Opioids Question about Methadone WD

[Princess_Poppy]

i don't know how much i have to add, but great job. i kicked 70 mg daily methadone and pretty much switched straight to suboxone. i used short acting stuff the 5 days in between. i was on methadone 3 yrs. it ain't 10 years, buts its a while. at this point i don't think you should use suboxone. you are almost out of the woods! i am almost off suboxone now and feel so normal and clearheaded. if you find yourself thinking of getting back on methadone, give the suboxone a shot though. if you can make it as long as you did off methadone, you could kick suboxone no prob. don't be scared of what the doctor said though! i think you will be okay w/ the comfort meds as far as you have gotten. i can't imagine kicking at 40mg cold turkey!!!! just takes time :/

 

[zippermike]

Well I just had an interesting couple of days. On the night of the 27th, not too long after I made my last post, I started getting that massive heart racing thing again and getting some wicked pain in my chest area. My brother ran me to the ER, and they did an EKG and stuff and my readings were way different from my baselines. So much so that they shipped me by ambulance to a bigger hospital 3 hours away where they have a very good cardiologist. Over the past couple days they've been running tests after tests on my heart. I found out that I actually have a heart condition that was previously unknown. They ran every heart related test imaginable. Let me tell you, trying to run on a freaking treadmill for a stress test when you are a fatty and going through WDs....one of the worst experiences of my life. I actually surprised myself by making it to the 9 minute mark lol.

Anyway they found that I have a thickened heart wall(they believe it is from having hypertension for such a long time), and that combined with the WDs is why I keep having these episodes. They both agreed that going back on any form of opiate would be a very bad idea and that I was probably lucky I got off when I did. They kept me there until today for monitoring. The good news is that I think I may be finally getting over some of the WD's. I feel a little bit better anyway. Every muscle in my body aches but I think that has more to do with the pain of actual excercise without the aid of opiates to dull it. I am also still having a ridiculously hard time sleeping. Everynight in the hospital sucked cuz I was like the only one awake. I spent a good chunk of those nights wandering the halls and sitting in waiting rooms reading and watching tv, since I did not want to wake the guy in the bed next to me. I thought about asking if I could get a larger dose of my Ambien to knock me out but I am trying to avoid any excessive drug use. How long would you say it takes for sleep to start coming naturally again? That is the worst part for me other than the heart issues. Anyway, I know I still have a hard time ahead of me with the rest of it but honestly I think I might just make it. Hopefully anyway.

 

[Znegative]

It takes a while. I was on a 100mg of methadone for just a year, and it took about 3 months for my sleep to really go back to normally. The first month was absolutely horrendous (I was not given any comfort or detoxes meds though, it should be noted). I would fall as,eel for at most, five minutes at a time, and then jerk awake, and toss around like a dying fish for the rest of the night. The worst part was that I'd feel genuinely exhausted, as tired as I'd ever been, but still unable to sleep.

If sleep is becoming a major issue, Taking extra zolpidem isn't the worst thing you can do. The only problem with using the Z-drugs for insomnia is that they are really only usefull for occaisional episodes of restlessness. After about three nights, as you know, you develop a tolerance to them and they are pretty much useless, other than the fact that not taking them will make it even harder to sleep. This is why I recomend gabapentin. It definately has sedative/anxiolytic properties, and is no where near as habit forming. Plus, as long as you keep your dosage low (between 300 and 600 mg), your tolerance wont spike too fast.

 

[BiggDirty01]

Sleep to me is an issue of both the duration and amount of opiates as it became harder and harder to sleep somewhat normally each year I'd try and quit opiates. Last year when I finally did in-patient past detox I ended up with moderate sleep issues even at 6 months clean from a 6 year habit.

Supplements. sleep hygiene and potentially Rx-sleep meds are my tools against insomnia.

