Opioids Should withdrawals continue to get worse after a week?

[Altered Perception]

I've been taking Oxycodone daily for 5 years and now I'm trying to quit by cutting down from 100mg which consists of:

5 X 20mg instant release Oxycodone Hydrochloride = 100mg

So what I've been doing is instead of eating 5 of the 20mg capsules (100mg) , I hold out until bedtime and then eat only 2 of the 20mg capsules, so thats 40mg.
Now that 40mg dose seems to be sufficient to help me sleep and stop the withdrawals until the next night before bed but then things start going downhill as each day passes. This is what I don't understand. Shouldn't it get easier? Then why is it getting harder for me?

Let me show you.

day 1: took 2 X 20mg capsules (40mg) at 12pm midnight- no withdrawals and able to wait until the next dose

day 2: took 2 X 20mg capsules (40mg) at 12pm midnight - mild withdrawals but able to wait for next days dose

day 3: took 2 X 20mg capsules (40mg) at 12pm midnight -woke up with withdrawals next day but was able to hang on until 12 pm midnight

day 4: took 2 X 20mg capsules (40mg) at 12pm midnight - woke up with severe withdrawals, can't wait for 12pm midnight for next dose

So as you can see on day 4 I start to lose it and I can no longer wait for my bedtime dose of 40mg so I end up taking an extra 1 capsule (20mg) upon waking up with withdrawals in the hope that the 1 capsule will help me make it until midnight in which I can take my 2 capsules (40mg). But then it gets worse...

day 6: took 1 X20mg (20mg) upon waking up from sleep, but then before my next midnight dose began to experience withdrawals. So at some point even taking an early dose of 20mg followed by 40mg at midnight becomes insufficient. This is what I dont understand. That's what i need help with. It never used to be like this but I think i may have fucked up my opiate receptors by doing something called "kindling" its where you quit for a few days and then relapse and then quit again for a few days again and then binge and then relapse and when you do it often enough your opiate receptors get confused and messed up.

Looking forward to your opinion. Thank you.

 

[RobotRipping]

kindling may explain this; either way you're gonna have to pay for those highs man, it sucks but at some point or another it's gonna hit you and you gotta get through it. Taper taper taper, don't increase your dosages, ensure you have a stable supply of oxycodone in ur bloodstream and that's it. Enough to get you through and less and less each day.

i can't help you understand what's going on with you biologically but it's going to take more than 6 days for you to start feeling better.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Withdrawal is like that.. It's very progressive. Over time, even if your dose is remaining constant and the time of the day you use, your withdrawals will eventually both happen faster and become more severe. Also, going back and forth from being clean and using, makes each withdrawal cycle longer and more painful.

 

[Altered Perception]

ensure you have a stable supply of oxycodone in ur bloodstream and that's it.

what you said about "have a stable supply of oxycodone in ur bloodstream" well that seems to be the key in this whole problem. It feels like i need to keep that supply at a constant level (not enough to get me high but just enough to stop the discomfort of withdrawals) and with each day the level in my blood stream drops lower so I have to take more and more to try and keep it at the same level, that's exactly what it feels like to me so I am surprised you described the same thing I was thinking. So how do i get around this?

Thanks for your help

 

[Altered Perception]

Withdrawal is like that.. It's very progressive. Over time, even if your dose is remaining constant and the time of the day you use, your withdrawals will eventually both happen faster and become more severe. Also, going back and forth from being clean and using, makes each withdrawal cycle longer and more painful.

To be honest I wasn't sure how exactly withdrawals should feel because I've never successfully quit opiates before. I'ts the first time I started using them for pain relief 5 yaers agao and I've been on it daily ever since. So this whole thing is uncharted territory for me, but early on when i did take a few days off tapering down seemed a lot more effective then it is now. But after years of kindling I've ended up with this problem where withdrawals get worse each day despite taking the same low dose of 40mg and at some point I end up needing an extra 20mg in between and even that stop being enough.

Is that still normal?

 

[Mass08]

I don't think there is a way around that....that's life while physically dependent upon opioids.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

To be honest I wasn't sure how exactly withdrawals should feel because I've never successfully quit opiates before. I'ts the first time I started using them for pain relief 5 yaers agao and I've been on it daily ever since. So this whole thing is uncharted territory for me, but early on when i did take a few days off tapering down seemed a lot more effective then it is now. But after years of kindling I've ended up with this problem where withdrawals get worse each day despite taking the same low dose of 40mg and at some point I end up needing an extra 20mg in between and even that stop being enough.

Is that still normal?

