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quitting pot like quitting heroin?

mentally theyre pretty much identical, other than that not really even comparible. MAYBE the insomnia, but when i quit weed i would have trouble sleeping and roll around forever and end up sleeping in bits and pieces then finally maybe like 3 hours at the end of the night. With heroin i literally do not sleep. At all. for days. also any physical stuff from weed like sleeping appetite and like irritability and stuff only lasted a few days and then it was tolerable, heroin goes on much longer.
 
Contradicted yourself there. They have clinics for weed detox where you check in for 5 days and they help and administer benzo's here in Australia. Too bad I didn't know until after. My GP seemed to think weed addiction isn't a serious problem.

not really, suboxen is made to block receptors of craving and needing heroin to function and it changes the chemistry in the brain that is pertanant to the problem of needing heroin to make serotonin and dopamine and well basically to function. A benzo to stop your anxiety and not give a fuck is kind of like just throwing water of everything that is on fire whether it be liquid or material.
 
At my peak usage I was consuming about 14 grams a day in the form of Supercritical Fluid Extracts (butane)

yeild was usually around .8 to a gram of resins and THC.

friends called it hippy crack.

im sorry brain
 
quitting weed mainly means insomnia and depression. not much to worry about, you can still function socially and at work

withdrawal from heroin confines you to the bed in as much agony as many biological diseases

either way you want out (no one wants to be depressed, or feel opiate w/d) but one is obviously worse

most people don't seem to even notice marijuana withdrawal. many seem to not notice it but still get plenty of cravings. heroin withdrawal will always be noticeable with adequate length of daily use

the reason is opiates influence the basic breathing/life maintenance systems, while marijuana doesn't. when parts of the brain have extra or less signals, the brain adapts. if it adapts over enough time, and whatever is causing the increased signal (drug) is taken away, the signals will swing in the opposite direction. with benzos or opiates, this means pure stress physiologically and psychologically. with marijuana, this means a little less pleasure from the environment; the brain doesn't place as high a priority on re-adjusting the marijuana neurons because they're not vital to physiological functions like heart beat, blood pressure, etc
Contradicted yourself there. They have clinics for weed detox where you check in for 5 days and they help and administer benzo's here in Australia. Too bad I didn't know until after. My GP seemed to think weed addiction isn't a serious problem.
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benzos would really help a lot by keeping sleep patterns and letting the person relax. many don't see weed addiction as serious, but i think more people than we realize are self-medicating, and taking away their pot can lead to many problems causing them to get rather "addicted" aka they cannot stop even if they want to. not to mention the psychological attachment created when everything is just "better"

i wish the message was "use responsibly and if needed therapeutically" rather than "don't use". things would be a lot better. it has dozens of pharmaceutical uses with a much better safety profile and efficacy than any of the drugs prescribed for those things. anyway
 
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valerian is much safer, and excellent substitute for benzos, its an herb, non habit forming, and otc.

the anxiety and hyper sensitivity is like qwe described, you neurons become use to functioning under its influence, when that influence is gone, your neurons bring firing rapidly. very mediocre compare to benzos or alcohol where the synapses begin firing so fast, that the dt's begin, when they become a constant stream... gran mal seizures take over.
hence as to why one treats the other, and the combination is so dangerous.

valerien does this, but be very subtly, and effectively.

most likely your cannabinoidendocrinesystem is becoming un stimulated though, this to my knowledge can only be helped by diversion of its influence, and some time.
 
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Jakeperson said:
Not worse, just different.

My weed WD's were horrible, I couldn't eat for 2 days, hot and cold flushes (10 days - fading over the time though), unable to get out of bed (1 day), or maintain human contact (13 days in and I still can't be comfortable around people), hallucinations (first 2 days were like a constant LSD high without the good parts), panic attacks(7 days - some still lingering here and there).
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Whether or not you actually experienced those symptoms is questionable, but I hope you realize all of what you described is physiological, therefore completely different from heroin. Heroin will keep you in bed because of anxiety, depression, and severe nausea. Your diet, and thus your affect (mood) probably suffered indirectly due to your marijuana use, but thats your stomach acting completely independent of the THC. THC affects the brain and the brain only. Any physical pain in the stomach, intestines, is not because of withdrawals from weed. There are no cannabinoid receptors in your stomach. It's solely a mental withdrawal. You could have eaten something, you could've left the house, and you could have gone into public. You just didnt want to. Everyone's different, no one however, has ever become physically addicted to marijuana.
 
deez nuggs, shut up and go read some more about cannabis and THC and the endocannabinoid system before you try to contribute more to this thread. Everything you said is bullshit. THC is an agonist at CB1 and CB2 receptors; these receptors are found in just about every kind of cell. If anything, your stomach and pancreas are effected far more by THC than your brain is. Cannabinoid addiction is a physical process very similar to opioid addiction. CB1 and CB2 receptor downregulation in your digestive system leads to all kinds of physical withdrawal symptoms that take place in the stomach, and not in the brain.

