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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

Stigma/Myths surrounding Methamphetamine - '...meth does not cause brain damage'

MindlessBilly said:
I was reading on erowid about amphetamines used in WWII and it mentioned countries like the USA & UK used amphetamine and or dextroamphetamine while Germany & Japan both used Meth. Makes ya think when you consider the outcome of the war lol....
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Lol that is very interesting. Not sure if your implying meth made them loose or made them fight as well as they did? Id say both of them got way further then they logically should have, and perhaps it was because of the meth.

Meth combined with proper ideas and indoctrination could easily create the perfect suicide level solider.
 
Hitler supposedly was given IV METH injections daily, no wonder head all that potential then crashed and burned
 
blight12 said:
Well i was exaggerating for humors sake, so just calm yourself. Im sure it helps in very controlled dosages and circumstances but i still wouldn't want to be there in the thick of it with amped up soliders all around me. My biggest concern with this would be the increased anxiety or possibility of a quick and incorrect reaction to something, which is there even in the smallest dose. Anxious soldiers, not good.

Personally id give them all a combination of lower dose non sedating opiates and stims so that the wounded and dying can carry on fighting for a little longer (Every little bit counts on the battlefield.) and take some of the stim edge/anxiety off.

Lol, pervitin, a perfect name for meth, so true.
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Meth is known to cause godlike fearlessness. It is propaganda to think it just makes you anxious, that is retarded. The effects you refer to come from end-stage abuse. If what you said was true they wouldn't have used it. They gave it to kamikaze pilots for fuck's sake. Those jerk reactions you described are only possible when you have been on the drug without sleep for too long or doses to high. Your analysis is not wiser than that of all the leaders of WWII, it is pretentiousness. Methamphetamine is also known to have less "edge" than caffeine. Some experiments were done with the opiate combination with the nazis though it had a code name that started with X.
 
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As I said, Im sure it works in very controlled dosages and circumstances and worked for them back then. And I know exactly how meth works from years of actual experience using it regularly and it can definitely cause anxiety or edginess even in low doses but this is not usually the case. And any comparison to caffeine depends entirely on your dosage of each. No ways normal doses of caffeine causes more edge then a high rec level meth dose. But we all experience drugs differently so this is only my opinion based on my own experience. I am not attempting to provide an educated "analysis" on the topic or some fact based viewpoint, merely a casual half joking experience based opinion on an interesting topic. No need to be so defensive and insulting.
 
_DankOpiAmp_ said:
Meth is known to cause godlike fearlessness. It is propaganda to think it just makes you anxious, that is retarded. The effects you refer to come from end-stage abuse. If what you said was true they wouldn't have used it. They gave it to kamikaze pilots for fuck's sake. Those jerk reactions you described are only possible when you have been on the drug without sleep for too long or doses to high. Your analysis is not wiser than that of all the leaders of WWII, it is pretentiousness. Methamphetamine is also known to have less "edge" than caffeine. Some experiments were done with the opiate combination with the nazis though it had a code name that started with X.
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Come on, dude. Meth is KNOWN to cause these effects:

POSITIVE
increased energy and alertness
decreased need for sleep
increased sociability
mild to extreme mood lift, euphoria
increased sexuality
NEUTRAL
excessive talking
decreased appetite, weight loss
sweating
NEGATIVE
disturbed sleep patterns
tightened jaw muscles, grinding teeth (trismus and bruxia)
loss of appetite (anorexia), leading to poor nutrition and weight loss with heavy use
visual & auditory hallucinations, hearing voices (from sleep deprivation)
reduced enjoyment of eating
loss of interest in sex, over time
itching, welts on skin
nausea, vomiting, diarrhea
dry mouth, leading to serious tooth decay with chronic use
excessive excitation, hyperactivity
shortness of breath
moodiness & irritability
anxiousness & nervousness
aggressiveness
panic, suspiciousness, and paranoia
involuntary body movements (uncontrollable movement and/or twitches of fingers, facial & body muscles, lip-smaking, tongue protrusion, grimacing, etc.)
ego inflation, false sense of confidence and power, ego-inflation
aggressive and violent behavior
severe depression, suicidal tendencies


Effects of Habitual Use
fatal kidney and lung disorders
possible brain damage
permanent psychological problems
lowered resistance to illnesses
liver damage
stroke
cardiovascular crises, chest pains, heart attacks
Damage to gums, teeth, and can lead to tooth loss


Seriously, How does that translate to "godlike fearlessness" ?
 
Well godlike fearlessness may be slightly exaggerated however meth in the right dosages gets pretty close. Keep inh mind all its positive effects would fall under a single line item in your above list "mild to extreme mood lift, euphoria". However this single line item is very powerful with meth and can and will completely overshadow and make the many other negative line items totally worth it, at least in terms of recreational value.

