Opioids Suboxone Vs. Morphine tolerance settings

[halflifelover123]

I have used opiates for the past twenty years, and recently have engaged suboxone for its stability potential. However, I don't like the fact that after crossing, in my subjective opinion, the 2-4 Mg euphoria potential, I cannot feel satisfied. I understand that pharmacologically the drug has a ceiling effect at 32 Mgs, and I do not wish to debate that. Subjectively, I feel the high, for me, ends at around two-four milligrams, and so I have decided to cut back in order to obtain euphoria. I also do not care about moral judgements, so send those to the cockroaches. I was wondering, in a hypothetical situation, were someone to be taking about 3 Mgs of buprenorphine with naloxone, and having had taken that for approximately four to five months, were they then to stop for about four days and begin taking morphine.....is there a formula for cross-tolerance? How do I know where my tolerance is at when I switch drugs? I mean...for safety. There has to be a general guideline right, or is one just to fumble? A person I know, such is the nomenclature, wishes to take 90 Mgs or morphine, and has done so before, but I wonder as to where your tolerance would really be....once the receptors have been mostly emptied after seventy-two hours, would it be to right before you began the suboxone regimine, or would it be equivalent to some formula????? Please help. No judgements, please, that really doesn't help, and I have no tolerance for it LOL.

 

[hatrix]

The naloxone in the suboxone has extremely little to no effect on the high. It's literally just there to scare people.

For doses under 2mg of buprenorphine, it's primary active metabolite, norbuprenorphine, acts as a full agonist on the opiate receptors. When you exceed 2mgs, buprenorphine takes over. This is why in general, for someone with low tolerance, doses under 2mgs are going to be more euphoric and a better high, since norbuprenorphine is a full agonist while buprenorphine is only a partial agonist. Exceeding 2mg is generally a waste in the case of lower tolerance, and will only prolong the high.

For conversion, just find an opiate conversion table/guide. Your tolerance isn't going to lower much in 72 hours, so you should have no problem taking the equivalent of your buprenorphine dosage as morphine. However, if you have been taking the buprenorphine regularly at the dosages you say, you are more than likely physically dependent. You will go through withdrawal once the buprenorphine leaves your system. It has a half life of 20-70 hours, so it may take a few days or so to go into withdrawals. I'm not positive on that though.

For reference, 10mg of morphine should be equal to about 0.3mg of buprenorphine. So your dosage of buprenorphine should be equivalent to about 100mgs of morphine. Of course, this all varies depending on ROA.

 

[halflifelover123]

Thanx. So yeah, I have taken varying amounts of different opiates for varying amounts of time throughout my life, but this last episode has been about six months, mainly buprenorphine/naloxone, keeping below the 2Mg dose where I see a marked falloff in euphoria. Now I went nearly 32 hours after my last dose of buprenorphine/naloxone, and intentionally made this dose small, something along the lines of .5 mgs, just enough to take the edge off. A couple of questions: if buprenorphine has an active half life of up to 72 hrs, then having taken it for as long as I have, even in very minute doses, wouldn't there be some residual buildup and overlap of that half-life, eventually hitting the 32 mg ceiling threshold? Aside from that, these were MS Contin 30 mgs, I took 90 MG PO, it's been about 40 minutes and I feel very little, though the mild onset of withdrawal is gone. I'm wondering if Ms Contin has a long duration of onset, I don't want to re-dose and have it kick in very hard in two to three hours and info I found elsewhere online was contradictory in places. And, so let's say I end up titrating the dose up, is it possible the buprenorphine is "blocking" the morphine, and so I may not notice euphoria but the other sedative properties will come into play? Or is the fact that 90 mgs isn't doing it more of a factor of tolerance, so even if all the buprenorphine were to be eliminated, would I still require higher levels of this drug? Apologies for all this obfuscated questioning, what I'm going for is to increase dose to a pleasurable level in the safest manner possible. I'd hate to not be able to finish working on my novel tonight because I ended up passing out. In terms of what type of dose I'm looking for, I have never liked nodding out. I like the sort of talkative, increased-ambition, euphoric high without massive amounts of sedation. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I''m scanning the forum for answers, but am very new, and as such, I'm lost LOL.

 

[halflifelover123]

I have never had the luxury of morphine, except for once when I was a youth, and then my tolerance was so very low I can't make any determinations off of it. Thanx again for the above reply and any further assistance.