 

[zippermike]

20 days clean now. It literally seems like the days are beginning to bleed into the nights. I really hate myself for ever getting hooked on that shit to begin with. The insomnia is by far the worst thing I have ever experienced. I think one of my biggest problems is that, being disabled(I am legally blind, not 100% but still very crappy eyesight) I was never on a schedule really so I ran off a 26 hour schedule for close to 4 years or so. What I mean is that everyday I would go to sleep 2 hours later than the day before. so I'd always be waking up 2 hours later. I have no fucking clue how or why i ever started doing that but after awhile it just became the norm. Now I am trying to sleep on a regular schedule and it just isn't happening. I mean, I know the WD's from Methadone are a big part of my inability to sleep, but I am wondering if that isn't playing a factor as well. My sister recommended trying some melatonin to help with sleep but I have read things about how it can cause problems. I also read that there are certin types of teas you can buy at the store that are supposed to have a relaxing effect and promote sleep. However, I would have no idea what to look for. Right now I only sleep maybe 1-3 hours a night and on some nights I simply cannot sleep. I got lucky today. I was just sitting at my computer and I must've just crashed for some reason. I woke up and almost 5 hours had passed and I hurt like a bitch from sleeping hunched over with my head on the desk. However, it felt GREAT to get that much sleep unaided.

 

[Hobble]

I believe Chamomille Tea is the tea you are refering to that promotes sleep. Valerian Root is a supplement, not a tea, but it's also supposed to be good for sleep.

 

[zippermike]

I went to Walmart this evening and bought a bottle of 3mg Melatonin tablets, some of this tea crap that I don't really know. The brand is called Yogi, and the tea is called simply Bedtime or something. It apprently has some of the Valrian Root stuff in it. So about 3 hours ago, I took one of them Melatonin tabs and drank some of that tea. it made me ridiculously tired and I passed out for about an hour or so. Then I woke up feeling ridiculously tired but was unable to go back to sleep. The effects are slowly wearing off but still no sleep. The only thing that seems to be able to put me to sleep for any given amount of time is my Ambien, and that seems to be losing its effectivness. I went from getting 4 hours of sleep using them, to maybe 2. I am really geting disgusted already, and knowing I still have a long ways to go is sickening. I've never really felt depressed before in my life, and I've been through some wicked shit. However, this endless insomnia, and having my heart just take off on its own at random times(even knowing there are no major issues with it still doesn't help), almost feels like I'm being torn apart both physically and emotionally. I WANT TO SLEEP!!!!

 

[dasfilth]

In my personal experience, low doses of MScontin can really help.
To get off my 60 mg a day habit I used two 15mg ABG brand MScontin twice a day: Once in the morning and once about 8 hours later.

It was just enough to kill the withdrawals but not enough to get me high. After I felt comfortable without the Methadone,I cut each dose in half, and then took myself down to one 15mg dose a day shortly after that.

I still had very mild withdrawals throughout the process, the worst of which being insomnia, but I've also suffered from non drug related insomnia for most of my life. I resorted to taking my final dose of the day right before bed along with 1mg of alprazolam when the insomnia got really bad. But overall, not a completely wretched experience compared to just going cold turkey.

Good luck zipper, congrats on your 20+ days. Stay with it, it gets easier eventually.

 

[zippermike]

I just realized I have been making an error in my days clean timing. My first clean day was the 18th of last month. That puts me only at day 19 now I believe. Still kickin, but thinking I was like 5 days farther than I am really brought my mood down. I know 5 days this late in the game isn't really much but still, it was enough to bum me. Honestly, I blame the lack of sleep. Although on a positive note, I tried not taking my Ambien for a day, and then taking 10mg instead of the prescribed 5(I know this is probably not the smartest thing, and that it constitutes as abuse in itself), and I have been able to get 6-7 hours of sleep on those nights. Maybe it is just a mental thing but I feel much more refreshed like that. The night I didn't take the Ambien I tried the Melatonin/tea thing, and still managed an hour or 2 of sleep which wasn't too bad. I go to see my doctor again tomorrow, well today cuz its after midnight. He is going to go over the results of some of the longer cardio test they did that didn't have the results back before I was discharged. I'll say it again, this forum is a godsend, just having somewhere to talk is so theraputic.

 

[gr33n3y3z]

For ur question about your D.T., out of many drug tests Methadone is rarely tested for.