Please read before coming back:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabinoid_receptor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocannabinoids
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrahydrocannabinol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_cannabis
 
I've always heard about pot causing irritability and anxiety when stopping but I had to stop like a month back for 10 days when I went on vaca and I'm an everyday smoker for years.

And to be 100% honest I didn't notice a SINGLE shift of anything at all. I actually went to bed earlier too cause I wasn't up high and dazed watching tv for hours. Reading Jakepersons post I'm sorry buddy but cold flashes? hallucinations? unable to get out of bed? From just weed alone?
Someone explain to me why I don't buy half of what he wrote. I'd love to find just one other person in this world who experiences cold flashes and hallucinations getting off of POT of all things. I understand peoples biologies are different but I'm still very sensitive to most drugs I take and never once remember feeling any kind of backlash stopping pot. If you consider stopping pot "bad wds" I'm sorry my friend but you've never properly withdrawed before. Either that or someone had laced your weed with dope.
 
I compltely believe it. I've experienced lots of drug w/ds (opiates, benzo's- constantly, benzo's)- and yet, weed withdrawal has been comparable. I mean, I have had seizures and black outs from diazepam withdrawal- and I'd still say, on a purely mental level, not having pot (when I used to smoked about 2-3oz every fortninght) I was in agony. However, as someone who has had very extreme anxiety and PTSD, I do feel a lot of the symptoms of cannabis withdrawal are in fact symptoms of panic/anxiety.

Coolio is indeed correct in mentioning the cannabis recptors; but, fact is, they seem very resilient to negative feedback. Synthetic cannabinoids are not that comparable to actual cannabis (just as synthetic phenethylamines are not that comporable to "natural" PEA'S) due to a very different affinity and selectivity to said receptors.

Most cannabis withdrawal can be alleviated with the correct mental hardwork, but there is no doubt in my mind that Jake is speaking the truth.

Meditation and exercise and HEALTHY food is essential. If you can't sleep (also essential) try skullcap or valerian, or just knowck yourself out with an antihistamine like promethazine (Phenergan) or doxylamine (Restavit)...
 
I've never had anything near as bad as heroin w/ds when i stopped smoking. I dont know anyone, including myself, who would say the two are even anywhere near the same.
 
Only read the first few posts so sorry if this has been said before, but what exactly is meant by those saying heroin's a physical and psychological addiction, but marijuana's just the latter?

I ask simply because my pot use has been, at various times, pretty damn high, and whenever I quit I get significant physical effects: my (clinical) anxiety/depression is severely exacerbated, and I can't sleep for more than, say, twenty minutes at a time, generally. And as soon as I DO sleep longer, when I wake up I wake up covered (literally) in sweat, heart racing, feeling cold, then hot, then cold, then hot, ad nauseum, and unable to sleep at all for the next hour or so.

I am aware of the fucking horrific effects of getting off H (without having experienced them), but though they're far more extreme, there ARE surely similarities for some users...?
 
Jakeperson said:
+1. I am 10 days into quitting weed and have been very depressed with crying spells for no reason. However I may have mental health issues, pursuing that further.



I had to quit my job to quit weed from being a HEAVY daily smoker for 3 years. And was very incapable of anything for a few days.


Every one is different and every one is going to experience different w/d effects.
It also comes down to how you handle, what help you have, and what is happening in your life at the time.

