADD and Alzheimer's meds.
Haven't had any experience though sorry.
 
A fairly balanced article IMO. My comments didn't make it into the article in the end (Deborah's focus was a bit different to what I was able to contribute). Next time ;)

I like the way this article canvasses both sides of this debate. While there are short term gains to be had by using these drugs to study, we don't know the long term effects and we haven't had an open discussion here in Australia about what we should do about the ethical implications of drug-assisted studying. Should it just be like any other enhancement (eg. a faster computer, a better internet connection, a smart phone?) or should it be treated like 'doping' is in sport?

Ritalin is students' new drug of choice for parties and studying

Deborah Snow
February 27, 2010 - 3:00AM

''BILL'' turned a corner when he started taking Ritalin three years ago. He had dropped out of high school, had a narrow brush with the law, and was facing an uncertain future.

A mate who had been diagnosed with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder gave him some Ritalin to try.

He liked it. He felt steadier, more focused. When he returned to school after a break of several months, he got a script, sailed through final exams and amazed his parents by getting into the university course of his choice, where he is now doing well.

Bill's was a success story.

But some of the other students at his Sydney school were not using their prescribed drugs the way their doctors intended. Instead they found a ready market among classmates, who were prepared to pay $1 or $2 a pill, sometimes up to $5 a tablet, depending on the strength of the dose, the Herald has been told.

Another former student recalls seeing a group of his classmates at one New Year's Eve party crushing Ritalin tablets to ''snort'' for a buzz.

Little wonder this widely prescribed drug has won the nickname ''kiddie cocaine''.

On university campuses, the trade seems even more widespread.

Hard data in Australia is almost non-existent. But anecdotally, increasing numbers of university and college students are acquiring ADHD drugs under the table to give themselves a brain boost.

''Karl' is studying psychology at a Sydney university. He said that among his circle, the use of ADHD drugs for non-prescribed purposes was ''very prevalent''.

And it was not just ADHD drugs they were using to get them past a deadline, through an exam, or to compensate for a weekend of hard partying.

They were also buying other cognitive enhancers over the net: drugs such as the sleep-inhibitor modafinil (sold as Provigil in the US) and selegiline, which is most often prescribed for sufferers of Parkinson's disease. Ian Hickie of the Sydney University Brain and Mind Research Institute says: ''We are unsure about the extent to which [so-called 'smart drugs'] are being used covertly in the Australian higher education environment. There has been no open dialogue about it here, as there has in the US, so there has been no systematic investigation.

''But we would be naive to think it wasn't happening.''

In schools there is even more ignorance about what is happening. The NSW Teachers Federation said the issue was not even on its radar, though schools had procedures for dealing with illegal drugs.

Ritalin is one of the two pharmaceutical stimulants most commonly prescribed for ADHD in this country, the other being dexamphetamine (known in the US as Adderall). More than 600,000 scripts a year are being doled out for these medications in Australia.

Until recently ADHD was seen as a childhood disorder but there is a growing trend for it to be diagnosed in adults as well.

There is also a substantial group who started on the drug in primary school, staying on it through adolescence and into young adulthood.

The more widely available the drugs have become, the greater the risk that they will be diverted to non-prescription or ''off-label'' use.

Iain McGregor, the professor of psychopharmacology at Sydney University, says: '' If you are a normal person using it, there is no doubt that there is short-term cognitive enhancement to be had.''

But because of the close pharmacological relationship of Ritalin and dexamphetamine to illegal stimulants, such as ice, methamphetamine (speed) and cocaine, there is also potential for addiction and abuse.

Ritalin is ''uncannily like cocaine in terms of what it does in the brain'', Professor McGregor said.

Overseas there has been an increasingly heated debate about the ethics of healthy tertiary students using prescription drugs such as Ritalin or Adderall to do better at their studies.

A Cambridge University neuropsychologist, Barbara Sahakian, has even raised the prospect of universities applying ''dope tests'' for those sitting exams.

Others argue that popping a pill to sharpen the brain should be seen as no different to other things people do to give themselves a cognitive leg-up.

A Stanford Law professor and neuroethicist, Henry Greely, took this line in Nature magazine just over a year ago, arguing that drugs such as Ritalin and Adderall ''should be viewed in the same general category as education, good health habits, and information technology - ways that our uniquely innovative species tries to improve itself''.

Professors McGregor and Hickie are having none of it.

Both point out that there is very little research on the long-term effects of pharmaceutical stimulants, particularly in people with normal brain function.

Professor McGregor says the National Drug and Alcohol Research Centre should be looking at the prevalence of non-prescription use of ADHD drugs.

''If you are chopping up Ritalin tablets or dissolving them and injecting them or snorting them, you are more or less taking the same risk as someone doing cocaine or amphetamines intravenously or intra-nasally.''

There are other risks when these drugs are diverted from their intended use, such as using them to prolong drinking binges.

