suicide- whats the big deal.

[itsok]

honestly, i dont mean to be mean or callous. I am writing this because I have suicidal ideation often and am depressed. I dont mean to urge anyone to take his/her life. This is kind of theoretical (since im not actually going to kill myself soon am without specific plan), so mods, if it doesnt belong here then feel free to move.


Can I ever get the OK to do it?

ppl move on, they always do. if someone is in pain, or if his/her being alive causes alot of pain, then why cant they just go? pretend they moved away to a tropical paradise.

ppl treat ppl like shit, kill animals, hurt each other, and stop communicating w each other (move on).

and what about living an honorable, pleasurable, good quality life?

im not seriously suicidal, but i think of it all the time.

tons of ppl die all the time. so what if i decide to go? consider it psychological euthanasia for community/familial reasons. what if i had my family and close friends blessing bc they see how much pain i was in. would i get BL's blessing too or is it just not the socially acceptable thing to say?

suppose i have no goals and feel no excitement, no matter how good i have it and what i have. and suppose i tried everyone's remedies at a happy life for like 2 decades, could i get excused then?

ppl say life is sacred and say ppl will be sad and I think they'll be sad for a little while and then move on bc they have to deal with life. see in order to functionally live, u have to let go.

 

[Sublimo]

It's you're live, you're decision.

 

[InhaleDeep]

Well, I think one of the problems with this logic is that many people who attempt suicide don't actually want to die, it's more of a cry for help when everything else has failed.

 

[Doomed2pain]

I feel the same in reality. I know my family would feel pain but I also know that if I had a life threatening illness or whatever then they would be open to euthanasia

It isn't fair that mental illness isn't treated the same way. I would end my life in a heartbeat

I know I'm not meant to think this way but I do


What is the point of endless suffering?

 

[Thou]

This is more of an existential/philosophical question than a cry for help. P&S is better apt at dealing with these matters.

I've already made my decision that when the time comes I'll die by my hands and mine alone, but that will be some time from now. It matters to people because people are terrified of change, and don't fully embrace impermanence and death as an inevitability imo.

 

[Sublimo]

I've already made my decision that when the time comes I'll die by my hands and mine alone, but that will be some time from now. It matters to people because people are terrified of change, and don't fully embrace impermanence and death as an inevitability imo.

This is exactly the way I think about it.

 

[badfish45]

Not the place man...I don't think that you understand what psychologically goes on behind the mind of a suicidal person. Their perspective of life is completely blinded because of depression, it's hard to feel like you will ever move on, depression literally traps you in your mind. It's not a bad post, but it really needs to be moved.

 

[Dave]

Agreed. Moving it over now.

My two cents: I think that euthanasia should be fully legal, but in cases of depression, social malaise and the like it is a horribly inappropriate response. There are valid, workable treatments for many mental maladies, that would allow one to live a full and happy life. It's glib, but the saying that suicide is "a permanent solution to a temporary problem" is something that rings very true for me.

As a little background, I've attempted suicide (admittedly, half-assedly in all but the last attempt) three times, and have struggled with depression and a couple anxiety disorders for about 25 years.

 

[Doomed2pain]

Fair enough Dave. What if it was coupled with a physical problem though?

 

[itsok]

hmmm, i have witnessed lots of physical miracles. like my friend w no brain waves and waking up from a coma totally fine 3 months later. and when in coma, as i have been in one, i didnt feeel any pain, i felt nothing (didn't know i was an entity). but real life has so much pain.

i guess also, if anyone is young, then i personally think they have hope and shouldnt commit suicide.

however, if i have had lived a satisfying life, was somehow in excruciating pain for more than a decade after trying for a decade doing everything right, then i would want the blessing from the ppl i care about to end my life. or in my case, as a tortured long term opiate addict, if i keep failing treatment and cant move to a compassionate country a receive legalized care, then instead of torturing my loved ones, i think they would want me to go. maybe they would be too polite to say it, but when i am apart from ppl i know bc we dont communicate much or else it is strained. so im kind of entertaining suicidal ideation -- the reason why so many long term opiate addicts commit suicide, even ones that have homes and seemingly good lives to an observer.

i understand that often a cry for suicide is a cry for help. i suppose if i really were to go, i wouldnt hint at it at all to anyone, tell anyone, and just do it suddenly, hoping to get peace and bring peace.

