Realizing the Shulgin’s vision of understanding ourselves

[Allylbenzene]

Tom Ray had twenty-five psychedelic drugs from Shulgin’s toolkit broadly assayed by the National Institute of Mental Health – Psychoactive Drug Screening Program.
By synthesizing the subjective experience and molecular affinity data, he has been able to realize the Shulgin’s vision of using their toolkit of drugs to advance our understanding of the relationships between the brain, the drugs, and the mind; and most importantly, our understanding of ourselves.

“I’m looking for tools that can be used for studying the mind, and other people then will use the tools in finding out the aspects of the mental process and how it ties to the brain.”
– Sasha 1996

Sasha was onto something big. I believe that the greatest scientific value of Sasha’s work is that he has left behind a diverse toolkit of probes into the human mind, that allow the unlocking of many of its secrets. Sasha has provided us with a methodology for mental discovery. I don’t believe that there is any other method that can make as deep a penetration into the structure, function, process, genetics, development, and evolution of the human mind, and mechanisms of consciousness. We can put this knowledge to work not just in providing newapproaches to understanding the etiology, diagnosing, treating, and healing mental disorders; but also in understanding ourselves. We owe these discoveries to the foundations that Sasha has laid.

In choosing the drugs for this study, I have included drugs to represent both structural and qualitative diversity. I drew up a list of twenty-five drugs in consultation with Alexander Shulgin, Ann Shulgin, and Dave Nichols.

Full video presentation here (from Transform Press)

Breadth and Depth - TransformPress

Tom Ray builds on the work of the Shulgins, taking the next steps they envisioned:

transformpress.com

 

[M!$TER-ED]

The potential benefits for mental health found psychedelics is great however, in regards to individuals predisposed to psychosis studies and research has been overlooked altogether for means of treatment.
Psilocybin regenerates damaged brain cells and receptors by rewiring the brain for better / healthier communication. Hallucinations or thought disturbances beyond the norm are types of psychosis but not altogether harmful compared to psychosis associated with schizophrenia.
Unfortunately, psychosis is viewed negatively and considered dangerous especially to people with a history of psychosis. Therefore, psychedelic research for people diagnosed with schizophrenia are not eligible for study. At the risk of finding a cure for schizophrenia people diagnosed with schizophrenia are not eligible to participate in the research study.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

The potential benefits for mental health found psychedelics is great however, in regards to individuals predisposed to psychosis studies and research has been overlooked altogether for means of treatment.

So that means as in Psychedelic s as treatment for Psychosis an/ or Schizophrenia.
Being ovelooked atm by science/ medicin/ healthcare ?

Psilocybin regenerates damaged brain cells and receptors by rewiring the brain for better / healthier communication.

Feel to me that Truffles/ Mushroom s are better then Lysegic s or Phenethylaminen.
But that is going by my instinct through experience,

On paper they all seem to stimulate Neuro-Plasticity.
But after a hard time, on Psilocybine. [regular/ normal for me]
Minus the come up and 4/ 6 hour s, the active part.
The after effect s always lasting, i feel better, for week s.

Unlike a Lysergic would. Wonder if its Psylocybin, the Mushrooom,
or Tryptamine s ?

Hallucinations or thought disturbances beyond the norm are types of psychosis but not altogether harmful compared to psychosis associated with schizophrenia.
Unfortunately, psychosis is viewed negatively and considered dangerous especially to people with a history of psychosis. Therefore, psychedelic research for people diagnosed with schizophrenia are not eligible for study. At the risk of finding a cure for schizophrenia people diagnosed with schizophrenia are not eligible to participate in the research study.

Watched a friend go through some Psychosis, can t do THC since,
he ll get acute psychosis. He is un-medicated now, his hope.
Really also changed him, or must have hit hard, so young,

During Ictal Psychosis that can come pre-during-post seizures.
That where i got them, only you are un-conscious during.
Was later told like human Ape, they restrained me with 3 guy s.

 

[M!$TER-ED]

THC / cannabis makes me psychotic Don't know why but it does. Curious though why THC affects people differently? Heavy long-term use of MDA is what caused original psychosis and depression. White Golden Teacher mushrooms and synthetic psilocybin restored damaged brain cells to the point of not needing antidepressant medication. If I could have continued taking psychedelics on regular basis I would not need antipsychotic medication either. However, as it stands 4.5 mg Vraylar is beneficial to overall wellbeing.
I believe if psilocybin, mescaline and DMT were made available for consumer use based on therapeutic value preassigned mental health drugs would become obsolete. Big Pharm will not support psychedelics based on potential loss of revenue from standard mental health treatment drugs, which by the way are very dangerous to overall health of an individual.

