Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ and Megathread v.1; 2007 - 2010

[Syd_Barret]

Am I just in the minority here? But I always read about people having trouble kicking bupe or methadone.. I've never had a problem tapering myself off of suboxone..

It seems to me like a lot of it must be psychological.

Whenever I used to taper I'd taper roughly 2mgs a day..
Say I started at 6mgs, then taper to 4mgs, then 2, and then 1, then I'd prolly take 1mg but wait an extra 24 hours before I'd take my usual dose..
and then nothing.
No wds, no fuss

 

[HighonLife]

am I the only person who doesn't notice any blockage from Suboxone? It seems whenever I'm on Subs I can get high off a very small amount of heroin without needing to "shoot through" the block. Even when I'm using a ton of heroin and I start a bupe induction, after really large doses of bupe I can still get high off the normal amount of heroin I use. It's really weird. Anyone else have this experience with bupe?

i havent really noticed a blocking effect

though CH covered this in this thread a page or so ago, it seems that if one uses 2mg a day or less, or some other small dose then the blockade effect is much less pronounced or something like that he said

which makes sense to me because i have only experienced this blockade effect once n this was the 2nd day i was on Bupe. i took 8mg the 1st day then 8mg the 2nd day then prob 8 hours after my 8mg dose on the second day i tried snorting 80 mg of oxy n i felt diff, maybe slightly high but not really euphoric n that was the really only blockade effect i have had

since then i try to only take 2mg a day that way if i decide to i can get high. i know this is counter productive for actually trying to get off Opes but i just find it soo hard to except the idea of never using again.

 

[boxcut3]

Yea, I can take like 32mg+ and still get high without noticing a block. I'm starting to wonder if my body just rejects Subs altogether because of some of the problems I have had with it. Oh well....

i havent really noticed a blocking effect

though CH covered this in this thread a page or so ago, it seems that if one uses 2mg a day or less, or some other small dose then the blockade effect is much less pronounced or something like that he said

which makes sense to me because i have only experienced this blockade effect once n this was the 2nd day i was on Bupe. i took 8mg the 1st day then 8mg the 2nd day then prob 8 hours after my 8mg dose on the second day i tried snorting 80 mg of oxy n i felt diff, maybe slightly high but not really euphoric n that was the really only blockade effect i have had

since then i try to only take 2mg a day that way if i decide to i can get high. i know this is counter productive for actually trying to get off Opes but i just find it soo hard to except the idea of never using again.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

do you really believe that doctors out there would prescribe oxycodone to someone on maintenance? particularly for the explicit purpose of a transition from one maintenance drug to another maintenance drug? i understand your reasoning as to why it would be better in theory but realistically what doctor would do that? i wish my bupe doctor would gimme some oxy. but thats a fat chance of ever happening

Yeah man, it does happen. One of the BL'ers here was getting OC from a doctor, admitted they were slamming it and were there to score pills, and they STILL got a script.

Not all methadone prescribing/dispensing physicians would give out oxycodone to switch from methadone to buprenorphine (others would go with hydrocodone), but those that do are doing a good job.

Whatever small amount of oxycodone they do give you will be just enough to take off the edge of the methadone WD while you wait for the drug to get out of your system.

A Suboxone doctor isn't going to prescribe oxy - it's easy to go from Suboxone to Methadone - you don't need an intermediary short acting opiate.

i think doctors can get their medical license taken away for prescribing opiates to addicts.

No, that's just simply not true. That's ridiculous. There's a long outstanding history of doctors prescribing addicts drugs.

am I the only person who doesn't notice any blockage from Suboxone? It seems whenever I'm on Subs I can get high off a very small amount of heroin without needing to "shoot through" the block. Even when I'm using a ton of heroin and I start a bupe induction, after really large doses of bupe I can still get high off the normal amount of heroin I use. It's really weird. Anyone else have this experience with bupe?

You need to take 8mg or more to get any sort of actual blockade effect going, and that's for someone without a serious opiate tolerance.

I never got a "blocking effect" from Suboxone either. At the right dose, it seems to potentiate a dose of opiates nicely.

Am I just in the minority here? But I always read about people having trouble kicking bupe or methadone.. I've never had a problem tapering myself off of suboxone..

It seems to me like a lot of it must be psychological.