Any addiction is bad and should be ceased. I experienced all of these effects even with tapering off my weed dosage.
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why did you quit your job? You could have requested time off and quit while you were off of work. It sucks when your brain doesn't make endorphins anymore because it's use to the heroin, that is what drove me crazy when i tired quitting heroin cold turkey...I was so depressed and didn't wanna do shit. But yeah imagine the flu but 10x's worse. I have never been into weed but I've seen my older brother who smoked A LOT for several years quit and he was perfectly fine. He was a little moody but other than that no problems. Just don't see how someone can compare the two and say the quitting weed is almost like quitting heroin.
 
coolio, why be such a jackass? give me a reliable link that shows people have CB receptors in the pancreas, stomach, lungs, anywhere other than the brain. until then, no, i wont shut the fuck up.
 
deez nuggz, try:

http://www.springerlink.com/content/d21k1hnw4407h75x/ " Presence of functional cannabinoid receptors in human endocrine pancreas "
http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.ceca.2005.10.005 "Cannabinoid receptors regulate Ca2+ signals and insulin secretion in pancreatic β-cell "
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17884194 "Cannabinoids inhibit insulin secretion and cytosolic Ca2+ oscillation in islet beta-cells via CB1 receptors."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20602678 "Cannabinoid receptor 1 and 2 agonists increase lipid accumulation in hepatocytes." (excerpt: 'Cannabinoid receptors CB1 and CB2 are expressed in the liver, but their regulation in fatty hepatocytes is poorly documented.')
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/114801250/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0 "CB1 receptors: emerging evidence for central and peripheral mechanisms that regulate energy balance, metabolism, and cardiovascular health"
 
this is turning into a very good, much needed discussion, no shit in my books... mmj is literally, way too help-full in different ways/forms. these are also explanations to why some dislike, or do not like the effects certain strains have on them.

but, the frustration and tension is enough that could chop my key board through. btw, did you see my entry of "critical" references i made in the canna wiki coolio?

OP, is this clarifying for you, this info? out do you feel your thread has grown wings and is flying away from your question...?

or are you learning some here?
 
OP, Heroin w/d is absolutely brutal compared to weed. There's no comparison here.

If you stop weed after using massive amounts on a daily basis, you feel some psychological discomfort - get pissed off easily, loss of appetite, hard time falling asleep maybe..

But with H, my friend was using for like only 6months...And even though it's cheap at $20/gr here, when you're hooked on that brown shit using it daily eventually you'll be upping the dose cause tolerance builds. So it gets really expensive cause he needed 1-2gr a day of the stuff. That's $1200/month. When he didn't have any money left, he sold his most valued items, stuff he had been collecting all his life & really loved, just to buy. After that he went around borrowing money from almost every person he knew.. Weed will never make you pull stuff like that!
I witnessed his withdrawal from the H at a flat we rented just for the purpose. It took a whole week, & you do not want to see what it was like.. He was in bed the whole time unable to do anything, almost hallucinating & unaware of his surroundings for the most of it just screaming in pain that he wants to cut off his legs cause they hurt so much. Puking like crazy & every time we changed his pillow it was *SOAKING* wet with sweat. When he was able to get some shut-eye, he'd have the most horrific nightmares. We had to get him a nurse to hook an IV up by day 2, and mid-way through it all he somehow managed to call a dealer & get him to come & we had a huge fight with him cause we didn't let the dealer in. It's like he was a different person completely. He had said he really wanted to get off it cause it ruined his life, but during withdrawal the pain you feel is so intense that you'll forget how shitty it is to be hooked & will do anything just to get some to make the pain go away.

I myself occasionally took from him & snorted a line or two per day for 1 week, & when i stopped i found myself swirling & twitching around in bed unable to sleep.. I'd smoke some weed, fall asleep, & as soon as the weed wore off I'd be awake again unable at all to lie still in bed.. It was a pretty uncomfortable sensation that lasted a couple nights. I've been off weed for a whole month 6months ago (smoked for 7 years daily) & I never felt any physical discomfort like with H.

Also the psychological w/d symptoms of H are very strong. H makes you feel VERY secure in your own bubble. My friend would sit home with his parents most nights & watch DVDs & stuff..he used to go out every night before H.. So when you quit H it's like you've been in a secure very comfy bubble all this time & it suddenly got burst. You're totally insecure. Even physically, touching your face/beard feels foreign to you & rough/spikey & hurts to touch & you can really, really feel the cold weather.
Wouldn't recommend anybody getting hooked on that poison!
 
