Bupe SUBOXONE after 6 YEARS on day 8 NO subs, using Kratom. Advice??

[roxi2873]

All you people who are 4-5 days in with no subs are gonna be in for a rude awakening pretty soon. I was taking about 1-2 mg of sub every other day when I jumped off. after 5 days i had minor WD symptoms, RLS muscle soreness, cramping and minor hot/cold but it was basically just uncomfortable. I thought it would be a breeze, then day 8 came and it was the worst withdrawal ive ever had. Literally most of my day was spent in the bathroom on the toilet with a bucket in front of me to puke in. And it just would not end. Tried Keaton thinking it would at least help.... nothing. After about day 11 no subs I couldn't take it anymore and bought a gram and some Oxy 30s and some mscontins. Even after all that time I still couldn't get high, but it was enough that I could sleep. I tried shooting through the bupe trying to feel a rush but couldn't feel it at all. The only thing that saved me after I did all the full agonist opioids I had bought and the sub withdrawal started coming back again was high dose loperamide. I found that 30-40mg of loperamide was enough to make me feel normal again. After doing that for about 2 months I decided to snort a bag of heroin and fucking overdosed so bad I nearly died. Blood work at the hospital showed fentanyl so it was either a fentanyl powder or cut with fentanyl but the point is....as soon as I tried heroin again after finally getting the bupe out of my system and was just maintaining on 30mg loperamide ever2 days i ended up overdosing. Now I'm back on subs again but only taking about 2mg a day since I wasn't even dependant on anything other than Imodium when I overdosed. To me, being back on bupe is worth it so I'm not craving dope anymore and I know I can't use dope because I won't feel it anyway.

 

[Zerwas]

Anyone who comes off 1mg or less of sub and acts like they are dying and truly cant tough it out have never had to kick a 'Real Habit'. Not trying to dicksize nothing like that but coming off 1mg of sub isn't much compared to a heavy habit kick.

I have to disagree with you here. That totally depends on the individual addiction story, length of use and doses etc. You can't generalize it like that. Everybody reacts differently.
For example: My withdrawals from a 1mg habit tapered down to ~0,5mg were extremely intense. About 5 Days of constant puking and unable to eat anything, barely able to keep water in, insomnia & anxiety, general feeling of wanting to die etc. Followed by about 1 week of a little less symptoms and another 2 weeks of slightly gtting better every day.
It was the worst experience of my life and I never did H or higher potent opioids before being on the Subs. Only Tramadol, Codeine, DHC, Kratom and Tilidine.

So it bugs me a little bit to read something like that. I think it is great when people can taper and quit with Subs without much problems but that does not mean everybody does

OP: How are you at the moment?

 

[Prescottdave]

I have had to go through a number of tough WD's from poppy pods, H or fent. Opiate replacement drugs including buprenorphine are up their in my worst physical experiences DC'ing opiates even after long tapers. Bupe WD's are not as intense but the sleep problems are just as bad and last twice as long. Just for anyone trying to "dicksize" regarding a so called real habit. Alot of how my body reacted to opiates was based on time of use. For me it's almost 17 years.

 

[PdoubleE]

suboxone withdrawl is worse than any opiate

Thank you guys! I'm still using the Kratom. I've brought my grams down to 8, then 6 and so on. I'm very scared and nervous when I'm down to 2 grams then nothing. Am I going to go thru withdrawals still? Obviously anybody that's been thru withdrawls knows that's what we're trying to AVOID at all costs. Just such a mess I feel like I've been in. I'll never get over being on methadone (2005-2010) then suboxone 2010-2016. That's 11 years for a 2 1/2 yrs addiction.

suboxone withdrawal doesn't last very long and isn't all that bad IMHO. I stopped cold turkey after being on 8mg/day for about 6 months; i experienced a little bit of withdrawal, but nothing too major. Kratom works wonders for opiate w/d doesn't it? I'm a true believer in it and would recommend it to anybody trying to taper off an opiate/opioid. Keep up the good work!

I have been on 20mg of bupe since 2004. I'm down to 12mg. I have never experienced w/d like bupe before. The only thing that has worked, is my prime care putting me on Ms contin For 6 months, and I was supposed to do an ibogaine treatment. Well the 2700$ went into someone arm and my prime care no longer trusts me, and back on suboxone. I believe this is the easiest way I have tried. I was down to 60mg a day of mscontin, and felt sober. I am going to approach this again once I find a doc willing to script me morphine. Kratom has never done a thing for me, immodium has done more.

