Cocaine Snorting Lungs or Nose?

[mindtools]

Hmm, the numbers written by Fail Fighter doesn't seem right according to my knowledge and previous experience.
BTW, just a few minutes ago I've been snorting bupe (from crushed pills meant to be taken sublingualy) and after the snort I breathed out a bit of powder. If was Very tiny; so tiny it looked like a smoke. And it looked like it was less than 1% of what I prepared.

 

[opiatekrzy]

the point of snorting drugs is so the drug gets metabolized by the mucous membranes in your nose, alot of ppl are dumb and think it goes straight to the brain and all this dumb shit and start snorting super hard-only wasting a shitload of the drug for it to go down ur throat and to ur stomach, when i used to sniff ritalin iw ould do it hard, it would get into my lungs, and i noticed when i took a breathe i exhaled powder! u definetly gotta know how to snort drugs for it to be effective!

 

[whynaught]

I've kind of tested this with 6-apb, the most powdered chemical I've encountered. Lets say you like 200mg lines, and with this 10% figure you'd be getting about 20mg on powder in your lungs. I've snorted maybe 5mg of 6-apb and coughed. You'd cough if you got it in your lungs

 

[Swimmingdancer]

I've kind of tested this with 6-apb, the most powdered chemical I've encountered. Lets say you like 200mg lines, and with this 10% figure you'd be getting about 20mg on powder in your lungs. I've snorted maybe 5mg of 6-apb and coughed. You'd cough if you got it in your lungs

Actually what they were saying was that only 10% doesn't get into your lungs and is absorbed in the nose 8)

 

[The.Ghost]

I doubt most use more than a dollar bill and a lighter, or a razor blade, to powderize their shit. Don't think they use a ball mill and sieve it.

Some of us do. I mill my zaleplon down to the 40 micron range before it goes up my nose. Smaller particles = more surface area, although I doubt this matters unless the drug is super water-insoluble.

I always snort by using my mouth for suction while my lungs are totally sealed off. Not a speck gets in 'em, although a cloud comes out when I do exhale. There aren't any particularly nasty fillers in there, but I don't want to clog my lungs up with insoluble powder. Some definitely gets stuck in the upper airway; in my pre-milling days I switched from lung to mouth and my chronic low-grade cough disappeared completely.

IME, my sinuses will take ~100 mg of powder (~.2 cc) until they are totally but lightly coated and no more new powder will touch the nasal mucosa. But I suspect that more would stick, it just wouldn't contact the mucosa directly. I don't think this would be a problem with anything water-soluble, though.

This does raise the interesting question of just how fast an adsorbed powder wicks / dissolves and allows more particles to stick. Hmm...

 

[Fail Fighter]

along with others in the thread, i'd like to read some substantiation of this claim, in particular the 10% figure.

thanks.

alasdair

Wow, I forgot about this thread. I had no idea so many sarcastic assholes responded to me... Well since you (alasdair) asked for the math without peppering in some insults, I figured I'd oblige.


-Density of cocaine: 1.2 g/cm^3
-Est. size of cocaine particulate: 5 micron (0.0005 cm)
-Surface area of vascular/respiratory mucosal nasal endothelium: 170 cm^2


Max. volume of receptive/absorptive nasal endothelium:
170 * 0.0005 = 0.085 cm^3


Dimensional Analysis:
1.2g x 0.085cm3 = ~100 mg
cm3 1


So let's say you rail 1g of coke; assuming you get COMPLETE, 100% coverage of the absorptive nasal area, 90% of the coke will end up in your lungs.




I'd ask "are you guys happy now?" but I already know you won't be. I'm sure the numbers can be argued a hundred different ways. The constant values I provided for the variables are simply what came up first via google. I did look up the cocaine particulate size a bit more extensively however, but the numbers were all over the map. I used 5 micron because that seemed to be the most common. But I also saw as little as 1 micron, up to over 20 micron, so who knows. Assuming 20 micron size - that'd equate to 400mg of nasal absorption, assuming 100% coverage.

At any rate, the math doesn't lie - it's clear to see that the nasal cavity doesn't hold anywhere NEAR as much powder as most people seem to think. I don't know why it was assumed that I was pulling numbers from my ass either; I'm an engineer, not a bullshitter. And besides, I was really going on empiricism more than theory anyway. I can tell you for an absolute 100% fact that when I used to snort Dilaudid, if I snorted any more than 140mg of powder at a time, I would exhale plumes of dusty pill smoke. And I obviously wasn't snorting any harder than I had too, as I obviously was trying to minimize the amount that escaped my nasal cavity. In fact most people laugh when they see me snort a drug, because I don't pinch or close-off the opposing nostril that the straw is in - I leave both nostrils completely free and open so that the suction being exerted on the powder is at an absolute minimum, just enough to get it up my nose.

 

[laugh]

Lets not forget every nose is different unique...that's obvious, right. My right nostril is a lot more open than my left, I case you were wondering.

Fail fighter is all coke the same particle size, consistency and every nasal caverty the same surface area?