Whenever I used to taper I'd taper roughly 2mgs a day..
Say I started at 6mgs, then taper to 4mgs, then 2, and then 1, then I'd prolly take 1mg but wait an extra 24 hours before I'd take my usual dose..
and then nothing.
No wds, no fuss

I find it really easy to lower my dose, but the WD symptoms can be very unpleasant, especially if abruptly discontinuing the medication, or if you are coming off of a high dose.

It is mostly psychological once you've tapered properly with buprenorphine. There are some lingering physical WD symptoms but they are very light, though long lasting (compared to hydromorphone or heroin WD)

since then i try to only take 2mg a day that way if i decide to i can get high. i know this is counter productive for actually trying to get off Opes but i just find it soo hard to except the idea of never using again.

It may seem counter productive, but I liked going back and forth from 2mg suboxone once a day to heroin and back, because that way there was still an ability to "choose" what you want to do without "having" to go down one road or the other.

After a while I got tired of using dope and I eventually stuck to buprenorphine.

Overall, if you still can choose not to get high on the days you can't afford it or don't want to or are busy, that's a step in the right direction.

Yea, I can take like 32mg+ and still get high without noticing a block. I'm starting to wonder if my body just rejects Subs altogether because of some of the problems I have had with it. Oh well....

Perhaps you have up-regulated your mu-opioid receptors to the point where 32mg isn't your ceiling dose.

 

[boxcut3]

I've never heard of this before. Do you have any more information? I'm really interested because it makes sense to me and it would be great to get more info on it. I heard from someone once before that people who go on and off Subs while using their DOC sometimes have problems later on with the Subs not working properly. It makes sense because when I first started Subs the induction went perfectly. It stopped the WD entirely and curbed the cravings. Now I'm lucky if it even reduces the WD at all.

Perhaps you have up-regulated your mu-opioid receptors to the point where 32mg isn't your ceiling dose.

 

[KnowBudz]

Without starting yet another thread, I'd be interested to hear of folks who have been successful in getting their Suboxone doc to switch them to cheaper generic subutex.

I posed the question and got the response I expected: that "guidelines indicate Subutex is to be used for induction or for pregnant women". It seems the manufacturer has a huge financial disincentive to offer a generic suboxone while they are legally allowed to squeeze addicts for the outrageous price of Suboxone. Someone said they heard something about "an inability to perfect the buprenorphine/nalaxone formulation" but I have been unable to verify that.

As it stands, suboxone continues to exceed $6.00/8mg, and MMT tops $100/week locally. At those prices, the addict is often able to procure street drugs at less cost than pursuing treatment....a shining example of the effect of government interference in the medical process.

 

[aysen]

i finally kicked for over a month of subs.. the wds on subs are just as bad and taperin is bs.. take it for what its worth but ijust had to do a month of it

peace all

 

[Cheech73]

I've been on 40mgs of methadone for about 4 months. I was at 70mgs a year ago. My doctor has been slowly tapering me off it. I was curious about suboxone myself, but I know nothing about it, nor does my Doctor know much about it. I was @ 70mgs on a methadone clinic prior to getting it prescribed from my Doctor. My Doc is doing it as a favor to my Dad, because they are friends and I was sick of paying $70 a week at the clinic and having to go there everyday. My question is: Does anybody have experience with switching from methadone to suboxone and what is the best way to do it... I kinda want to get of this Methadone, but don't trust myself to be totally drug-free...I don't want to start using heroin again basically... I've been off and on heroin and in and out of jail since 1997, because of my addiction and the Methadone has kept my life "stable" the last 3 years. ANY suggestions would be appreciated.. THANKS

 

[KnowBudz]

There are myriad posts on BL about the methadone > suboxone switchover. I suggest you look them up, read them, THEN ask for clarification.

 

[Brose]

new to bluelight (lurked for years).

ive been on suboxone for just over 2 years. last time i saw my doctor he was kind enough to inform me that there was a generic subutex available for much cheaper. so i made the switch.

ive always known that he is very smart about harm reduction but this just cemented it for me. he warned me about the potential for abuse and implied that he'd much rather see a generic suboxone become available.

i learned from reading this board that there is no difference between subutex and suboxone when it comes to abuse potential, but that makes no difference to me. ive been happy with 4-8mgs/day sublingually for a long time.

