Questions Regarding Therapeutic Amphetamine Usage

[synapsegeek]

I figured I would post this in a new thread since it is different that the other one regarding ROA. I am taking adderall and dexedrine for ADD and am having pretty wildly inconsistent results; some days it works beautifully and some days I feel cracked out, easily overwhelmed, and unable to really concentrate all that well on anything. I am prescribed 20mg of adderall and 10mg of dexedrine. I don't like the PNS effects of the adderall so I will typically take 1/2 of each to get more of the CNS stimulation. This, however, depends on how tired I am, if I didn't get a lot of sleep the night before, I will take the whole adderall because the PNS stimulation keeps me awake. I was prescribed the dexedrine because the adderall was causing insomnia; I frequently couldn't fall asleep until 4 or 5am, which is incredibly inconvenient when you have to be at work at 7am. I know about the ph levels making a difference and I try to take tums with amphs as I have always had problems with heartburn/stomach acid since I was a kid, but I still have the inconsistencies. If I take it on an empty stomach it seems to work better, but if I eat at all in between doses, it seems to cause the next dose to be somewhat ineffective. The amph has helped tremendously when it works. It has allowed me to overcome several adverse personality traits that have strained relationships with family members and inhibited my school and work performance, changes I was unable to make alone in 28 years. However, at times, the medication almost puts me in a fog of confusion. When I was younger, I freely experimented with recreational use of psychedelics, weed, opioids, and adderall a few times and never had any problems with addiction. A friend seems to think that this could have a lingering effect on how I react to the stims. I really doubt it since the recreational drug use was about a decade ago; however, the brain is a tricky thing so I am not completely ruling it out of the realm of possibility. At any rate, I have been on adderall for almost a year now with the same side effects. I've considered going to methylphenidate but I've just always thought of that as something that was prescribed by doctors that weren't comfortable prescribing amphetamine, but now that I've written it down, it seems like kind of a silly thing to think. I've also considered Desoxyn but it's eleventy billion dollars give or take. That and I'm not sure my Dr would prescribe it. I'm also not sure I really want to try it. I sometimes tend to be liberal with my rx dosage depending on how I feel during the day as a result of the wild inconsistencies I experience. i.e. if I feel like it is not affecting like it should, I may up my dosage by 10mg or so. At any rate, I guess what I'm asking is,

-Does anyone have any experiences like this? What have you done to counter-act these inconsistencies?

-Any advice on perhaps changing up my rx?

-Am I causing more problems by varying my dosage day to day? Sometimes, I work 12 hour shifts, so some days I may take 60-80mg and some days I may take 20-30mg.
-Also, what SHOULD my dosing be of d-amph proportional to my 20mg dosing of adderall?

-Anything of what I said seem off?

-Any general advice?

Thanks everyone for helping this n00b.

 

[MarshmallowKitten]

Have you discussed any of this with your Dr? I am not in the same situation as you. I take Ritalin atm for MS related fatigue. Its a new drug for me (about a week now) and I notice I get the boost I need but will have trouble sleeping if I take it too late in the day. Ambien helps me get to sleep or if I am feeling edgy or whatever from the Ritalin, I will go with a 1mg Xanax to get myself back to calm and my body to relax. It seems a lot of stuff given at times can feel in direct conflict with each other or with other symptoms you are working on fixing. I have found it to be true that unfortunately medication can be a lot about experimentation before you find that perfect mix to really help you. From what I have read on BL, Adderall seems to be a bit more potent in ways than Ritalin. I am wondering if maybe just changing out the Adderall part for Ritalin instead might help alleviate some of the side effects. If you do not have one, you should see a meds specialist. I recently did this for the first time a month or so ago and I feel so much more, confident, I guess you would say in what I am taking now. Altho I still have questions at times of course. The guy I see, that's ALL he does is meds and so far its been the best way to figure out how to work on symptoms without making me more miserable by throwing random chemicals at me. So I guess my best advice is to talk to a doctor. You never want to run off and change med regimines on your own unless you happen to magically BE a doctor. And then well, that would just be awesome

 

[casualuser]