Unfortunately, yes that is normal. We all go through the same thing with our habits, regardless of our opiate of choice. It's a bitch, man.. that's all there is to it. Such is the nature of the beast.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

what you said about "have a stable supply of oxycodone in ur bloodstream" well that seems to be the key in this whole problem. It feels like i need to keep that supply at a constant level (not enough to get me high but just enough to stop the discomfort of withdrawals) and with each day the level in my blood stream drops lower so I have to take more and more to try and keep it at the same level, that's exactly what it feels like to me so I am surprised you described the same thing I was thinking. So how do i get around this?

Thanks for your help

You may have to resort to only making the withdrawals milder than "stopping their discomfort". Reduce your dose gradually, but be prepared for it being a little uncomfortable. This is pretty likely to happen, especially given oxycodone's short duration. Depending on how you taper, withdrawals may or may not get worse after a week, but generally I think after one week the worst of it should be over... Unless you're still taking a large amount and have a long way left to go.
Going cold turkey, usually they're over in one week, unless you're coming off very large doses over a lengthy period.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Altered Perception, the typical opiate withdrawal scenario/timeline, (keep in mind this is simply an average of experiences, it still varies greatly and has many variables) is the acute phase lasting about a week, with day 3 being the most intense.. It is usually a build up of severity until you hit the 3rd day mark and then on day 4, you begin to feel better. By day 7, the majority of the acute phase is over and you then make the transition into PAWS, or a post-acute phase... this one can last anywhere from another week or two to a couple months.

 

[pasha]

Kindling only applies to alchohol or any any other GABAergic withdrawal. Repetitive acute withdrawals from these substances can impair neuroadaption of excitory and inhibitory neurons which in turn leads to neurotoxicity which leads to excitoxicity.

As far as your tapering goes, look at like this: when typical withdrawals happen they're mild on the first day, get worst on the second, and the third. You have to remember that you've removed 60 milligrams of oxycodone and that's why your withdrawal is getting progressively worst day by day indicative of natural opioid withdrawal symptoms. When these symptoms disappear which they will in time it means your body has adjusted to your new dose. Its all about asking yourself, "would I rather have moderate withdrawal symptoms for 10-15 days (however long your planning to taper), or would I rather have severe withdrawals for 3-4 days and not taper at all?"

The reason your facing issues with your taper is that your using IR oxycodone. If possible switch to a opioid with a longer half life so it can hold you for longer, if not space out your 40 milligrams throughout the day. Another issue is that you dropped 60milligrams at once, so it may take a little longer for your body to adjust.

 

[hefe1313]

Yes that is normal for some people. since you are still taking some oxy you are delaying the withdrawl. ex. if you would have gone cold turkey, you would have felt the worst of it on the 1st or 2nd night instead of the 4th night.
just keep going man. stick with it, it will get better. from how it sounds things should get better in another few days.
your body is slowing getting rid of the oxy instead of a waterfall of stuff(if ya know what i mean lol) id rather have a slow progresive withdrawl like a taper.

 

[Altered Perception]

Okay thanks everyone. Maybe going from 5X20mg (100mg) to a sudden 2X20mg (40mg) is a big shock to my system. I guess I should have tapered down a lot more gradually, but I just though the quicker I cut my dose the quicker I could deal with withdrawals and get over it but it didn't turn out the way i hope. I guess I'l just have to continue dealing with it.

The reason I made this topic is because I was worried seeng myself require more Oxycodone and more during the quitting process. Because I should be decreasing my dose not increasing it but my body is not content with the decreased amount as each day passes i feel the need to increase it slightly more to take the edge off and that itself defeats the whole process of quitting

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Okay thanks everyone. Maybe going from 5X20mg (100mg) to a sudden 2X20mg (40mg) is a big shock to my system. I guess I should have tapered down a lot more gradually, but I just though the quicker I cut my dose the quicker I could deal with withdrawals and get over it but it didn't turn out the way i hope. I guess I'l just have to continue dealing with it.

The reason I made this topic is because I was worried seeng myself require more Oxycodone and more during the quitting process. Because I should be decreasing my dose not increasing it but my body is not content with the decreased amount as each day passes i feel the need to increase it slightly more to take the edge off and that itself defeats the whole process of quitting

Yes, tapering your dose down much more gradually will help big time.. You reduced your dose by more than 50%.. That's going to fuck up anybody.

 

[RedRum OG]

Make it through a week of oxy kicks and the worst is over.

Like others have said the more times you get hooked on opiates, the worse it gets every time.

