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  • MDMA Moderators: Esperighanto

So, MDMA isn't as neurotoxic as once believed, may not even be toxic. READ!

I'm not sure this contradicts previous research. Earlier research had shown that several high doses of MDMA, over a short period of time, were neurotoxic in animals like monkeys and rats. That's not seriously in dispute surely. The real question was whether those findings could be generalised to human users, who used lower doses, but over a long period of time.

Seems like this provides some evidence to suggest that multiple lower doses might be less neurotoxic than several high doses. Which is perhaps cause for cautious optimism :)
 
Optimistic yes, presumably safe to undergo, no. I would love this study to be indefinitely true, but there's so many others suggesting otherwise? It's very hard toknow how to procede. Aswell, is this is true then I don't know where all mine, and other peoples problems arose from after useage.. I never really used anywhere near the amount of uses or this study did.

Seems like were stuck at a crossroads.
 
This debate will go on forever & ever.
I personally find it redundent, it goes in circles. Like The conversations amongst a group coming down from lsd.

Spoken for the truthed.

I k ow from first hand professional bean eatin experience that it is less the safe to binge on MDMA. I wont be rollin 3 days at ECD this year...you will be fucked up for months after that...

Some people gotta put down the scientific mumbo jumbo and learn for themself. Ive eatin bags of beans with 10s of all the colors of the rainbow in a matter of days...
 
Agreed ^^ I wouldn't recommend anyone roll 120 times with low doses for the next 18 months, usnless you wanna relearn how to read.
 
Might do us all some good to take a step down the ladder and relearn to read. :)

Maybe we'd stop developing boner pills and start fixing the real issues..
 
Might do us all some good to take a step down the ladder and relearn to read. :)

Maybe we'd stop developing boner pills and start fixing the real issues..

Haha good point :P Wouldn't hurt if the government took some incentive towards relearning how to perfrom some critical thinking along with some rationalization, maybe then they wouldn't go completely off on a tangent spreading all these bullshit rumors about MDMA and give people the real facts. If only they understood what over exaggerating such a serious issues as your serotonin system could donto the minds of hypochondiats who've used. :P

I bet there's that many people out there who think their fucked from using e a scattered amount of times, my psychiatrist/docter still believes it eats holes in your brain.. My response would be, well I'm functioning pretty good for a person with brain resembling a block of Swiss cheese aren't I? :D
 
LMAO FTW

Agreed. Holes in the brain, bleeding brain, yada frickin yada. I'll never forget:

"Your brain is bleeding, that "why" you roll." Really, guy? I mean, REALLY? Come on.

Jesus H. Christ if people put 5% of the effort it took to spew BS and put that towards learning 1 new thing at any given moment, we'd be putting all the 7 year old Korean kids to shame at calculus for once in our lives.
 
Spoken for the truthed.

I k ow from first hand professional bean eatin experience that it is less the safe to binge on MDMA. I wont be rollin 3 days at ECD this year...you will be fucked up for months after that...

Some people gotta put down the scientific mumbo jumbo and learn for themself. Ive eatin bags of beans with 10s of all the colors of the rainbow in a matter of days...

i dunno i took mdma for a 3 day fest, and actually dosed hard the night before the fest at a seperate show. The Molly was KILLER for the show before the fest, while the MDMA was rather weak that i got for the fest (not completely bunk, but probably like 40% and the rest was something bitter) but i HARDLY felt any negative long term effects AT ALL.

I think there was only one time in my life that i felt an E hangover, it lasted about a half a day, i felt like shit and hid in my room from everyone and felt like a baby (wanted to cry and whatnot and was legit scared of people) butttt. i drank a few beers and got over it.

I dunno. one thing i will testify to is that my desire to do the MDMA each day decreased, as i was hardly feeling any effects, just like taking an anti anxiety Rx.

I never binge like that but felt like being crazy for a weekend and went for it.
 
This study says the exact opposite....apparently

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - For a glimpse into real-world drug use, Australian researchers went to parties where people were using a drug known as ecstasy - and discovered that users' brains were at far more risk from the drug than anyone had suspected.

The researchers also found that ecstasy pills often contain a variety of other drugs.

"What's concerning is that most studies looking at toxicity in people or animals look at a single drug," said Dr. Thomas Newton, a professor at Baylor College of Medicine, who was not involved in this study.

"We have no idea what happens when you start mixing like this."

For this study, 56 people who had taken ecstasy at least five times in the past agreed to invite the researchers to house parties where they took ecstasy once again.

The researchers collected a sample of the pills and measured users' blood levels of MDMA - the chemical that's in ecstasy - every hour for 5 hours after people took the drug. At the end of the study, each user received AUS$200 (about US$205, or 128 GBP) for participating.