 

[CavernsoftheMind]

Damn, what an interesting lecture.

The receptor theory by Tom Ray goes against everything I know about psychopharmacology.
Serotonin-2 being anti-psychedelic f.e

It sounds like I have to try mixing 2C-B-Fly with an Imidazoline agonist.

If the way he interprets the flavors of receptors is true, this could revolutionize psychonautic exploration of new drug combinations.

 

[Allylbenzene]

The receptor theory by Tom Ray goes against everything I know about psychopharmacology.
Serotonin-2 being anti-psychedelic f.e

Well he doesn't actually say that 5-HT2A agonism is anti-psychedelic. He just says that 5-HT2A is the primary mediator of psychedelic effects.

His general idea that all the receptors influence the psychedelic experience is quite sensible. As he put's it:

"The distinct and unique flavor of each drug arises from its pattern of interaction with various receptors."

In the current paradigm the effects of psychedelic drugs are understood to be primarily mediated through 5-HT2A/C, the two closely related key receptors. They are believed to be responsible for most of the effects of psychedelics, including consciousness expansion, creative open-eyed visuals, ego-loss, loss of contact withreality, alternate realities, mystical experiences, and experiences of substantial personal meaning and spiritual significance.

In the “full-flavor psychopharmacology” paradigm, there is no key psychedelic receptor. Rather, psychedelic drugs interact with dozens of different receptors and every receptor produces a perceptible effect when activated.

These observations have helped to clarify the mechanism by which 5-HT2 is psychedelic: 5-HT2 can load content mental organs into consciousness. Because there are many distinct contentmental organs, the subjective qualitative experience that emerges from this loading will vary from one drug to another, depending on what combination of mental organs are loaded into consciousness.
This is “full-flavor psychopharmacology”, and it accounts for much of the qualitative diversity among psychedelics.

Shulgin (and others) wrote about this:

After the emergence of the 5-HT2 paradigm the full-flavor concept appeared mainly outside of the mainstream of neuroscience (Shulgin & Shulgin, 1991) (Goldsmith, 2007) (Doyle, 2011)(Coyle et al., 2012) (Ray, 2012).
A concept of complex action was advanced by (Shulgin & Shulgin, 1991):

It sounds like I have to try mixing 2C-B-Fly with an Imidazoline agonist.

Shulgin used rilmenidine and clonidine (Imidazoline agonists) for his 2C-B-Fly experiments but a good OTC alternative is the Agmatine (endogenous imidazoline agonist). It's also active at sigma-1 (like DMT), 5-HT2A and as an NMDA antagonist which makes it pretty suitable for psychoactive purposes. A few people have realised it's psychoactive potential.

Spoiler: Agmatine reports

Feels exactly like a long lasting ketamine for me. Very obvious it is a NMDA receptor antagonist. It’s supposed to effect calcium channels similarly to pregabalin and for me doses as low as 250mg absolutely increase the effects of pregabalin. I’d go as far to say agmatine is very strong in its own right, especially as an NMDA Antagonist.

reddit.com/r/gabagoodness/comments/o51plu/does_agmatine_have_any_recreational_properties_or/

So someone here recently recommended me to mix Agmatine Sulfate with Kanna extract and this truly changes the game in relation to the rush. As we all know, sometimes the rush can be a bit anxiety-inducing, unsettling, etc, but when adding Agmatine Sulfate (I use around a gram 1 hour before) not only makes the whole Kanna experience cleaner and more euphoric, but smoothens out the rush in a way that makes it extremely orgasmic, it feels so close to the comeup of a MDMA experience, a love-filled I euphoric I want to hug the world empathogenic type of experience, with little to no discomfort added in relation to it.

reddit.com/r/Kanna/comments/18qr34z/how_to_smoothen_the_rush_agmatine_sulfate/

I just started taking Agmatine to lower my tolerance to other substances, and I heard that it also effects the Cannabanoid Receptors, but i didnt think it would do THAT much. I took a single evening dose of 500mg, a little later took a few hits, then another hour an a half i smoked 2 more hits, and then all of a sudden I was SO HIGH i could barely walk or talk. It felt like I took a whole edible plus some. And mind you, I smoke everyday just about. This is one promising supplement it seems. There was nothing on this sub on the search of agmatine so figured I'd add something to it for others wondering the same.

reddit.com/r/Marijuana/comments/zt0afy/agmatine_sulphate_supplement_cannabis_wow/

In essence, I've been doing 2.6 grams of Agmatine once a week since the beginning of November/December.

