Captain.Heroin
Bluelight Crew
My Wall of Text - I need to get away from the computer.
I don't know, I haven't gotten off of Suboxone completely yet. People report the whole WD may last as long a 3 to 8 weeks (1 to 2 months), so best of luck. If yo'ure dosing every 3rd day you're a lot better off than taking it every day, so you shouldn't get too bad of WD symptoms, but if you can at least taper your dose down a little before you get off (maybe wait 3 days, 6mg, wait 3 days, 4mg, wait 3 days, 2mg, wait 3 days, do that a few times, then jump off compeltely.)
I would expect the withdraw/hangover/burn-out period after Suboxone to last at least 2 weeks, if not longer, though it may not be that long if you taper right. The duration, the intensity and severity of the symptoms, and your ability to get through it comfortably or not depends on how you taper, what your dose was, your previous opiate use history, how addicted physically/psychologically you were to your previous opiates or to buprenorphine itself (yeah, some of you might not think it's possible to have a problem with buprenorphine but I have met people who like it more than heroin for its euphoric/anti-anxiety properties and as a better opiate overall, I am not kidding nor am I talking about myself)... and importantly environmental influences/tolerance/cues and craving. There are some other factors that are more dependent upon your biochemistry or your environment that I left out to hit the major ones.
Some people say quitting buprenorphine is easy, much easier than quitting short acting opiates (heroin, dilaudid, etc) whereas there are other people who find it more difficult to quit taking it. Whether or not this includes myself I do not know at this point but I doubt I will find it difficult to quit, who knows though? I've suspected both depending.
I think it's important to remember that we're all unique individuals and we vary quite a bit in so many different ways I couldn't list them all here feasibly. All of these unique traits we have influence how one will experience drugs, drug withdrawal, being high, etc. There's a reason a lot of people have a varied taste in drugs and no two people have the exact same drug preference for every drug (if they did this would be a very rare coincidence indeed, or it would reflect drug preferences of identical twins I would bet, though even then that would be a very rare occurrence I believe).
Then there's the problem that a lot of people decide not to use drugs either because they are scared, because some of them are illegal, because of one reason or another, because most of the best drugs are illegal, a lot of people will not get to experience all/any of them for one reason or another.
There are some of us who haven't had problems finding what we please, and yet others would amaze even me what they can find (there are so many rare, new psychedelics, uppers, RC's, you name it - it's insane now a days - the days of Substance D are coming!).
Basically what I'm trying to say is some people are more susceptible to the comedown/negative feeling/shitty side effects of some drugs/drug classes, and others seem to have some sort of protection against this (my example would be not everyone gets "comedowns" from mild cocaine use, myself included).
I got off topic...excuse me. (my brain's left hemisphere slaps the right hemisphere)
Because of this and many more reasons, there's no telling what quitting for you could be like. Someone like me would have a hard time if I tried quitting 8mg every 3rd day without tapering at all, though there are other people (...maybe yourself? Only you can find out) who could quit taking 8mg every 3rd day without a day of feeling bad (obviously if they haven't been doing it that long....and probably as well if they had an inefficient way of sublingually using the tablets and a lot of it ended up orally ingested?) or WD symptoms. I have been amazed how many some days people have used heroin with me (they snorted at least as much as I did, maybe a tad less since they typically had a low tolerance) without getting any comedown/addictiveness and only getting afterglows. Given this was a year ago and I no longer use heroin, I still think that though some people are likely to become addicted to heroin/other opiates when exceeding a 3 day window of heroin/other opiate use (and obviously some would be addicted before the 3rd day), there are obviously those who used heroin longer/much longer than 3 days and still managed to avoid addiction.
So really, I guess the best way to sum up this post would be "your mileage may vary (YMMV)", I will put it this way. It'll likely be a prolonged withdrawal (lasting longer than a OC taken orally or heroin withdrawal, and much longer than a dilaudid/other shorter acting opiate wd), however it should be easier to quit than other opiates are. This may or may not be what you find, others have found it easier to quit off of responsible doses of lighter potency shorter acting opiates (codeine, DHC, tramadol, hydrocodone, etc...) however I personally believe my withdrawal from buprenorphine (which doesn't say much about you however) will be easier than heroin by far. I would feel SO depressed the day after I run out of heroin, and I felt like I could do nothing. It was a very bad feeling. If it's been a while since I've used buprenorphine, it's not nearly as bad. If it's been a very long time, the most I get is mild WD symptoms (less symptoms than the flu), whereas the equivalent amount with heroin (even if I snorted the H as I did 99% of the time, which for me had a longer duration than a standard dose of Suboxone has on me now). What you'll go through may be much different, similar, better, or way worse than what I will go through (and I am not WDing from buprenorphine yet). I have also been on buprenorphine for over a year and a half, so I don't seem to have the same "killer WD" symptoms some do after the same duration of buprenorphine use.
