Stimulants of the Future

[dread]

Hmm... I wonder if 3,4,n-trimethylamphetamine would be stimulating...

 

[tadfish]

4fluorococaine so whats it like?
effects duration strength etc.
is 4-fluro cocaine the same as 4-fluoro-tropocaine?
100mg seems like alot how did u have the dose, orally, snort, IV....etc???

 

[tadfish]

A few weeks ago I had approx. 100 mg of 4-fluoro-tropocaine, which seemed to sedate me to some extend. Like, I got the urge to lay down and/or fall asleep. I've heard others had this too off this batch, could this be a botched synth or is it indeed less up than coke? In a way, it did feel like coke though.

how did u have it

 

[nuke]

Well if the indole ring could be broken up by metabolism, wouldn't that also make all the tryptamines toxic?

Anyway, what about the benzofuran and benzothiophene analogues of this chemical...

There's quite a lot of steric hindrance on the one position in tryptamines as compared to that stimulant. Even if it didn't open, there could be substantial neurotoxicity associated with it anyway.

Two benzofuranyl analogues have been prepared by Shulgin and are published in PiHKAL. The activity was not established but they did not appear to be potent.

 

[PetersKeys]

I have a prescription for phenDImetrazine (phenmetrazine with an extra N-methyl group). Phendimetrazine is metabolized by the body, according to my Physician's Desk Reference, to phenmetrazine and phenmetrazine N-oxide. While I enjoy my monthly phendimetrazine fix, it does not compare to methamphetamine. Neither does Ritalin (methylphenidate) or Adderall (amphetamine).

I think clear, recrystallized, nearly pure dl-methamphetamine hydrochloride is probably going to remain king of the stimulants for some time. Its synthesis is easy, it is chemically synthesized from a naturally occurring alkaloid derived from the Chinese ma huang plant, the quality of its high is very good, and the high lasts a long time. However, I would like to try the heretofore unscheduled 2-benzylpiperidine, a methylphenidate analogue designed to have a much longer half life than methylphenidate, as a possible stimulant.

Cocaine doesn't last long enough for me, is too expensive, and has agonizing come downs. Plus, the first thing many people do after doing some cocaine is have to take a nasty shit while they are high. Sure, some cocaine analogues may be very powerful, but they will always be extremely expensive to synthesize as long as they rely on cocaine as their starting material. As for the entactogens, I don't think MDMA / MDA can be beaten either, even though I am on methylone (that is, MDMCAT) right now. OTOH, I would like to try 3,4-dichloromethamphetamine.

Caffeine and nicotine, two legal stimulants, will probably also continue to be used extensively in the future. Speaking of nicotinic agonists, I would also like to try ABT-594.

Modafinil and ephedrine are crap drugs in my opinion.

I agree somewhat. I think methamphetamine is gonna remain king for a long time. The only thing that I think could make it stronger would be something like an extra methyl group attached that would make it absorb even faster through the BBB.

Rather than the pharmacological strength of the drug I think it would be better to focus more on the drugs Dopamergic release, flooding, affinity, and re-uptake effects. There are many powerful stimulants with shitty euphoria and pleasurableness. All stimulant addicts pretty much want is an enormous surge in dopamine for their high. Amphetamine itself has a very similar structure to dopamine

Cocaine anologues probably won't make it on the black market due to their expensive production costs. But I definately see a future for newer anti-depressants from cocaine analgues like Tesofensine and Brasofensine

 

[Hammilton]

You have no idea what you're talking about. N,N-Dimethylamphetamine is fairly weak.

N,a,a-trimethylamphetamine is also fairly weak. None of the a,a-dimethylamps are interesting.

Cocaine analogues have already appeared on the blackmarket, so that's just another dumb comment. People are willing to pay for anything that they might perceive as 'less illegal.'

 

[PetersKeys]

Mazindol is just plain strange.