So at first glance that list makes meth look like total pointless shit until you fully realize the power of the main positive effect.

Still not convinced all those other side effects will make for a reliable safe and well performing soldier, unless your training suicide bombers or something
 
Just to be clear that list is from Erowid.

I agree that the euphoria from meth outweighs it's long list of negatives, but i equate godlike fearlessness more with MXE or Ketamine use. I guess it's just a difference in how we define "godlike".

I find stimulants to be very emotional, territorial, neurosemantic, lingual, calculative, sociosexual, and hedonistic, which is very very Humanlike in my opinion.

Dissociatives and psychedelic i associate more with words like quantum, cosmic, neurosomatic, metaprogramming, neurogenetic, which define Godlike for me.

But this is why words suck, because they mean something different to every person.
 
SwampFox56 said:
I saw this article, and I was incredibly impressed. Just like Amphetamine - Methamphetamine, at therapeutic dosages, is not neurotoxic and does not cause brain damage. Methamphetamine when heavily abused can cause brain damage, however, so can any drug.

I, personally, believe that the social stigma's around Methamphetamine are criminal. Methamphetamine is legitimate medication that could have many indications (ADHD, obesity, nasal decongestant, treatment-resistant depression, Parkinson's Disease, etc.) And yet, this will never happen because of the lies the media has created about Meth.

Anyways, what's your opinion on this matter? I personally believe that this is one of the most unfortunate things that has happened to many drugs. Drugs that could really help people get put into Schedule I just because people happened to abuse it before any research was actually done into the drug... quite sad really...
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You are aware that methamphetamine is in Schedule II and can be/is prescribed for these indications, right?
 
Sure ok yeah, i was thinking godlike fearlessness more in terms of cocky hedonistic risk taking "I am immortal" type thinking and behavior.
 
You literally cannot feel fear and anxiety in the state I am describing. You are determined and focused on the task at hand (prolonged battle/flight), not acting like arrogant ass. Obviously the situation at hand influences it a bit. You are acting as if one could feel both these positive/negative effects at the same time and that is impossible. Those negatives you even said were from massive recreational amounts taken just for fun.
 
To the one talking about godlike fearlessness. I totally agree, at a certain dose I just remember me smoking my.meth for the first time. Positive effects all basically falling under the GODLY EUPHORIA. It would make me say fuck all the negatives even though I know coming down with heart palpitations, at times Ventricular tachycardia,, chest pains etc was not something I ever liked to panic about, soon as I hit that pipe the next time. It was all over to me didn't care. I mean even the "Neutral effects" all fall under that godly aurora to a user, where you just feel untouchable when your high.

Even now 3-4 years as a user, every time I look at the negatives when I'm sober I tell myself I can't do this my whole life coming down. Soon as I load my.next bowl though, The feeling returns and I'm top of the world & the cycle continues.
 
Don't get me wrong, it's definitely one of my favorite highs and i feel the way you're describing, but there have been situations that really sent me into a 'bad high'. This one time right after doing a shot of crystal i noticed a car parked in the yard off the road and instantly went from bliss to extreme paranoia and later found out it was a PI, and it just got worse. So for me the high isn't quite as 'guaranteed' as it is with, say heroin or another opiate.
 
Sure, its never gautenteed and might not be as reliable as other substance classes, however meth is by far the most reliable effective consistent stim of them all, much better then coke or other amp types in comparison. And its pretty reliable, assuming you have good quality product and take a decent dose id prob say out of the 100 sessions used, maybe 5 at most where not reliable in the result, so 95% reliable.

But there are other factors, like tolerance and your desired dosage levels, as tolerance increase from more regular usage can definitely change a lot on the next binge. Also generally a higher then the minimum therapeutic dosage is required for pure unwavering godlike but functional euphoria without any annoying ups and downs. Prob 100-200mg good crystal for me, and prob difficult to achieve with most phara stims. It must be meth.
 
Few things:

-Meth isn't schedule I...it's schedule II, and still available by prescription, at least in the US.

-They have extensively researched it and actually do use it for obesity, treatment resistant depression, etc.

-Spend a week in a US town where meth is the dominant drug. It doesn't take a research study to observe what it does to people's bodies and minds.
 
Well I am on early morning day 4 and im definitely not liking what its doing to my mind and body ^. I feel brain damaged and my eyes take 2 seconds to focus properly everytime i look somewhere else. And afterimages of previous focus points overlay the new location for a second or two as well. And it seems i can see the actual air molecules floating around in open spaces. Its somewhat disturbing, but manageable.

This is when the tough decisions begin, do you try get through the new day and hope you have enough left to allow this without coming down or becoming more mentally unstable or do you implement immediate shutdown mode? I usually always take the extra time risk with option one.