To be honest man, I would just stash the extra Suboxone and not tell your doctor about it. Some people need to raise their dose as they continue maintenance (though the common experience is that you'll lower your dose as you continue maintenance, while a few other people will keep it at the same dose throughout). If you don't submit a UA I don't think your doctor will be able to be aware how much Suboxone you take.
Well put Tim...mmyy. You summed up what I couldn't because I'm overly verbose at times.
I think using 8mg every 3rd day is a pretty responsible regimine, minus the fact that 8mg is kind of a high dose (though, the fact you are taking 8mg at a time might be why it lasts you about 3 to 5 days, which might be the most efficient way for you to consume buprenorphine). I am sorry if this is a touchy subject for you, but what is "the way you used to be" and why would you rather kill yourself than go back there? I think it's rather responsible you can foresee the consequences of your actions (some full grown adults still struggle with this), and I also would like to say that I think your plan to taper or quit before letting drug use get the better of you (either now, or again) is a great indicator that you'll be able to actually get sober. It shows self control and discipline. Even if I used a high sublingual dose of buprenorphine it wouldn't last me every 3rd day, so I think you're doing a good job thus far.
If you think using Suboxone every 3rd day is what you have to do though, and quitting is worse than using Suboxone, don't hesitate to get back on it if you believe that you are OK on it. If you aren't OK on it then obviously eventually get off and don't get back on, but that's just my 2 cents.
Not everyone has it in them to be a responsible drug user and the fact you can call it quits is a good thing.
*About the insomnia* I have always had sleep problems (ironically only heroin allowed me to sleep a perfect 5-7 hours of rest each night and wake up feeling OK long enough to do more H). Try out hydroxyzine or any other antihistamine (they all vary a bit in effects, doxylamine knocks me out very hard, hydroxyzine allows me to pass out when I'm ready to though it is moderatley sedating, and some people like diphenhydramine hcl, though I'm not the biggest fan). Benzos work well for sleep too but they can be addictive to some people (I don't find them addictive personally, though others find them very, very addictive).
I don't know, I haven't gotten off of Suboxone completely yet. People report the whole WD may last as long a 3 to 8 weeks (1 to 2 months), so best of luck. If yo'ure dosing every 3rd day you're a lot better off than taking it every day, so you shouldn't get too bad of WD symptoms, but if you can at least taper your dose down a little before you get off (maybe wait 3 days, 6mg, wait 3 days, 4mg, wait 3 days, 2mg, wait 3 days, do that a few times, then jump off compeltely.)
I would expect the withdraw/hangover/burn-out period after Suboxone to last at least 2 weeks, if not longer, though it may not be that long if you taper right. The duration, the intensity and severity of the symptoms, and your ability to get through it comfortably or not depends on how you taper, what your dose was, your previous opiate use history, how addicted physically/psychologically you were to your previous opiates or to buprenorphine itself (yeah, some of you might not think it's possible to have a problem with buprenorphine but I have met people who like it more than heroin for its euphoric/anti-anxiety properties and as a better opiate overall, I am not kidding nor am I talking about myself)... and importantly environmental influences/tolerance/cues and craving. There are some other factors that are more dependent upon your biochemistry or your environment that I left out to hit the major ones.
Some people say quitting buprenorphine is easy, much easier than quitting short acting opiates (heroin, dilaudid, etc) whereas there are other people who find it more difficult to quit taking it. Whether or not this includes myself I do not know at this point but I doubt I will find it difficult to quit, who knows though? I've suspected both depending.
I think it's important to remember that we're all unique individuals and we vary quite a bit in so many different ways I couldn't list them all here feasibly. All of these unique traits we have influence how one will experience drugs, drug withdrawal, being high, etc. There's a reason a lot of people have a varied taste in drugs and no two people have the exact same drug preference for every drug (if they did this would be a very rare coincidence indeed, or it would reflect drug preferences of identical twins I would bet, though even then that would be a very rare occurrence I believe).
Then there's the problem that a lot of people decide not to use drugs either because they are scared, because some of them are illegal, because of one reason or another, because most of the best drugs are illegal, a lot of people will not get to experience all/any of them for one reason or another.
There are some of us who haven't had problems finding what we please, and yet others would amaze even me what they can find (there are so many rare, new psychedelics, uppers, RC's, you name it - it's insane now a days - the days of Substance D are coming!).