 

[CoffeeDrinker]

There's something about it that seems just...naive, or narrow minded....I've tried it before too. One somewhat serious attempt to gas myself in the garage, and one half-assed attempt at overdose/alchohol poisoning. Echoing Dave, not only is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, it's not even the only solution there is. You can do literally anything with yourself. We are "free to do anything we wish to do but die."
If you are feeling so low down, so down and out, so defeated, why not trying to look around you for a change, instead of focusing obsessively on the necessarily limited train of thoughts that you have inside of you? When your situations don't change, and you lock yourself away from the world, then your thoughts will hardly have reason to change. Therefore once you come to the thought of "hey I can end this pain right now" That becomes an overly obsessive pattern that will inevitably repeat itself until it seems like it's the only solution, but who says it's the only solution? How many other solutions have you really tried?

Would you feel suicidal if you were skinny dipping with some amazing exotic chick in a hot tub? I highly doubt it, for most people who think of killing themselves. As long as you don't have any gross birth defects then you can get laid with relative ease, the only problem lies in your own mind telling you that you cant for whatever reason.

Life is hard. That's something that everyone has to face, but it's a situation that can be mitigated by o many different solutions. Artistic output seems to help a lot, as does talking to good counselors, taking meds...ehh I guess it depends on the meds, but most meds for depression don't really work by themselves. Usually it's the meds that the medical community shies away from regarding depression, that really works...the illegal drugs. Oh they work, alright...

As far as the opiate problem, it's certainly a vice, but if taking it prevents worse vices, then I see nothing wrong with being dependent on it. It's not the worst thing in the world to be an opiate addict, it's certainly nothing to let define you, it's simply a habit that changes brain chemistry in a finite, though progressive, way. Suboxone worked wonders for me, and I don't see myself as an addict any more because I'm not doing the same dumb stuff that a person does when they have no money and a horrible craving for a drug. I'm still physically addicted to the opiates though, but it takes no time out of my day and thought process to satiate that physical desire anymore, and, therefore, I don't put any unnecessary extra thinking towards that. I'd really be in a sorry state if I hated myself for taking suboxone...life is hard enough is it is. Everyone wants to find a career that suits them perfectly, though no profession may exist that does so, and that's why people have hobbies, they have extra curricular activities, they fill their lives with things that interest them.

Suicidal thinking is the end of one stage of growth, and often leads to great things for a great many people. I wouldn't kill myself because death is inevitable anyway, so why bring it on early when you could be doing SO SO many things? You can be anything you want to be, and you can do anything you want to do, and you can say anything you want to say, and you are unique, and you have something worthwhile inside of you, even if you aren't aware of it at this very moment. That's why I wouldn't ever think of killing myself again. And my life is still hard.

 

[herbavore]

I have never subscribed to the idea that suicide is "selfish". I believe each of us has a right to decide whether we want to continue living for whatever reason--physical or psychological. It will cause lasting pain to those left behind, but by the time someone truly decides to end his or her own life s/he has had to detach from the realities of others and exists solely within the essential self. In other words, I don't think a person in that state is even capable of thinking of others. (this does not apply to people that advertise they are going to commit suicide--then it is a cry for help and human connection and should be treated as such.)

I have also never seen suicide as necessarily motivated by hopelessness (although it might be). A person might believe that whatever lies beyond this existence is something and that he or she is ready to go on into that mystery rather than remain in a life mired in pain; so then it is actually hopefulness that it will be better after death.

These beliefs of mine have been intensely tested by the death of my son by overdose. There will always be lingering questions about his intentions. The pain his death has caused is not theoretical. It is real. So there is no way that you would be "bringing peace" to your family. Even knowing that my son has left a world that caused him often unbearable pain and that he now exists either in some way free of that pain or simply does not exist at all is very little comfort, if any. In fact it often tortures me because I remember his capacity for joy and lightness. But here is where I come full circle back to my beliefs--my pain and my son's pain are not the same though they are inextricable. My pain derives from the fact that I believe my son could have gained control of his addiction, could have created a life that felt right to him. But his pain was his--what could I or anyone know of it ?

