IGNVS
Bluelighter
whats the closest related to 5-htp besides bufotenine
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N&PD Moderators: Skorpio
Small Qs and As about chemistry
- Thread starter Survival0200
- Start date
Beenhead
Bluelight Crew
MattPsy said:
Ohh sorry, I thought the methyl was attatched to the amine but yeah, its on the same carbon that the amine is attached to! My bad. God I cant wait until I take Organic in the Spring!
Beenhead
Bluelight Crew
IGNVS said:
Nothing psychoactive Im aware of
Beenhead
Bluelight Crew
Damn I was thinking Melatonin, but then I was like thats not psychoactive. I should have noticed that one because Melatonin is similar to 5-meo-amt!
Matt youre the Alpha position Master!
Survival0200
Bluelighter
Just curious: when the drug companies make a certain medicine - like citalopram tablets: do they actually make the active ingredient by hand or is there a machine, that makes it (citalopram)? I mean, is there a chemist somewhere in a dark small room, that makes a kilo of something (like citalopram) by hand (and then it's of course dispersed into 100 000 tablets mechanically (adding the inactive ingredients and then pressing the tablets))? Do they have so complex machines, that can be programmed into making something like citalopram automatically? I understand compounds like acetylsalicylic acid or chloral hydrate to be simple enough, that a machine can produce a ton of it no problem, but how about something more complicated?
The citalopram is just an example, that came into my mind, because I'm actually eating it every day.
I'm not asking trade secrets or the synthesis process in detail - just how these things are done commonly these days.Last edited:Correct me if I'm wrong but I think for compounds as widely used as that there is an upscaling conversion of the production process to meet industrial manufacture requirements. Most steps are probably carried out in huge reactors where conditions are very closely monitored with sensitive technology which simulate lab conditions only automatically regulated.
After checking the free patent for manufacture it seems there is at least one step that requires careful purification, this may be done on somewhat smaller scale in parallel using chromatographic columns and by checking analysis of fractions as usual. But even this can be expected to be optimized to be done as automatically and automatically as possible since this is much more cost-effective than people messing with smaller scales.
Depending on the complexity of synthesis the manufacture is carried out in some number of facilities taking care of one or more parts of the process.
I think you can safely assume that even something as complicated as (es)citalopram is still not a problem for 'machines' to do the far majority or all of the work, especially since it's so widely used. Don't underestimate the amounts involved in global use and the sheer fortunes that are to be made by producing it and perfecting the process.
Incredibly complex biological irregular heterocyclic compounds that have little or no use in the pharmaceutical world - that is pretty much the opposite story. Even biochemicals are produced industrially but if the number of substitutions grows so large that an incredible number of steps is needed to protect each moiety, then it's a whole different story. If there is an application, the industry probably still won't be interested to pursue this in the first place unless there are enzymes found in nature that can do the work for them.
More than a little bit of manual labor is probably not an option for these guys.
However if the price is high enough, suddenly much more can be facilitated. Incorporate basic 'demand' (and supply) into the equation, always. If the sum is positive and other conditions like risk profiles are looking good, then there is development to be expected in the field.
Anyone correct me if I'm wrong. I'm inferring stuff all over the place even if I am trying to put an educated answer in this post.King Kong
Bluelighter
For the production, chromatographic columns are pretty unusual. Purification are performed by mainly crystallization or distillation... and yeha, purification are a big issue!
And the production are performed in very big reactors, that have analytical tools when it's needed. For technicians, a very big procedure is written (every little step is detailed). Basically, what they do is adding or removing the right amount of product...
SerotonergicHaze
Bluelighter
I hope this isn't considered breaking the synthesis rule, since I have no desire in knowing the exact process.
How is pharmaceutical amphetamine produced, do they actually grow ephedra crops for it, or do they use another process perhaps involving petrochemical precursors.They'll produce it from readily available petrochemical precursors. Morphine is quite a large, complex molecule that would be reasonably expensive and time consuming to synthesise, so it makes sense to get the poppy to do the work. Amphetamine is a really simple little thing.
Roger&Me
Bluelight Crew
Look up "process chemistry" and you should be able to find some good info, its the area of chemistry that deals with mass-production of chemical compounds. Process chemists in the pharmaceutical industry are typically much more skilled than your average synthetic chemist -- you need a great deal of chemical engineering knowledge in addition to experience with synthetic organic chemistry.
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