Serotonergic psychedelics inducing headaches?

[apsig]

I am somewhat familiar with the beneficial effects that a number of serotonergic compounds (psilocybin, psilocin, various ergoloids, etc) have for sufferers of cluster headaches. As a result, I find it somewhat puzzling that psychedelic phenethylamines (2C-I and 2C-E) tend to cause headaches when I use them. These headaches do not respond to ibuprofen, naproxen sodium, or aspirin.

It is not altogether uncommon to hear people speak of headaches during the comedown from psychedelic use. Most discussions I have seen attribute this to reduced food intake during the trip, dehydration, etc. In my case, however, a headache develops almost immediately after the substance takes effect and persists throughout the trip, in spite of attempts to maintain adequate hydration and electrolyte concentrations. I would imagine that this has something to do with the activation of 5-HT receptors in cranial blood vessels.

Are there any substances that could be ingested in order to mitigate this effect? Thanks to anyone who can offer any advice.

 

[max_]

dehydration may be a good guess,, although my guess is: high blood pressure..

I basically can't take phens if its not with opiates or benzos on the side.

 

[allium]

I heared somewhere that PEAs cause vasoconstriction. The 2-3 days after trip I can feel pulsing in my head when I stand up.
Aspirine, and pills containing Codeine+Naproxen+Metamizole sodium+Caffeine+Phenobarbital seem to lessen my headaches, but I respond differently to psychedelics, I get headaches only after trip(not during it).

I am somewhat familiar with the beneficial effects that a number of serotonergic compounds (psilocybin, psilocin, various ergoloids, etc) have for sufferers of cluster headaches. As a result, I find it somewhat puzzling that psychedelic phenethylamines (2C-I and 2C-E) tend to cause headaches when I use them.

From what I know, tryptamines have affinity to 5-ht1 receptors, whereas phenethylamines don't. And if I remember correctly, many anti-migraine medications are 5-ht1 agonists.
Sorry if I used incorrect terminology or wrong somewhere.

 

[melange]

probably vasoconstriction or dehydration like the others said


on the note of the 5ht1 receptor being involved, I just read this about Sumatriptan:

"Sumatriptan is structurally similar to serotonin (5HT), and is a 5-HT (types 5-HT1D and 5-HT1B[7]) agonist. The specific receptor subtypes it activates are present on the cranial arteries and veins. Acting as an agonist at these receptors, Sumatriptan reduces the vascular inflammation associated with migraine.

The specific receptor subtype it activates is present in the cranial and basilar arteries. Activation of these receptors causes vasoconstriction of those dilated arteries. Sumatriptan is also shown to decrease the activity of the trigeminal nerve, which probably accounts for sumatriptan's efficacy in treating cluster headaches. The injectable form of the drug has been shown to abort a cluster headache within fifteen minutes in 96% of cases."



I always pondered on the paradox with migraines and serotonergic drugs.


A lot of tryptamines relieve headaches, but other serotonergic drugs like the psychedelic piperazine's can cause profound headaches.

 

[Limpet_Chicken]

piperazines have pronounced 5HT2c agonist effects often..known to induce migraines.


I know (unfortunately, shes a fucking goatwhore of a perditionslut mother of a syphilitic cunt) 'person' who developed migraines reliably on taking Psilocybe cyanescens, but oddly, not P.semilanceata. And not to my knowledge, DMT which she took on several occasions.

And also said 'person' tripped her arse off after taking one brand, but not another, of sumatriptan (brand she didn't, was imigran)

 

[Deleted member 137730]

I would think serotonergic psychs would be more likely to induce headaches through downregulation of 5htp receptors, causing a tension headache. On the other hand increased 5htp releas is associated with migraine. Either way, its not suprise a serotonergic drug induced a headache.

 

[delic]

I've had migraines my whole life. Once I came into a large amount of 2C-B (before it was scheduled) and enjoyed taking it frequently for many months. But by the end of this period I would get a severe, long-lasting, treatment-resistant headache as the 2C-B was wearing off. As this became consistent and unavoidable, I had to stop using 2C-B. I don't think the problem was related to hydration or food because it wasn't present initially, and because I am able to avoid migraines with other substances which inhibit appetite and cause urinary excretion, even including piperazines.

 

[any major dude]

With 4-sub-tryptamines i would venture a guess that it is akin to the "rebound headache" phenomenon common to triptan class migraine medications. Some people seem to be a lot more susceptible to it than others. It also seems to be a bit more common in females, IME

 

[rakketakke]

My first experience with LSD ended in unbearable headaches at the end of the trip... Seemed like my head would explode... really painful. I only had that once though, makes me wonder what was the reason...