itsok, I do want to point out two things that strike me about your question. The first is that you assume that because relations are strained and there is little or no communication with your family that this means they are just too polite to say that they would be better off not having to think about you. I am sure that this not only a false perception fueled by your own feelings but is dead wrong. Of course there is strain. It is not easy for you to live with your addiction and all the ramifications it engenders and it follows that it is not easy for anyone who loves you to live with it either. However, the discomfort and pain of dealing with their feelings about you does not translate into them being better off without you. The exact opposite is true--one of the hardest things for them to live with is the fear of you dying.
Secondly, you ask much when you ask for the blessing of those who love you. They have hope for you. Addiction is different from a terminal disease. It is possible to recover even after multiple attempts that failed. It is possible to treat depression and anxiety, and even far trickier mental disorders. It is always possible that time alone can change an outlook which in turn changes reality. How could anyone who loves you ever be expected to agree with you?

On the one hand you are asking a philosophical question and people can and will weigh in with their beliefs or by trying to imagine a hypothetical situation to form beliefs. But you are also bringing in the messiness of real life where we are confronted with the reality of what you are talking about--the real you and your very real family; and that is where philosophy fizzles into a little puddle and disappears. The reality is that no matter what I believe about my son's right to determine his own life, no matter how much I can understand the need for him to free himself of pain, I would choose a lifetime of pain, his and mine, over not having the incredible person he was exist at all. And without knowing you, I can say that I hold the same hope for you; because even though these are just words on a page, you are a real person to me. The philosophy of this subject and the reality, for me, exist about as far apart as my son and I now do.

 

[itsok]

^i'm sorry to head about ur sadness over ur's son's decision to end his pain.

TBH, my family tells me pretty frequently in all seriousness (not when they are angry) to kill myself (for a good year maybe a bit longer), but not do it in the house.

They said that they are so ashamed of having a drug addict as their daughter and if I dont get 100% clean (which means zero relapses), then Im out of their life, whether Im dead or not they have run out of patience to care. My sister pretty much stop talking to me since she found out I was an addict and she is an ER doctor and we used to be close.

I'm not actually going to do it anytime soon because i've been working hard at getting my life together. But some days I dont feel great and if the topics of drugs or a craving or potential relapse is in conversation, my parents pretty much tell me in unison to kill myself and that the world would be a better place. They think that living as a slave to an illegal drug is not a way to live if I cannot break free of the addiction anytime soon.

I'm not upset at them or their remarks. They are deeply disappointed and pissed that they have given me opportunities to live a good life and I fucked it up. They just dont understand. They think u decide to quit and u r done. Unfortunately, a ten year habit just doesnt disappear overnight, but they regardless of how good I'm doing, one slip up after six months, to them is equivalent to a daily addiction; there is no progress in their eyes. Anyway, just kinda of clarifying where this is coming from.

Anyway, i have a few close friends that say they would be sad, but i know they would move on. And my family would be relieved and would be relieved for me as well. I know I have to live for myself and not my family. But I guess it was first disturbing, and then kind of comforting that I am free to take my life with their blessing later, if I felt too miserable and exhausted and hopeless to continue.

 

[freddy47]

^That's really messed up that your parents would say stuff like that to you. You got to make them understand that addiction is not that simple and that telling you to kill yourself isn't helping anything or anyone. Just because they feel ashamed of you or are disappointed in you does not give them the right to push you towards suicide. That's just wrong IMO.

You're a long term addict sure. And right now it sounds like to me that that is all your parents see. But you are also a human being and it seems to me that your parents have forgotten that, and whats worse is that they have convinced you that all you are is an addict and nothing more. But for what its worth I'm telling you right now that you are more than just an addict. You are a human being who deserves to live just as much as anyone else. If everybody killed themselves just because they're parents were disappointed in them for one reason or another the world population would be incredibly smaller.

No one has the right to tell you your life is not worth living not even your parents. I don't care how good to you they were in the past. What you need now is help and love and your parents need to get that through their heads.

I wish you all the best.

Peace.

 

[herbavore]

Wow, itsok, your parents are selfish and unbelievably cold. freddy is so right that regardless of what they did for you earlier in life, telling their own child to kill themselves is despicable and IMO their problem (the inability to be decent human beings not to mention parents) is far worse than anything that you could ever do because of addiction. And I hope that I never end up needing to be treated in the ER by a doctor as uncaring as your sister. I am mortified by your family's level of callousness and getting away from them is probably the best thing you could do for yourself. No matter how old we are when we are with our families we see ourselves through the lens of their perception of us to a degree. Your family's despicable perception that your life is doomed and worthless is coloring your perception. How could you even begin to do the hard work of healing when these people are not only not supporting you but are undermining your very sense of self?