 

[Cheech73]

Oh ok, I'm new to this. I'll have to check it out then...

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Without starting yet another thread, I'd be interested to hear of folks who have been successful in getting their Suboxone doc to switch them to cheaper generic subutex.

I posed the question and got the response I expected: that "guidelines indicate Subutex is to be used for induction or for pregnant women". It seems the manufacturer has a huge financial disincentive to offer a generic suboxone while they are legally allowed to squeeze addicts for the outrageous price of Suboxone. Someone said they heard something about "an inability to perfect the buprenorphine/nalaxone formulation" but I have been unable to verify that.

As it stands, suboxone continues to exceed $6.00/8mg, and MMT tops $100/week locally. At those prices, the addict is often able to procure street drugs at less cost than pursuing treatment....a shining example of the effect of government interference in the medical process.

I don't want generic subutex; talc in my lungs is a no-go.

However, it would be impossible to get my doctor to switch me - he doesn't believe in the existence of Subutex.

Kind of like how some people deny the existence of Jesus Christ, but ONLY if Jesus Christ were alive and here for us to eat/snort/shoot/and sublingually dissolve parts of his body on an all day/every day basis.

If you want to get clean, get good health insurance. Sadly enough, that and the PAP are the best things that can be offered for someone facing to pay $6 per pill, because to hunt down the doctor who will prescribe generic Subutex will take a lot of money and/or time, plus it'll make you look like drug-seeking (even if you explained it was to save $ - not for other ROA's, etc) - too much ignorance is prevalent in our society.

 

[KnowBudz]

As always, it seems mis-info is rampant. Apparently, the perception that it is illegal and/or unethical to prescribe generic subutex is false if some patients are successfully changing over. I've checked some bupe forums and the comments are all over the place. In the end, we as patients making the effort to remain clean are dangling from strings.

Outside of large metro areas, choices of doctors licensed to prescribe bupe is quite limited. I read somewhere that out of the few available docs, the biggest percentage are not taking new patients. Coupled with all the insurance restrictions, switching docs or plans isn't really an option.

 

[Eight0Eight]

Down to 1.2mg/day already.

Problem is.... I find subutex BORING AS FUCK - and my uni bursary comes through to my bank account in a few hours (almost 500 quid).

I can almost smell a relapse.

Sweet, sweet relapse...

 

[down508]

Hey i was wondering if whether you have to prove opiate dependence in order to get a suboxone script. i understand this is unethical because of the limit on how many patients a doctor can treat, but i dont plan on doing this often.

i got a free one today from somone who gets them scribed but i accidently swallowed it and judging from how i feel now id love to see what its like to let a full one dissolve

 

[Eight0Eight]

If you have no tolerance and was given a whole Suboxone pill - then you are lucky you fucked up and swallowed it. Especially if it was an 8mg pill. That shit could have killed you.

Yeah, my clinic made me give a urine test before I got a script. If they didn't then any arse-hole and his mother would be getting scripts just so they could go out and sell the stuff.

Why not just BUY one from this guy you know? Or spend $10 on a bag of smack. Far less hassle, expense and probably safer to.

Sub isn't really a good drug to be fucking with if you aren't already addicted. Its too strong, and from what I understand, doesn't give a particulary good high.

 

[down508]

the thing is that a perc 30 around here is X bucks, any junk around here will be stomped all over, and a 12 mg sub is only X bucks. just seems more economic

 

[StaffWriter]

I don't want generic subutex; talc in my lungs is a no-go.

That's why you should take it under your tongue.....

 

[Eight0Eight]

the thing is that a perc 30 around here is 30 bucks, any junk around here will be stomped all over, and a 12 mg sub is only 10 bucks. just seems more economic

Yeah, but a GP isn't going to script you just one pill. You will end up paying for shit loads - as well as the cost of the appointment.

Not that you would get that far, once the GP sees your piss test results and realises that you are clean.

*BTW - 12mg sub? don't even think there is such a thing. The strongest I know of is the 8mg pill.

 

[down508]

it was a subutex, that what he said the dose was i'm no expert on this shit.

and eight oh eight thats pretty funny actually, because i feel like i did a perc. i can only imagine how fucked i'd be if i did a whole pill. is 8 mg enough to hold off a person with a 300mg oxy habit a day? because if so then fuck me silly i did get lucky