It's not rewarding, but it definitely has sympathomimetic properties, making it pretty much a stimulant. Modafanil isn't very rewarding either, and neither is yohimbine, arguably, but they are definitely stimulating.

yohimbine is horrid in my opinion. All the nasty side effect of a harsh stimulant with none of the good effects. Worst experience ever.

 

[Rectify]

I didn't get great results with it either.

 

[MurphyClox]

You have no idea what you're talking about. N,N-Dimethylamphetamine is fairly weak.

Correct (ca. one tenth the potency of methamphetamine, IIRC), but one must not forget that in contrary to meth there was no significant neurotoxicity shown for N,N-dimethylamphetamine, which is a quite inviting property. I think that deserves some consideration.

Ref: Brain Res 1997, 771, p.115
(thx to LuxEtVeritas)

Peace! Murphy

 

[Hammilton]

Yeah, but is that just because it's slower in producing DA efflux? ANd thus less enjoyable?

 

[Lupus]

Correct (ca. one tenth the potency of methamphetamine, IIRC), but one must not forget that in contrary to meth there was no significant neurotoxicity shown for N,N-dimethylamphetamine, which is a quite inviting property. I think that deserves some consideration.
Murphy

When was it concluded that methamphetamine is toxic in oral doses? Aside from one of ricaurte's studies anyway.

 

[Hammilton]

Why don't you do some reading. That's a really really really easy to answer question if you look yourself.

 

[Hammilton]

Why don't you do some reading. That's a really really really easy to answer question if you look yourself.

 

[Lupus]

Why don't you do some reading. That's a really really really easy to answer question if you look yourself.

I have, thats why im curious as to what he's talking about. The only definitive research i've read that can directly correlate neurotoxicity to meth use was one involving IV users. The fast onset was what was determined to be the factor in doing damage to DAT receptors.

The only other thing that i can think of is the increased levels of glutamate simply causing cells to burn out..

This is of course excluding any of ricaurte's research.

 

[vecktor]

I have, thats why im curious as to what he's talking about. The only definitive research i've read that can directly correlate neurotoxicity to meth use was one involving IV users. The fast onset was what was determined to be the factor in doing damage to DAT receptors.

The only other thing that i can think of is the increased levels of glutamate simply causing cells to burn out..

This is of course excluding any of ricaurte's research.

People are making a monementally dumb mistake by discounting Ricaurte, he admitted a mistake was made in accidentally substituting METH for MDMAin one set of experiments, which indicated erroneously that MDMA was a dopaminergic neurotoxin.

HE highlighted the error and published a retraction/correction, that shows that he actually does care about science and the accuracy of what is published.
This is in contrast to rather a lot of the other reserch out there that is plain wrong, plagarised or downright fraud, where the authors know there are issues but don't publish corrections.
I don't discount his work, but I am careful to check it properly and not rely on it as a sole source of data, becuase there is the possibility of sloppy lab work.

I can name others whose research is much more dubious, some are blatent.

 

[MurphyClox]

Searching for "methamphetamine neurotoxicity" in SciFinder yields not less than 260 hits. I think there's no doubt about that.

- Murphy

 

[dread]

Lately I've been wondering, if n-methylating alfetamine would give it more stimulating qualities...

 

[Hammilton]

I kind of doubt it, but it doesn't seem to be very well researched.

I'd be more interested in knowing about alpha-allyl versions of things like MDPV and the cathinones.

 

[dread]

I'd be more interested in knowing about alpha-allyl versions of things like MDPV and the cathinones.

Funny, I've been thinking exactly the same.

Then I've been thinking you could replace the pyrrolidine with a morpholine...

Also you could bend the alkyl-chain of MDPV back to the phenyl to make it into an indane (or indanone, with the b-ketone)...

 

[c0rt3x]

I had a few ideas about - as far as I know - new stimulants

1,1-diphenylpropan-2-amine -> Amphetamine meets Desoxypipradrol...

methyl(2-phenylethyl)amine -> PEA meets Methamphetamine

1-benzoyl-4-methylpiperazine -> MBZP meets Cathinone