You are a very kind and forgiving human being to say that they just don't understand addiction and therefore you do not hold them responsible for their behaviour. I know that understanding addiction was something that I had to work at and that I made many mistakes with my own son from ignorance but never did that ignorance change the fundamental tenet of the parent/child relationship---I loved him unconditionally. That is what your parents are charged with doing from the moment of your birth. Their failure to do this is their failure and has nothing to do with your addiction at all.

I am glad that you clarified that you have actually spoken to your parents about this and heard them say these things, otherwise I would have wasted your time trying to convince you that no parent could ever feel that way. I am still in shock but I understand that your experience is very different. While I can understand your feeling that suicide would be a release for you and for them, I can only reiterate that anything that you can do to sever their connection to your life will be a release for you in and of itself.

I'm not upset at them or their remarks. They are deeply disappointed and pissed that they have given me opportunities to live a good life and I fucked it up.

When you were born, you gave your parents the opportunity to have one of the deepest and most meaningful relationships we humans can experience. You gave them opportunity after opportunity as you were growing up to grow in love and acceptance and understanding. They have failed and are failing to do that. You have now turned the disappointment that you must feel in their inability to be decent parents in on yourself. I hope that you will do whatever you have to do to get out of their house which is one of the most toxic environments I have ever heard of. You deserve love and support and treatment. Relapse is be expected. It is not failure but a part of the process for most people.

so much love and respect to you, itok.

 

[ninjadanslarbretabar]

suicide can be a good thing and it is and has being socially accepted here and there
samurai would do it for honor, kamikaze would do it to win the war
you have cell in you that kills themself via aptoptosis "For example, the differentiation of fingers and toes in a developing human embryo occurs because cells between the fingers apoptose; the result is that the digits are separate."
we usually look down on suicide because we want people to be strong, and if it doesnt seem like its done for the better good of the whole then its seen as a sign of weakness
but from your own personal point of view if you are in a world of pain then you are just trying to make things better for yourself by removing the pain, you kill the disease by killing the host, but it aint the host you have problem with its the situation you are in, and you may find a way out or you may not, you may stay in a world of pain until you die, in either case you will die so on one hand why prolong a suffering that inevitably will end in death, on the other end you are gonna die anyway so why bother causing it yourself?
imo there is nothing wrong about killing yourself because there is nothing right about life, what is right and wrong is of your own making, its subjective, you create those notion via your body in conjunction with your mind, but you create the notion of suicide the same way, and so does culture
so there is no big deal unless you make a big deal out of it, and in this case the op made a thread about it because it is a big enough deal to him to make a thread about it.
it is a big deal to people because survival has being the game we have invested our living self into for billions of year, thats what we are as a organism, we are program to survive, and thats why people are non accepting or uneasy about suicide, it shows a weakness about themself that they dont want to look into, but then out of survival and evolution we ended up with the ability to create a abstraction with our minds out of the world, but that word inside your head isnt the real world, its a abstraction of it,

...what im trying to say is that suicide isnt a problem, it can be a good thing and its being seen as a good thing here and there, but even tho suicide isnt a problem depression is, which in this case is what the op was talking about
so there is two thing here, killing yourself for the good of others and killing yourself for your own good, the problem with the second option is that you aint helping yourself because there is no more yourself to help after you "helped" yourself, so its imo a illusion that its gonna help
but still its a personal choice that imo you should be allowed to make and i think that the whole idea that you should not be allowed to kill yourself and that we should have laws about it is actually making it worse, it doesnt help, it makes the situation harder to those suffering to make it easier on the minds of those who arent
but its still your choice and your decision should be respected by others if they can respect who you are (not just who they want you to be)

 

[CoffeeDrinker]

^i'm sorry to head about ur sadness over ur's son's decision to end his pain.

TBH, my family tells me pretty frequently in all seriousness (not when they are angry) to kill myself (for a good year maybe a bit longer), but not do it in the house.

They said that they are so ashamed of having a drug addict as their daughter and if I dont get 100% clean (which means zero relapses), then Im out of their life, whether Im dead or not they have run out of patience to care. My sister pretty much stop talking to me since she found out I was an addict and she is an ER doctor and we used to be close.