It shares a similiar, primary, MOA (mTor & AMPA) as ketamine in terms of neurogenesis, and it has some pretty pleasant 5HT2-A agonistic actions making it as en excellent insight tool (no hallucinations though).

In depth information can be found in my previous posts. It is particularly interesting that it does not have any hallucinatory effects, such as OEVs and CEVs, despite its 5HT2 actions. Yet distinctly feels very much like a psychedelic in terms of time-dilatation, emotions, and insight. A topic discussed in one of the links below.

reddit.com/r/Nootropics/comments/7t5779/agmatine_metamorphosis/

If the way he interprets the flavors of receptors is true, this could revolutionize psychonautic exploration of new drug combinations.

Absolutely. For the psychedelic arena I think it may take time for people to realise the potential of his work since the mainstream focus is on 5-HT2A/C.

 

[M!$TER-ED]

There is a vast difference between knowing yourself and understanding yourself. understanding yourself you may get why you do things etc but knowing yourself gives you the power to implement what you know about yourself.
it is more fun knowing what you're doing than understanding why you are doing it.

 

[M!$TER-ED]

know thyself and to thine own self be true.

Internal and external conflicts cause stress and wear & tear on mind, body and soul. I used the soul as a reference, not in a religious sense of the word but more like the inner essence of who we are.

All that you are is at your command, although many people don't realize the power they have until later in life . The power is an accumulation of experiences that made and developed your unique self unlike any other person on earth, past, present or future.
You come to realize the power of your choices and their long lasting results. As you age you see patterns of life events and from experience you learn to adapt and adopt these changes with ease or difficulty depending on your openness to change.

According to Perplexity: https://www.perplexity.ai/search/2133b600-52fc-46ea-bbfa-3e0517aed937

 

[Deleted member 576750]

How about knowing yourself..not just understanding yourself?

what is the difference between knowing and understanding

 

[TheLightBringer]

Well he doesn't actually say that 5-HT2A agonism is anti-psychedelic. He just says that 5-HT2A is the primary mediator of psychedelic effects.

His general idea that all the receptors influence the psychedelic experience is quite sensible. As he put's it:




Shulgin (and others) wrote about this:



Shulgin used rilmenidine and clonidine (Imidazoline agonists) for his 2C-B-Fly experiments but a good OTC alternative is the Agmatine (endogenous imidazoline agonist). It's also active at sigma-1 (like DMT), 5-HT2A and as an NMDA antagonist which makes it pretty suitable for psychoactive purposes. A few people have realised it's psychoactive potential.

Spoiler: Agmatine reports

reddit.com/r/gabagoodness/comments/o51plu/does_agmatine_have_any_recreational_properties_or/

reddit.com/r/Kanna/comments/18qr34z/how_to_smoothen_the_rush_agmatine_sulfate/

reddit.com/r/Marijuana/comments/zt0afy/agmatine_sulphate_supplement_cannabis_wow/

reddit.com/r/Nootropics/comments/7t5779/agmatine_metamorphosis/

Absolutely. For the psychedelic arena I think it may take time for people to realise the potential of his work since the mainstream focus is on 5-HT2A/C.

Have you noticed anything from agmatine by itself? Ive tried agmatine from 500mg to 3 grams and only ever noticed a better pump in the gym from it…
Even using it daily in 1 - 2g dosages for its supposed nootropic effects and also using it on top of a whole range of cholinergic nootropics and in conjunction with GABAergics I never noticed anything from it

 

[Leprechaun]

Sasha never really was too interested in the receptors. The reason I believe is the “mind” is not something you can describe with receptor subtypes.

There’s no way you can describe the feeling of driving a car by telling you how a steering wheel works.

It makes sense that exploring the mind is something which should be done in a respectful and healthy way. It should not be shamed or taboo.

Knowledge and healthy relationships
To drugs is a reasonable way to facilitate self exploration.

I wish when I was younger I had a guide, the best I had was Pihkal and Tihkal. Which likely saved my life, offering advice and examples of healthy and respectful approaches to using various compounds to alter your body and mind.

 

[Allylbenzene]

The reason I believe is the “mind” is not something you can describe with receptor subtypes.

I agree. If you skim the video you'll see that receptors get associated with various archetypes which is quite interesting.

 

[Leprechaun]

Have you noticed anything from agmatine by itself? Ive tried agmatine from 500mg to 3 grams and only ever noticed a better pump in the gym from it…
Even using it daily in 1 - 2g dosages for its supposed nootropic effects and also using it on top of a whole range of cholinergic nootropics and in conjunction with GABAergics I never noticed anything from it

The idea of nootropics was I believe to reduce damage done through stress and intense work.

More likely a shield than active acute experience.