Basically what I'm trying to say is some people are more susceptible to the comedown/negative feeling/shitty side effects of some drugs/drug classes, and others seem to have some sort of protection against this (my example would be not everyone gets "comedowns" from mild cocaine use, myself included).
I got off topic...excuse me. (my brain's left hemisphere slaps the right hemisphere)
Because of this and many more reasons, there's no telling what quitting for you could be like. Someone like me would have a hard time if I tried quitting 8mg every 3rd day without tapering at all, though there are other people (...maybe yourself? Only you can find out) who could quit taking 8mg every 3rd day without a day of feeling bad (obviously if they haven't been doing it that long....and probably as well if they had an inefficient way of sublingually using the tablets and a lot of it ended up orally ingested?) or WD symptoms. I have been amazed how many some days people have used heroin with me (they snorted at least as much as I did, maybe a tad less since they typically had a low tolerance) without getting any comedown/addictiveness and only getting afterglows. Given this was a year ago and I no longer use heroin, I still think that though some people are likely to become addicted to heroin/other opiates when exceeding a 3 day window of heroin/other opiate use (and obviously some would be addicted before the 3rd day), there are obviously those who used heroin longer/much longer than 3 days and still managed to avoid addiction.
So really, I guess the best way to sum up this post would be "your mileage may vary (YMMV)", I will put it this way. It'll likely be a prolonged withdrawal (lasting longer than a OC taken orally or heroin withdrawal, and much longer than a dilaudid/other shorter acting opiate wd), however it should be easier to quit than other opiates are. This may or may not be what you find, others have found it easier to quit off of responsible doses of lighter potency shorter acting opiates (codeine, DHC, tramadol, hydrocodone, etc...) however I personally believe my withdrawal from buprenorphine (which doesn't say much about you however) will be easier than heroin by far. I would feel SO depressed the day after I run out of heroin, and I felt like I could do nothing. It was a very bad feeling. If it's been a while since I've used buprenorphine, it's not nearly as bad. If it's been a very long time, the most I get is mild WD symptoms (less symptoms than the flu), whereas the equivalent amount with heroin (even if I snorted the H as I did 99% of the time, which for me had a longer duration than a standard dose of Suboxone has on me now). What you'll go through may be much different, similar, better, or way worse than what I will go through (and I am not WDing from buprenorphine yet). I have also been on buprenorphine for over a year and a half, so I don't seem to have the same "killer WD" symptoms some do after the same duration of buprenorphine use.
To be honest man, I would just stash the extra Suboxone and not tell your doctor about it. Some people need to raise their dose as they continue maintenance (though the common experience is that you'll lower your dose as you continue maintenance, while a few other people will keep it at the same dose throughout). If you don't submit a UA I don't think your doctor will be able to be aware how much Suboxone you take.
Well put Tim...mmyy. You summed up what I couldn't because I'm overly verbose at times.
I think using 8mg every 3rd day is a pretty responsible regimine, minus the fact that 8mg is kind of a high dose (though, the fact you are taking 8mg at a time might be why it lasts you about 3 to 5 days, which might be the most efficient way for you to consume buprenorphine). I am sorry if this is a touchy subject for you, but what is "the way you used to be" and why would you rather kill yourself than go back there? I think it's rather responsible you can foresee the consequences of your actions (some full grown adults still struggle with this), and I also would like to say that I think your plan to taper or quit before letting drug use get the better of you (either now, or again) is a great indicator that you'll be able to actually get sober. It shows self control and discipline. Even if I used a high sublingual dose of buprenorphine it wouldn't last me every 3rd day, so I think you're doing a good job thus far.
If you think using Suboxone every 3rd day is what you have to do though, and quitting is worse than using Suboxone, don't hesitate to get back on it if you believe that you are OK on it. If you aren't OK on it then obviously eventually get off and don't get back on, but that's just my 2 cents.
Not everyone has it in them to be a responsible drug user and the fact you can call it quits is a good thing.
*About the insomnia* I have always had sleep problems (ironically only heroin allowed me to sleep a perfect 5-7 hours of rest each night and wake up feeling OK long enough to do more H). Try out hydroxyzine or any other antihistamine (they all vary a bit in effects, doxylamine knocks me out very hard, hydroxyzine allows me to pass out when I'm ready to though it is moderatley sedating, and some people like diphenhydramine hcl, though I'm not the biggest fan). Benzos work well for sleep too but they can be addictive to some people (I don't find them addictive personally, though others find them very, very addictive).
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