It's incredibly hard to taper on oxy. It's short lasting and a full-agonist, just about as bad as it can get-this combo leaves you itching to feel stoned. If you keep failing at quitting get on Suboxone. It is long lasting, and it won't get you "high" like oxy even if you are bad and take more than you should. Once you stabilize you can taper and I promise it'll be much easier to taper than oxy. You could probably get by on .25mg(maybe .5mg) 3x a day and feel okay-ish. I would highly recommend this. And whatever you do, do not get on methadone

Good luck. Clonodine and hydroxyzine work wonders, maybe look up kratom too

 

[Altered Perception]

okay i understand now. I seemed to have forgotten a very important point that Oxycodone is short acting, especially in lower doses. So it makes sense that its not lasting me the next day through unless I have a big hit of it. The only other thing I have here is tramadol which maybe longer acting, so i may try that as a morning dose to help me get through until my midnight dose.

Suboxone sounds great but unfortunately it has drug addict written all over it and even mentioning the word to my family doctor might cause him to cut me off from prescribing me Oxycodone ever again. I can't risk that as I may need it again at some point in my life.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Make it through a week of oxy kicks and the worst is over.

Like others have said the more times you get hooked on opiates, the worse it gets every time.

It's incredibly hard to taper on oxy. It's short lasting and a full-agonist, just about as bad as it can get-this combo leaves you itching to feel stoned. If you keep failing at quitting get on Suboxone. It is long lasting, and it won't get you "high" like oxy even if you are bad and take more than you should. Once you stabilize you can taper and I promise it'll be much easier to taper than oxy. You could probably get by on .25mg(maybe .5mg) 3x a day and feel okay-ish. I would highly recommend this. And whatever you do, do not get on methadone

Good luck. Clonodine and hydroxyzine work wonders, maybe look up kratom too

To some extent, buprenorphine can be just as problematic as methadone, despite only being a partial agonist. The withdrawal symptoms from both can last several weeks.

 

[pasha]

To some extent, buprenorphine can be just as problematic as methadone, despite only being a partial agonist. The withdrawal symptoms from both can last several weeks.

This^

Maintenance drugs are commonly mistaken as withdrawal aids. They're ineffective as such. They're only beneficial if an individual intends to remain on opioids with a relatively stable lifestyle.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

This^

Maintenance drugs are commonly mistaken as withdrawal aids. They're ineffective as such. They're only beneficial if an individual intends to remain on opioids with a relatively stable lifestyle.

Not true. They can be very effective for non-maintence if used properly... A short one month taper on either methadone or bupe can be really benifical. The doctors and shit make it sound like those meds can only be used and should only be used for very long periods of time, but that's just because they are greedy bastards and want you to keep paying every month, more so with bupe.

 

[rhun]

OP, the reason you're feeling like crap is because you're not tapering correctly.

Taking two pills once a day first off, is going going to make you feel like crap the rest of the time since it doesn't last long. And secondly, 40mg all at once isn't a good idea either.

I would start over at your 100mg a day. Or if your tolerance has decreased, start at a lower amount like 70-80mg. Take half a pill or a full pill every 4-6 hours.. or whenever the initial dose wheres off. You want to maintain a steady amount of opiate in your system instead of having highs and lows. Otherwise, you'll just be suffering through the low periods so you can be high again. You don't want to be high, just not in full WD.

So decide on whatever amount you're going to take daily, whether it's 70mg or back at 100mg depending on the extent of your WD. Then divide it evenly by daypart. So for example if you're taking 100mg, take 20mg 5x per day. Then, decrease your dose daily. 100mg a day is pretty high compared to most people taking Oxy for pain but many addicts take much more. I would decrease by 10mg daily until you get down to 50mg then decrease by 5mg until you get down to 10mg then decrease by 2mg daily. Once you're at 2mg for a day go down to 1mg and then if you want you could take 1mg every other day then stop. If you're really trying to minimize WD. Most people want to just get it over with.. but trust me it's easier mentally and physically to just taper slowly. When I did a CT I was horribly sick for weeks but what was really terrible was how extreme the PAWS was.

 

[Altered Perception]

Take half a pill or a full pill every 4-6 hours.. or whenever the initial dose wheres off. You want to maintain a steady amount of opiate in your system instead of having highs and lows.

Now there's an interesting thought. I never tried that but it sounds like it could have potential. Can you please tell me what the benefits are of doing it that way? Have you or anyone else you know tried it that way ? I just want to make sure that taking the Oxycodone continuously in small dose through out the day isn't going to end up making me worse. Don't get me wrong, I like the idea but one thing concerns me and thats if I start taking it more regularly, (even though its relatively smaller doses) my body might crave it more often once I give it up.

If there is one thing I've done well over the 5 years of using Oxycodone is that I've kept my dose down to once a day, with the exception of trying to quit where i take an extra secondary dose to get me through as described earlier. So I'm afraid to mess that up, unless off course you say it won't change my frequency of use in the long run. Thanks for your help, I look forward to trying out your method.