 

[Donald_Flint]

Long story quickly as I can. Started in 2002 Just from 2.5mg Percocet. I jumped straight to eating Fentanyl 100mgs daily, then to above 300mgs Methadone + 8-9 zani bars when I'd leave the meathadone clinic. Left there in 2010, left at 80mg ( I was going to come down detox so I can go straight to I was going to come down detox so I can go straight to Suboxone. One day when I told the methadone clinic nurse I will be there much longer I'm going on Suboxone she gave me a look and said "you will be back, they always do". I drink that last dose and then I started the Suboxone. I never return to that methadone clinic and I never would I was very upset with the way they treat people. Anyways since 2010 till about 8 days ago, 6 YEARS my doctors have me on Suboxone. The medication that should not be used especially for person that never used heroin in their life.
Anyways in the beginning of this December 2015 I decided to leave my Suboxone clinic and detox myself off of this medication. I was chilly so sick and tired of looking at this tiny strip the medication that was running my life every single day. I was so sick of looking at this tiny strip of vacation thinking to myself without you this morning able to have a normal life, that is what every doctor used to tell me. Every doctor would say " this medication for the rest of your life if you want to have a normal one ". For some maybe this is true but for myself I found out the past eight days it is not.
I been using this Kratom, 10Gs every four hours or so. I'm on day 8 with no suboxone. And I can't believe I'm about to say this but the most withdrawals are going through so far have been a few sneezes and yawns. But as soon as I drink my Kratom their gone. I can't believe this and I guess by now the subs are completely out of my system??? Anybody there that answer ?? And before that I was taking maybe .5 MG . My piece of Suboxone was so small if it would've fell off the counter I would've lost it. I never got high off subs. They just made me feel NORMAL. And I've had enough of being on Them. I've been in recovery since 2005 when I started a methadone clinic till this past December 2015 for an opiate addiction I had it for 2 1/2 years. Does that make any sense? Some of you maybe some of you may be not.
But my main question is does anybody have any advice or anything at all about this KRATOM ?? I know nothing about it other than researched and the chemist/physics Professor friend I have.
Thank you in advance!!

If you actually see this how is it all going. I have also been on suboxene for 6 years. I actually quit for a few month period 2 yesrs ago but unfortunately was with someone on heroin and slipped up and got back on sub before I was back on H. Ive heard good things about kratom. When I stopped it was basically Imodium, sleep aids and the occasional Xanax. It was tough and I was constantly lethargic. Honestly its just the duration more than anything. A few days I can cope but on day 14 or 20 with little sleep and little energy it became very mentally draining and endless. I also was working 40 hour weeks in a kitchen so it was tough on days to hide that something was up. Any tips would be appreciated. I agree also that these doctors expect you on it for life. My doc was very kind and I dont think he was a bad person but I realize now me on subs was beneficial financially for him. When we discussed coming off he said if I taper so .5 to 1mg there would be no discomfort and that all his other patients had no discomfort which is hilariously incorrect. I guess he has never bee on one of these forums hah.

 

[Donald_Flint]

I'm using kratom maeng da powder. (& Imodium ad) I've had some real good Kratom XXX capsules. Each pill had 3 grams of extract in them. I as stated above somewhere they're super expensive at the head shop. They work very very good, but $60 for FIVE pills! The powder is 4 oz for $70. I started 2 weeks ago at 10 grams. I did that about 4-6 days. Being on methadone 5yrs and subs 2010-2016 I wanted to do this beginning part slowly. I then went down to 8 for 2 days and then 6 grams a day. Now I'm at 4.5 grams. Tomorrow 3, next day 2. I mix the Kratom with grapefruit juice. And down it. Hated the taste in the beginning, just like methadone. Within a few days I loved that pink dose taste so much! I'm now able to down it quicker. It's mental.. Like the methadone. You know what you're about to drink is going to make you feel better very soon. With me it is at least.
I'm just scared at 2 grams then 1, the next day going in wd's. I'm trying to avoid these at all costs. Who wouldn't? If they did the RAPID DETOX, in the hospital, for suboxone, I'd do it! I have enough to cover that. I just don't know a lot about it.