I'm not actually going to do it anytime soon because i've been working hard at getting my life together. But some days I dont feel great and if the topics of drugs or a craving or potential relapse is in conversation, my parents pretty much tell me in unison to kill myself and that the world would be a better place. They think that living as a slave to an illegal drug is not a way to live if I cannot break free of the addiction anytime soon.

I'm not upset at them or their remarks. They are deeply disappointed and pissed that they have given me opportunities to live a good life and I fucked it up. They just dont understand. They think u decide to quit and u r done. Unfortunately, a ten year habit just doesnt disappear overnight, but they regardless of how good I'm doing, one slip up after six months, to them is equivalent to a daily addiction; there is no progress in their eyes. Anyway, just kinda of clarifying where this is coming from.

Anyway, i have a few close friends that say they would be sad, but i know they would move on. And my family would be relieved and would be relieved for me as well. I know I have to live for myself and not my family. But I guess it was first disturbing, and then kind of comforting that I am free to take my life with their blessing later, if I felt too miserable and exhausted and hopeless to continue.

What do they know about anything anyway?

I guess you're just going to have to support yourself, that's what a parent is supposed to prepare their children for anyway. I guess they are just showing you the hardness of life first-hand, but let me tell you that not everyone is as cold as they are. Why not try to get a psyche doc who does suboxone? It might not be ideal, but it's better than having cravings and withdrawals and an endless need for drug-money. From a harm reduction standpoint it's far more preferable than just trying to go out and cop every day. Then you can free your time up to the point where you choose your actions rather than merely reacting to the random events of life.

It's pretty sick that they came to this conclusion IMO...how old are you?

 

[freddy47]

suicide can be a good thing and it is and has being socially accepted here and there
samurai would do it for honor, kamikaze would do it to win the war
you have cell in you that kills themself via aptoptosis "For example, the differentiation of fingers and toes in a developing human embryo occurs because cells between the fingers apoptose; the result is that the digits are separate."
we usually look down on suicide because we want people to be strong, and if it doesnt seem like its done for the better good of the whole then its seen as a sign of weakness
but from your own personal point of view if you are in a world of pain then you are just trying to make things better for yourself by removing the pain, you kill the disease by killing the host, but it aint the host you have problem with its the situation you are in, and you may find a way out or you may not, you may stay in a world of pain until you die, in either case you will die so on one hand why prolong a suffering that inevitably will end in death, on the other end you are gonna die anyway so why bother causing it yourself?
imo there is nothing wrong about killing yourself because there is nothing right about life, what is right and wrong is of your own making, its subjective, you create those notion via your body in conjunction with your mind, but you create the notion of suicide the same way, and so does culture
so there is no big deal unless you make a big deal out of it, and in this case the op made a thread about it because it is a big enough deal to him to make a thread about it.
it is a big deal to people because survival has being the game we have invested our living self into for billions of year, thats what we are as a organism, we are program to survive, and thats why people are non accepting or uneasy about suicide, it shows a weakness about themself that they dont want to look into, but then out of survival and evolution we ended up with the ability to create a abstraction with our minds out of the world, but that word inside your head isnt the real world, its a abstraction of it,

...what im trying to say is that suicide isnt a problem, it can be a good thing and its being seen as a good thing here and there, but even tho suicide isnt a problem depression is, which in this case is what the op was talking about
so there is two thing here, killing yourself for the good of others and killing yourself for your own good, the problem with the second option is that you aint helping yourself because there is no more yourself to help after you "helped" yourself, so its imo a illusion that its gonna help
but still its a personal choice that imo you should be allowed to make and i think that the whole idea that you should not be allowed to kill yourself and that we should have laws about it is actually making it worse, it doesnt help, it makes the situation harder to those suffering to make it easier on the minds of those who arent
but its still your choice and your decision should be respected by others if they can respect who you are (not just who they want you to be)

Dude no offense but I think your comparison of the Samurai and what itsok is going through is kind of different to say the least. itsok is not some ancient Japanese warrior bound by a code of honor. She is a normal modern day person with an addiction and her parents are telling her to kill herself because they are close minded and callous and (No offense to you itsok) kind of assholes.

I agree with you that yes suicide is a choice and the decision should be made by the individual. But IMO itsok would be making a bad decision if she decided to kill herself just because her family is ashamed of her.