Professor Hickie wants universities to move towards an agreed ''industry position'' or code of conduct on the use of so-called smart drugs, for health and equity reasons. Do they give some students an unfair advantage?

But some see the wider advent of these types of drugs as inevitable. As Professor Sahakian told The New Yorker recently, ''We are a society that so wants a quick fix''.

This story was found at: http://www.smh.com.au/national/rita...e-for-parties-and-studying-20100226-p953.html
 
Given the article you printed and what you were told the article was about. You can probably understand the reluctance of providing your name.

Ritalin (methylphenidate) is a psycho-stimulant. Although available by prescription, its effects are not very well differentiated in animal test models[1][2]. In fact, I would go as far as saying that methylphenidate has as much abuse potential as Cocaine.

I would be interested in reading about methylphenidate IV, as to whether it produces the same reinforcing effects as cocaine IV.




[1] - http://biopsychiatry.com/methcomp.htm
[2] - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10403500
 
Given the article you printed and what you were told the article was about. You can probably understand the reluctance of providing your name.

Is this comment addressed at me? I should have made it clear that I chatted with this journalist in my capacity as a research fellow (about drug use trends). In that context I'd be very happy to have my name in print :)

I've learnt through this exercise how people's definitions of drug classes differ wildly. It would be good if people were using vaguely the same language, but when so many media reports use incorrect drug language, it's no wonder!
 
I would be interested in reading about methylphenidate IV, as to whether it produces the same reinforcing effects as cocaine IV.

You're not meant to IV methyphenidate are you?

I've never bothered to extract it, which you would need to do in the first place (I know the binders are nasty-as & potentially harmful for them there veins)...

Though having done cocaine IV on a few occasions, I doubt methylphenidate IV could even compare.
 
Tronica do you think that Deborah was being misleading by asking about smart drugs, when she was doing a report on ADD medication? Or that she considers those two to be one and the same?

For me smart drugs would be stuff like Modafinil or similar. Actually I dont know enough about methylphenidate to say whether I would consider it a smart drug or not.

Personally I havent tried methylphenidate for studying but found dexamphetamine to be a wonderful substance for increasing my verbosity during my university years.
 
No deliberate deception in my opinion. Her definition and the definition used here (and on Erowid) are different. I think the term 'smart drugs' has been used by popular media to mean anything that might be used to assist with study.

Erowid defines them as:
Nootropics or Smarts Drugs are chemicals which are claimed to have mild to moderate positive mental or physical effects such as improvements to memory, cognition, and clarity of thought or "anti-aging" effects.

It's certainly the case that some people use dexamphetamine, Ritanil or Modafinil to study. Whether or not use of dexamphetamine, Ritalin or Modafinil 'improves cognition' in healthy people and would therefore qualify as smart drugs, as per Erowid's definition, is another matter.
 
im quite interested on the topic of "smart drugs"
that being - the list provided on Erowid...

i would be interested in another who has experience in any of them and has anything to share?
are they worth the trouble?
did you find them beneficial?
and were they expensive in retrospect?

thankyou
:)

on a side note: would taking these smart drugs (particularly the ones circulating around memory/intelligence) affect my dopamine levels?
as i am already prescribed stimulants for adhd, and do not wish for my tolerance to increase or put increased strain on my dopamine stores...
 
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i would be interested in another who has experience in any of them and has anything to share?
are they worth the trouble?
did you find them beneficial?
and were they expensive in retrospect?

Do a search and you'll find many threads here on nootropics.


on a side note: would taking these smart drugs (particularly the ones circulating around memory/intelligence) affect my dopamine levels?
as i am already prescribed stimulants for adhd, and do not wish for my tolerance to increase or put increased strain on my dopamine stores...


Some of the more stimulating smart drugs will increase dopamine levels, but also may be contraindicated with methylphenidate. I'd strongly suggest talking with your dr before starting anything else, and as you probably know already, he/she will probably advise against it. I hate sounding like the old wowser again, but you really should think seriously about placing priority on getting through this tough year of school. Mixing stimulants is unlikely to make this any easier in the long term IMHO, and if you want to be relieved of your adhd symptoms, it's best to give one form of treatment a decent go.
 
cheers PD
yes i shall definitely talk my doctor before attempting any of my thoughts...
i guess you kinda bring to my attention the fact that mixing of similar drugs is not a wise move :\
haha

i dont plan to take *actual* stimulant medication for adhd forever
so this may be better to commit to memory for later in life use

i was looking at piracetam and selegiline in particular..
 
Selegiline is a MAOB inhibitor at lower dosages and both A & B at higher doses
(~10mg+). MAOB is important in the catalysis (breakdown) of dopamine and noradrenaline. IMO it is definitely not advisable to take selegiline with ritalin, but if you're that keen, please first acquaint yourself with this thread and all the terms therein.
 
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