I have been on methylphenidate for about a year now for my ADHD and it works great for me though in my experience most people prefer adderall/dexidrine. I never had any problems with inconsistent affects and I occasionally adjusted my daily dose as well i.e. on days I slept in I would take less, on long work days I would take a little more. I'm a bit confused about your dosing though. Are you prescribed only 20mg adderall and 10mg dexedrine a day or are you prescribed that much 2-3 times a day? Also are you prescribed the instant release formulas or extended release? Your inconsistencies could be from taking your doses to close together(feeling cracked out) or too far apart(feeling foggy). If you take multiple doses per day, how long do you usually wait between doses? If you're taking the extended release versions, the extended release mechanism can cause inconsistent results. Consuming a lot of caffeine can exacerbate the negative side effects, which is something to watch out for. I've never had any problems from varying my daily dose but taking higher doses even infrequently can increase your tolerance faster. Adderall is about 75% d-amph so dosing should be pretty equivalent to dexedrine mg for mg. As for your past drug use, it could have an effect as using any drug can change your brain chemistry but any noticeable changes usually only result from excessive use. You said your previous experimentation never resulted in addiction but did you still use frequently or for a long period of time? The bottom line is your Dr can do a much better job at figuring this out than anyone on here can so my best advise would be go see him/her as soon as you can.

 

[rodneyrdr]

These drug companies are some of most greedy ones I've ever seen in my life. Adderall is one of the cheapest drugs to make that has ever been on the market. And I mean dirt cheap. Ritalin,same deal. Oxycontin and Methadone are more examples of drugs that are cheap to make. Our health care system is plagued by this kind of stuff and its really pitiful that they get away with it.

 

[Crashing]

-Does anyone have any experiences like this? What have you done to counter-act these inconsistencies?

Yes, take smaller more consistent doses.

-Any advice on perhaps changing up my rx?

Maybe if you're lucky your doctor will allow you to try vyvanse (lisdexamphetamine), which breaks down into d-amp when metabolized but feels much smoother than dexedrine or adderall for many people.

-Am I causing more problems by varying my dosage day to day? Sometimes, I work 12 hour shifts, so some days I may take 60-80mg and some days I may take 20-30mg.

Yes, varying your dosage is definitely causing many of your problems, although i would expect some sort of consistency to go along with this. Sleep and diet play major roles as well.

-Also, what SHOULD my dosing be of d-amph proportional to my 20mg dosing of adderall?

I'm not even sure why you're on d-amp and adderall at the same time. IMO, the ratio doesn't really matter. All it is doing is lowering the ratio of levoamphetamine that you are consuming, but i can't imagine there is a huge difference between 30mg adderall, and 20mg adderall + 10mg dexedrine. The difference for me would be negligible. I'd rather take pure dexedrine or vyvanse.

Additional advice is that when you are feeling like you haven't slept enough, i would dose lower instead of higher, because in that situation i feel that the drug would be affecting you even moreso, not less. Sleep deprivation and amphetamines really don't mix.

 

[rodneyrdr]

One other thing u mentioned about Doctors was not mentioning brand names. That really hits a nerve with em because they do tend to think you're out dr shopping! When people say to just be honest with the doctor and tell them everything. Well we know we can't always be honest because things that mean little to us, just freak out some doctors, like you telling her u had tried ritalin a few times, but you had no Rx,so again, we can't tell them everything. Wish we could. RDR

 

[synapsegeek]

Sorry, I know this is a super late reply... So basically, I take 10mg of amph salts and 10mg of d-amph, twice a day. I made the switch to using part d-amph for the very reason someone mentioned earlier, lowering my l-amph ratio as I was experiencing some increased blood pressure and tachycardia. I have noticed that getting enough sleep and remembering to eat plays a big part in reducing the severity of come down. I'm still having inconsistent results, but they're not as bad as they once were.

Since this post, I've tried methyphenidate as well as dex-methylphenidate, both with a rx, both without success. Neither really helped my ADD and both made me feel terrible and the come down felt like I'd been visited by those flying monsters in Harry Potter that steal away all your happiness, haha. I don't want to ever touch the stuff again as long as I live.

Does anyone have any experience with Desoxyn? I've been considering trying that because of the tachycardia adderall produces. I've read a few books on the subject (The Amphetamine Debate -- really good btw, Speed > Ecstasy > Ritalin, Scattered, etc) and studies seem to indicate that methamphetamine does not increase BP or heart rate as much as racemic amphetamine. The only thing that concerns me is that it primarily affects the nucleus accumbens, which carries a greater risk of physical dependence and addiction. While I don't think I have a particularly addictive personality, I acknowledge that most addicts probably didn't think that either when they decided to start altering their brain chemistry.

On another note, does anyone have an opinion on changing up my second dose? If the half life is 4 hours or so, then when the time comes for my second dose I'd still have 10mg in my system. Shouldn't I just take 10mg for a second dose perhaps followed my another 10mg about 2 hours later or so? You'll have to forgive me because I'm not too familiar with this particular aspect. I'm under the understanding that as long as it is in your system, it is providing benefit, is that correct? Anyway, just a thought.