Again itsok you are from what I can tell a kind and forgiving person and more than "just an addict". You shouldn't worry about what your parents think or your sister. If they can't accept you and love you unconditionally then they don't deserve to call themselves your family.

I know quitting heroin can be tough. I've been clean for all of 6 months now and I still think about shooting up sometimes. When my parents found out they were ashamed as well and I felt like I them down to. But if my parents had told me to kill myself because of their shame I would have told them to go fuck themselves.

 

[ninjadanslarbretabar]

^

This is more of an existential/philosophical question than a cry for help. P&S is better apt at dealing with these matters.

the thread has being changed to a different forum, so im not talking about itsok directly im dealing with the "existential/philosophical question" as thouart_that as put it

 

[Chainer]

honestly, i dont mean to be mean or callous. I am writing this because I have suicidal ideation often and am depressed.

This would be called unhealthy, and from a general philosophical standpoint, would be your SWB scale is abnormally low. There are interventions to help get you back to baseline and avoid depressive symptoms. Thats neither here nor there.

Can I ever get the OK to do it?

According to Epicurous, Aristotle, and several others, only in the scenario where it is better to die then to survive - extreme cases like the "amplified pain chair- " where you will never again experience any pleasure, never again be able to reach any achievement (what SWB says is the root of happiness, achievement). It's not our goal in life to simply die, This is addressed by the notion of God, the observation of nature, the adaption of our minds, our ability to reason with a higher level of consciousness, and our rationality.

ppl move on, they always do. if someone is in pain, or if his/her being alive causes alot of pain, then why cant they just go? pretend they moved away to a tropical paradise.

I read a while ago about happiness requiring a certain subpoint - the absence of great misfortune. E.G., you win the nobel peace prize, and at the same time, am given news that your family has all died in a plane crash. What do you feel? Happiness? Certainly not, but why not? You just won the nobel peace prize! No, it's because your current mindset, a great misfortune that will take significant time to "heal" - to return to baseline.

The notion of pretending they moved away to a tropical paradise is absolutely insane. That's just a lie, misinformation, worse then a horrible truth. If you have no concept of morality, no concept of utility, and no concept of social justice, then perhaps you can make this argument - but even still, not well. Even if we are all mechanical beings with no purpose in life (roughly M. Heidegger), what evidence do you have that we SHOULD kill ourselves during hard times? None, but anecdotal, which is a lack of evidence in any way.

ppl treat ppl like shit, kill animals, hurt each other, and stop communicating w each other (move on).

and what about living an honorable, pleasurable, good quality life?

im not seriously suicidal, but i think of it all the time.

"A man can be measured on the way he treats animals."

" The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated"

Happiness is not an emotion, it's fleeting experience. It's ultimately our goal to further both the length and power of such happiness by whatever responsible means we have, isn't it? (Think Socrates / Aristotle / Seigmann etc etc etc "middle road")

tons of ppl die all the time. so what if i decide to go? consider it psychological euthanasia for community/familial reasons. what if i had my family and close friends bless

That decision lacks any sort of morality on your part whatsoever. If your death would prevent the birth of Hitler, then perhaps you could argue some logical premise to me that would make SOME sense, but I don't see it.

Premise A: If I kill myself, I will be absent of this suffering *in this life, so far as I know*
Permise B: Killing myself will result in more favorable things then if I were to live.
Permise C: If I kill myself, I will bring great misforutune to my friends and family, I will be doing myself disservice by voiding future experience.
Arguement A: Killing myself cannot promise further happiness, and in fact will reduce any chance I have at SWB to nothing, as well as doing damage to people I care for.

Here is one of my favorite quotes regarding this topic:

Fish is what I want; bear's palm is also what I want. If I cannot have both, I would rather take bear's palm than fish. Life is what I want; yi is also what I want. If I cannot have both, I would rather take yi than life. On the one hand, though life is what I want, there is something I want more than life. That is why I do not cling to life at all cost. On the other hand, though death is what I loathe, there is something I loathe more than death. That is why there are dangers I do not avoid . . . . Yet there are ways of remaining alive and ways of avoiding death to which a person will not resort.

In other words, there are things a person wants more than life and there are also things he or she loathes more than death.

I hope this wall of text helped, or was read.