One thing that's hard is my fiancé has never had an opiate addiction. Actually never had any kind. Big health nut. Works out. Healthy. He knows a lot. He's the one who's helped me this far. I knew nothing of Kratom until he researched it for me. He was upset seeing me cry all the way home for the suboxone Doctor. I was so tired of going. Nobody did any counseling. Nobody at all these clinics I've been too, ever asked me "what got you here, what made you start using". So I got to the root of my problems on my own. And decided I'm so tired of going to this doctor (who was on probation for writing rx's and other things). Every month I would go I would be afraid and sick all the way up thinking how all of the doors going to be locked because he was going to be arrested one day. Then I'd be so screwed. He was my doc for 6 years. So I decided around the holiday time I'm coming off my Suboxone on my own. Oh believe me I still have one and a half strips with me. I look at them every day because I always feel better knowing they are there. I need feel better knowing if I get that bad all I have to do is take that little piece of Suboxone. But all I've had was maybe a few sneezes and yawns that's why am afraid when this drink is over. Today I got my last bag. I know I'm not going to use 4 oz since I'm at such low grams. But it'll make me mentally feel better knowing it there if I need it.
The only bad part with my fiancé is he's been saying the last few days "this is great! You're on day 11 no subs! You're all done!" I don't feel done. I feel like when these last days are gone I'm going to be soooo sick?He says "no you'll be fine. The suboxone is out of you it's been 2 weeks. You're just on the Kratom now". IF HE IS CORRRECT CAN SOMEONE TELL ME! I just feel like he doesn't get how I feel. Well that's because he doesn't. Well Any advice GREATLY BE APPRECIATED!

Also someone who told me there is an eight day strict program for this Kratom. Does anybody know what that is?
Sorry so long guys. Just got to read some of these.
Yins on here are awesome! Thank you for all the kind words. I have nobody to really tell this too. And NO meetings are not for me. Hope yins have a good night?

Depending on how long you have been on suboxene is really the determining factor in how long wd's last. Honestly 11 days for anyone who has been on it over a year is.a short period. Yes the half life has passed and there is no suboxene in your system but the connections your brain made from extended use have not healed and still "crave" suboxene. 28 days is really the safest bet. Yes its a long time but that is when you really start to feel normal as your brain is truly healing and making new neural connections that are not seeking suboxene. Methadone and suboxene both have very periods of wd's. They will be minimal by the last week and you will be feeling so much better. Just hang in there. That's good you have someone by your side supporting you. It was tough doing it alone and very lonely tbh dealing with some of the depression. Just stay positive and if you have it in you try to get exercise of any kind. Even a 5 minute walk helps the rls and being outside is good for vitamin d uptake. I would literally walk 2 blocks then home at first but it still really helped.

 

[Timbo slice]

Ok....um never tried kratom but honestly have kicked subs...in a halfway house cuz....felt I was not sober seeing everyone else not using anything in the morning and I have to take a little peice of strip that seems Soo crazy...but that was life ok tapered down from 24 mg n dropped n dropped to a point I was on a quarter of a quarter of a strip! N just stopped WOW it took me a good 6 months to feel normal n that was 3 yrs ago I picked up a habit not close to what I was...B4 but now down to a quarter of a quarter whoever is saying that it takes a week or 2 to feel normal well....prob cuz u have not been on it for yrs!!! It's rough on day 7 restless legs..sweats....no sleep....but I did it B4 I'll do it again this kratom I've never heard of I don't want to use again! I just am sooo tired of having .5mg or anything run my daily life!!! If you have been taking it for yrs the kick I've been thru now this is the third time! B4 kicked but buying subs off the streets sec half way house I have not slept for 4 days since the half life is Soo long but some ppl act like it's easy if u have long use with subs pllzz get comfort meds I'ma look up kratom n if I can go get it being 4:42 am! No sleep I don't crave drugs anymore I just don't want to be sick I'm Soo tired but my body will not let me sleep! Thx docs don't tell u hey this will help the cravings but yaaa....u take this long enough ur looking g at a few months of terrible sickness if I knew this I would of gllllaadddllyyy kicked dope for 3 days compared to months thx

 

[NicoOregon]

After hours of debating with friends I decided to come to good old Bluelight for opinions, so hear goes:
If a heavy iv heroin user wants to kick going the subutex route, wouldn't tapering down to nearly chipping status on the h, then taking immediately (no waiting to 24 hrs) small amount of Subutex (not suboxone) serve as a smonth transition to sub maintenance?
If you think about it, it makes sense. Bupe is a partial agonist, fills all of the receptors, etc. Your brain is used to having some kind of junk in its receptors. If you were to induct that way or on the flip side, you could try this: Curb usage, then start taking tiny, TINY crumbs of Subutex and the brain won't know the difference. And there go go! Smooth opiate kick!