For some wierd reason it always seems less painful to deal with a whole new day of wierdness, mental decay possible anxiety and comedown then taking a seroquel and passing out right away. I think the problem with the obviously more responsible and better second option is the "finality" of it all. Its a major commitment for a meth addled brain that is almost always 100% focused on maintaining the current situation, whatever that may be. Change is the enemy of a tweaking mind.
 
The air molecules thing is not unique to meth, it can look like falling little balls as well. Happens at day 3/4, trippy ethereal layer on vision.
 
Word^, I feel you on that. Sleep deprivation when I first started doing dope really destroyed me temporarily thankfully. I was ignorant at that time when it came to real sleep dep 4-5-6 days. I never knew how it can really change your awareness, lead to psychosis etc.

At first day 1-3 I never felt anything different obviously cause I had never stayed up from.previous amphetamines I had tried so I didn't really LOOK FOR change.

It wasn't until I hit day 5 for the first time, while smoking meth habitually that I went in my first full blown psychosis.

Scariest day of my life next to the day I actually ODd on dope. My psychosis was realistic visuals of swat teams that would actually move with M16s aimed at me & to make matters worse I was in public when it happened. I dropped to the floor on a residential street yelling at them saying don't shoot me & they WALKED up to me and pointed in my face OH MY GOD when I finally realized their feet were hovering over the floor and not actually planted, I knew they were fake. It was UNREAL.

The tremor and straight FEAR I felt was indescribable. In the topic of psychosis, its kind of strange to me. Now 3 years down and educated, I think I suffer from "Brief Reactive Psychosis" because every time I do dope and I hit day 4-5 I always go in the same psychosis every time. Their never different. I don't trip on voices trying to make me.believe a certain way like around day 2 so I don't personally call that "psychosis" cause I know its not real. But anyway on day 4-5 my state of that day always comes back I never go any other type of fake story. The visuals of them come back but obviously now I just don't go outside and close my room door as they can't come in lol.

Also I get this weird Wind "whoosing" sound each day I'm up that when I hear it a "Stage" of psychosis begins whether voices, shadows, or visuals. That also is ALWAYS present when I stay up, its not a placebo either it seriously happens each time I enter that weird state. Its so strange to me, always disappears when I sleep but regardless I don't stay up that long anymore max for me is 3 days nowadays.

Definitely think its brief reactive in my case, but then again Its only when I do dope not while sober so that would contradict the actual meaning of the term.



But yeah decisions are hard as the days go by & your awareness starts to fade. I typically crack at my cravings and dose which if past 48hours, I normally have a small amount of speed left and when I dose my dopamine levels are so dry, I just end up more psychotic & paranoid and its wasted. Sleep dep is a high in its own in my opinion. Very dark shit at least for me. Never really changed me though thankfully.

,
 
I have this humming sound now in my room, and not the shadow radio that usually plays instead that I know is not real but it reacts to movements of my head and my position in the room. Some locations or angles the sound stops, reappears or gets louder, consistently. Why would and how can a normal constant droning audio hallucination react in this way to my physical location and position in such a complicated manner, as if its a real sound. Seems unnecessarily complex for a low level hallucination.

Makes me think im picking up a real sound that i normally wouldnt hear in a sober state, seeing as though i can now see air in 3d moving about, why not extra sounds as well lol?
 
hitler was on 'vitamultin' (sp?) injections. thats what his Dr. called the cocktail he gave hitler. its often said hitler's well known flatulence is no surprise considering he was on PK's laxatives a bunch of other shit im not looking up, and, what would become known as hitler meth, methcathinone. The drug was given to soldiers like tank ppl....... in inhalers. project paperclip, went to the commies (they got chemicals, we got rocket / nuclear scientists. it was first synthesized in the US in the UP.. where i heard what i thought was bs from drunks.

there is still a place for GODLIKE FEARLESSNESS and the ability to walk for 3 days straight. closest i can find any of them admitting to is dexedrine. if they admit to that officially, use ur imagination. think USAF fighter pilots (cold war, when no one cared what the gvt pumped ppl full of), or anyone airborne: escape and evasion kit was their "Oh shit" ... kit... part of their survival kit, which had morphine! good times.
http://timemilitary.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/screen-shot-2013-02-20-at-5-42-11-pm.png

U can't look at its LT effects if you're considering its usefulness in battle. if they dont know what it is, and they're given the right dose, it would obviosly help get them ready to dodge exploding faces.
 
SwampFox56, your concerns are unwarranted because, as mentioned by myself and BlueHues, methamphetamine is already in Schedule II and is prescribed for the indications you claim it could be prescribed for.

I don't really see any question here....I'll leave this thread open for the time being but it will probably be closed in the near future.
 
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