In some people, the amount of MDMA reached levels that cause injury or death in primates.

The researchers found that only half of the pills consisted entirely of MDMA. The other half also contained methamphetamine or chemicals related to MDMA: MDEA or MDA.

Some pills had no MDMA at all. The ones that did had amounts that ranged widely, from as low as 25 mg to ten times that amount.

"This highlights a significant public health concern, particularly regarding the existence of pills containing more than 200 mg of MDMA," the authors write in their report of the study, which is published in the journal Addiction.

Because the research was intended to capture a realistic snapshot of ecstasy use, the number of pills people took over the course of an evening varied as well. Most users ingested more than one pill; some people took as many as five.

"Taking multiple pills is likely to lead to very high blood concentration, which may be harmful," Dr. Rod Irvine, the lead author of the study, wrote in an email to Reuters Health.

That's because concentrations of MDMA in users' blood did not stop climbing during the 5 hours of sampling.

"We were surprised that the...concentrations continued to rise throughout the study," Irvine, a professor at the University of Adelaide, said. "The higher levels are approaching those that have been shown to be damaging to brain cells in animal models."

Three users had blood concentrations greater than 700 mg/L, which was poisonous to primates in laboratory studies. Another three users had concentrations very close to that level.

"Those are big numbers," Newton said of the blood concentrations.

Irvine said that most users continued to take more ecstasy throughout the night, even though their blood concentrations from the initial pill had not peaked.

The authors speculate that users might develop a tolerance to the drug while they're using it, making them feel less intoxicated even while their blood levels of the drug are increasing.

None of the users in the study suffered any immediate health problems from taking ecstasy.

According to the US National Institute on Drug Abuse, ecstasy can interfere with heart rate and temperature regulation and can cause brain damage.

Seven of every 100 twelfth-graders say they have tried ecstasy.

Irvine said that collecting data at parties is a valuable way to get a sense of what people are actually exposing themselves to.

For instance, in 14 people the amount of MDMA in the blood reached levels that had never been studied in humans in the lab.

In laboratory studies, ethical considerations prevent researchers from testing such high doses in people, so the amounts they experiment with "do not reflect the range used naturally," Irvine wrote.

Regarding the information Irvine's team collected, Newton said, "It's very unique to pull that off."

The research was funded by the National Health and Medical Research Council of Australia.
http://www.latimes.com/health/sns-rt-health-us-ecstasy-stre72s679-20110329,0,5802764.story
 
Thizzman: I didn't read that whole article... But I immediately spotted a flaw in their logic:

They state that "ecstacy pills often contain a mix of drugs".... What's to say that it's the MDMA causing the damage? Perhaps it's one of the other drugs in the cocktail-pill.

From most of our point of view in arguing over the relative danger of MDMA, we're speaking from a pure-MDMA standpoint. IE: We're not concerned with what the other shit mixed in with pills is doing; but rather, we want to know exactly what damage is caused by pure MDMA.

Now, from a REAL WORLD view: pills are cut with tons of other crap: fact of life... So in that case, the danger of these mixes needs to be analyzed and dealt with.

It's almost a catch 22.... Because MDMA isn't legal: pills are cut with God knows what... And since these pills are dangerous, MDMA will never be decriminalized/regulated.
 
Thizzman: I didn't read that whole article... But I immediately spotted a flaw in their logic:

They state that "ecstacy pills often contain a mix of drugs".... What's to say that it's the MDMA causing the damage? Perhaps it's one of the other drugs in the cocktail-pill.

From most of our point of view in arguing over the relative danger of MDMA, we're speaking from a pure-MDMA standpoint. IE: We're not concerned with what the other shit mixed in with pills is doing; but rather, we want to know exactly what damage is caused by pure MDMA.

Now, from a REAL WORLD view: pills are cut with tons of other crap: fact of life... So in that case, the danger of these mixes needs to be analyzed and dealt with.

It's almost a catch 22.... Because MDMA isn't legal: pills are cut with God knows what... And since these pills are dangerous, MDMA will never be decriminalized/regulated.

Maybe it'll be proven to help soldiers with PTSD and then it'll be legalized for medical purposes, which would then allow for more studies...best case scenario
 
Maybe it'll be proven to help soldiers with PTSD and then it'll be legalized for medical purposes, which would then allow for more studies...best case scenario

This is very true. People are slowly starting to become more open minded on the subject. Open minds = more/deeper studies = better for everyone.
 
I wonder what it takes to get your on hands on some of the pure medical grade Molly they'll be using in those studies
 
A tour in Iraq/Afghanistan + PTSD + an epically awesome psychiatrist with a connection to MAPS.

=p

The people at MAPS must have a crazy list of connections. I wonder what the best Molly in the world is and how to get it, but they must know
 
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