Btw i just thought i'd add that i used to take tramadol some times before i ever tried H.. and if i wanna accurately describe H to someone, it's like the same trip/direction/feeling that tramadol gives you, except like 100000x stronger. [unnecessary, and potentially triggering to people who are trying to stay off opiates - n3o]
 
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I remember when I quit weed after using it heavily for fifteen years, for me it was about one or two days of craving it and then after that I just felt better and better. It was amazingly easy.

never done heroin but have been addicted to morphine and other opiates and the withdrawal isn't even in the same league, although I still think benzo withdrawal is worse than all other withdrawal. opiate withdrawal makes you incapacitated, sick, unable to do anything except run back and forth from the toilet to the bathroom...at least when you quit cold turkey.

however, we are all different and the mind is a powerful thing, I have friends who have complained about real withdrawals from pot but I always just felt better in general after quitting.
 
those were all journal entries based on experiments. sure, i guess there may be receptors outside the brain. but I think people have tendencies to let weed undermine motivation and will power; ones very consciousness can mediate things like depression, your diet, and just your perceptions. I just can't understand how you could claim its physically addictive when the very notion of addiction is so subjective.
 
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Worse for me..

Well for me, weed withdrawls are worse than heroin. Well I cant say heroin in general since I've only done that twice, but I can say for opiates definitely. And Heroin is an opiate so go figure.

I used to do Roxys and Oxys almost everyday for about a year and when I stopped I only had minimal withdrawls (Cold flashes, shaking while trying to sleep, etc) so it was very easy to get off them for me because the withdrawls were minor and only lasted like a couple days at the most. For me the weed(marijuana) is far more addictive than heroin because I tried heroin and didnt really enjoy it. I feel asleep in my car then tried to drive home when I woke up and I fell asleep again, this time while driving and almost wrecked my car. Thank god that GOD woke me up before I crashed. I found my self swerving over 4 lanes of traffic when I woke up.

Well anyway I smoked weed chronically for about 15 years. Even when I had only smoked it for a couple years and didnt have any, I would suffer a horrible night or two after until I got some because I had horrible headaches, nausea, vomiting, insomina, irritibility, etc. Well now the withdrawls are even worse. Now I get severe diarrhea as well when I dont have any. That lasts about 3 days then gets better.. But still it's not fun at all. Im talkin spending about 5 hours in the bathroom per day. Also one night I almost died without the weed. I got so sick I started puking all night long (As well as diarrhea) and I was just so dehydrated I almost didnt make it. I did keep drinking water constantly as much as I could just to try and stay alive but I was throwing up so much I was choking on my puke and I couldnt get enough air in. I never did go to the hospital because by the miracle of god I got some weed at like 4 am (and this was in a COMPLETELY DRY CITY!! The DEA did a HUGE bust down in florida back in Oct of 02 so the ONLY weed in our city was homegrown. No Joke. I knew many dealers there, NOBODY had anything buy home grown (Which unfortuinately for some reason (maybe because not organic)home grown never helped my withdrawls...I needed outdoor weed. So I was like screwed, near death choking and seeing colors because I was about to pass out. Well I did get some weed that had been smuggled inside a gas tank. It was so nasty looking but at least it wasnt home grown. That weed saved my life. I got it just in time and it stopped my vomiting. I remember throwing up 3 small garbage cans full of water/puke that night because I must of drank like 3 gallons of water in my attempt to stay hydrated and alive. Obviously I was losing fluids too quickly I had diarrhea as well. That was the absolute WORST night of my entire life...and I've had a lot of "insanely horrible" nights in my life but that took the cake. I was so miserable and suffering so much cuz I could not breath and get air in.

On top of that I was the sickest I had ever been in my life. I credit all this to marijuana withdrawl because I had smoked every single day for 3 years(and my symptoms were way worse than food poisoning) straight before that night when I couldnt get any. So, always make sure to take a break at least one day per year! If you dont then you might end up like me. If that was indeed withdrawls (which Im 99% sure it was as they matched my previous marijuana withdraw symptoms, but they were just much more severe) then that means you can DIE from marijuana withdrawl. Not likely for most people since they dont smoke it nearly enough. However if you smoked as much and as long as I had without a break and then you just try to quit cold turkey you could possibly end up with what I had, and if not treated, you would die from dehydration.

Just a warning, because Opiate withdrawls were never nearly that bad for me. I get cold and hot flashes from both weed and opiate withdrawl but at least I dont get severely sick from the opiate withdrawl. Now...Im sure you COULD if you did enough, like so much everyday and then tried to quit cold turkey. Im sure if weed can do it, heroin can too. Just a point that both drugs are addictive though. But yeah smoking weed is the best cure for nausea on this planet so it makes sense that if you get used to it, you could get very sick without it.
 
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