 

[HaZeX]

I will say that Fail Fighter has good substance to his post, i have to agree with him on the avg. ammount of powder snorted on a mg basis is probally 100mg.

I know for me if I snort lets say a "actavis 30mg" 120mg weight of oxycodone powder at the tail end i feel the powder starting to hit the back of my throat. Now lets say I do the malli brand, i believe the rough figures are around 160mg of weight, i feel the powder half way through snorting it

And sorry but yea i had to use Roxicodone as my example as i dont do cocaine.



Old thread alive for this!?!

 

[Fail Fighter]

Lets not forget every nose is different unique...that's obvious, right. My right nostril is a lot more open than my left, I case you were wondering.

Fail fighter is all coke the same particle size, consistency and every nasal caverty the same surface area?

Funny - MY left nostril is also the one that's more open... Maybe that's a thing; sorta like how a man's penis most often bends to the left (don't ask me how I know that lol).

Anyway, I'll admit I was a bit vexed when I wrote that last response. I'm not trying to be some sort of pedant or drug nazi or anything. I'd agree that every body is different, and the actual powder amount absorbed intranasally is going to vary wildly by person. The main reason I posted in this thread to begin with is for one simple reason: I continually hear people talk about snorting Vicodin, Percocet, Norco, et. al. and it absolutely drives me nuts. A Vicodin 750 weighs over 1g, so do the math - that's less than 1mg of hydrocodone that sticks to/absorbs through your nasal capillaries... It's idiotic.

My other pet peeve is people who think OxyContin is 100% Oxy. I mean obviously it's not, since it clearly has added material for the time-release matrix. But no one seems to think that through. The last time I had 80mg Purdue OxyContin I weighed them on my digital scale and they actually weigh 260 +/- 20 mg. So people (STUPID people) think a crushed-up OC-80 is only 80mg, which is under the rough ~100mg cap, when in fact it's nearly 300mg, which is triple the ~100mg cap. I would think it unwise to snort more than half an OC-80 at a time for this reason.

Again, not really trying to argue with anyone. My attitude/frustration is stemming from the people I encounter in real life who simply "do drugs" without having ANY idea what they're doing. I met a kid recently who DRANK bleach because he "heard" it would make him piss clean... I shit you not. I asked "What in the world is the scientific basis for drinking bleach?!" and he just stared at me like I was speaking Martian. Similarly, if I try to tell people why snorting opiate/APAP formulations is a losing endeavor, they always always ALWAYS just argue with me and swear that it works. Just look on youtube - plenty of vids of moronic kids railing mountains of APAP. I try explaining that a Vicodin 5/500 is EXACTLY the same as a regular Extra-Strength Tylenol, with just a grain of sand worth of opiate added, but they can't comprehend that.

Btw: 3 people in this thread now say they've empirically noted a ~100mg limit... Just sayin'.

 

[Fail Fighter]

if I snort lets say a "actavis 30mg" 120mg weight of oxycodone powder at the tail end i feel the powder starting to hit the back of my throat. Now lets say I do the malli brand, i believe the rough figures are around 160mg of weight, i feel the powder half way through snorting it

Mallinckrodt Roxicodone 30mg weighs 130mg btw. Just thought I'd add that, for posterity. (10 pills weighs 1.3g, with a resolution error of 0.1g; each individual pill therefore weighs 130 +/- 10mg).

 

[chrisalt]

nose or your wasting some.

 

[DooMMooD]

You posted numbers like "Est. size of cocaine particulate: 5 micron".

1) How are you deriving that estimation 2) if its not your estimation where did you read it 3) that math literally could've been just invented on the spot if 2 is not the case.


And for the record, there is a straw tool that is lauded here on BL. the one that closes off your throat/lungs for sniffing stuff? If your claims were true, that wouldn't get you nearly as high. Considering it does, your position is kinda proven wrong.

Also a another thing to take note of: you claim that the error for a pill is 0.1g or 10mg. 0.1g=100mg. Might wanna recheck all your numbers before you start touting them as correct. Furthermore error is based on the tool you use to measure something. So if you measured that pill with a 0.1 scale the error would be different than 0.01 scale.

 

[The.Ghost]

-Est. size of cocaine particulate: 5 micron (0.0005 cm)
-Surface area of vascular/respiratory mucosal nasal endothelium: 170 cm^2


Max. volume of receptive/absorptive nasal endothelium:
170 * 0.0005 = 0.085 cm^3


Dimensional Analysis:
1.2g x 0.085cm3 = ~100 mg
cm3 1

Your math checks out, but there are a few things I disagree on.

First, 5 microns is very small. I can't find an exact figure, but the first hit on Google puts milled corn flour at 1 - 100 microns. I imagine it would take a ball mill to get to your size.

Secondly, your central assumption is that the powder deposits itself as an even monolayer with no gaps between the particles. I beg to differ. Your sinuses will have some latent moisture in them, which will dissolve / wick the incoming particles and, at some rate, re-wet the surface, allowing more particles to adsorb (stick). I have no idea what rate that would be, but you assume that the entire dose is administered instantly, instead of being spread out over several seconds. I imagine that at these scales, wicking and dissolution would be significant factors.