 

[zippermike]

On day 22(I think) atm. Still getting chest pain in the evenings. My blood pressure has been all over the map. When I take my clonidine it goes down no problem. I have a problem though. My regular doctor is out of town so I had to go see a different one for a refill on my Clonidine since my doctor only wrote me one for short term. The new doctor said he can't refill it because my doctor only wanted me on it shor term. The thing is, when I was at the clinic, my blood pressure was like 101/72 or something. That was because I had just taken the clonidine an hour or so earlier. The problem is that my blood pressure has been getting really high in the evenings. So high that it is causing headaches. 180/110 something like that. They haven't checked my heart since the 31st(well the same doctor listened to it when I was at the clinic 3 days ago, I also told him about the chest pain, he said its probably just anxiety, which I don't believe) and I don't know what to do. I cut my clonidine down to 1 a day instead of 2 to try and make them last longer(which is probably why my BP is going so high in the evenings), but I will run out in 2 days and I am 100% certain my blood pressure is going to skyrocket then and it is going to be back in the damn ER. I am so fucked right now. I wish there was some kind of timeline that I could have to know how much longer this shit is gonna last. I haven't had methadone since the 18th(well actually the 17th, the 18th was my first clean day) of last month, so the vast majority has got to be out of my fucking system by now no?

I even considered asking to be put into some kind of fucking hospitalized detox thing, they do that right? They'd probably fucking laugh at me when I tell them I've been clean already for 3 weeks and want to detox but I just don't want a heart attack. It is the one thing that scares me about this whole withdrawal shit. I am close to 300 pounds(I actually have lost 36 pounds already since this started), so my heart is already under enough fuckin stress and this is only adding to it. The thing is, I know stress is not good, and can actually make shit like this worse. However, how can I not be stressed? I feel like I am on the worst roller coaster ride of my life right now. I keep hearing how the physical symptoms are supposed to go away eventually, but when? I'll take the PAWS anyday over this shit.

 

[zippermike]

It's been a long ride, and it still isn't over, but it is worth every ounce of will it has taken so far. I look back at my last post and am shocked the difference a couple weeks can make. It's been 37(I think, I stopped counting, just going by the date I stopped and trying to do the math) days now. The physical symptoms are getting much better. I found out my tachycardia is due to my GERD and my hiatal hernia, and not my previous methdone use. My blood pressure has finally stabalized, although it still runs a bit high. I've been off the Clonidine and Xanax for awhile now and I am doing alright. I will say this, Xanax can help wonders for methadone withdrawal, but beware when you stop it. I felt a whole new addiction rolling in so I called my doctor and he said definately stop them. When I did I felt increased symptons for about 3-4 days afterwards(especially anxiety), so beware of that if anyone is considering Xanax to help with withdrawals. Also, Clonidine does help with the symptoms, but beware the rebound hypertension.

Depression is still there, as is the insomnia, but it is getting better. My doctor put me temporarily on Trazadone for both insomnia and the depression. I am also still taking the Ambien. Those two combined are helping alot with the insomnia, but I still only sleep 4 good hours a night. I know alot of people live off this much but for me it is draining. I am used to sleeping 7 solid hours a night lol. At least I can finally keep the same clothes on all day long without sweating through them in a matter of minutes or hours lol. It really cuts down on the laundry. Also, the RLS is still there but it is very mild and is not affecting my sleeping anymore. That whole "revved up" feeling is also still there, but it is manageable when you know it isn't going to give you a heart attack. I have a feeling that is going to take awhile to go away as everything was just so slowed down when on methadone.

I just cannot believe I am off that god awful drug. It truly is the worst drug in the world. If I could give anyone a SINGLE piece of advice in the world, it is this. If you are on methdone, do EVERYTHING in your power to stop. If you are considering going on it, DON"T. It's as simple as that. I'm not even talking about the withdrawals either. Everyday that goes by and I can FEEL things again is a blessing. Even when those things aren't good feelings, at least it is feeling something. I went to a choir concert of my nieces the other night and I swear to you I got high off it. I watch a good movie or tv show and I feel damn good. Hell, even eating a slice of freaking pizza felt amazing. It's like every sensation is multiplied to the point where it feels brand new. I can't even begin to describe the feeling but it feels downright AMAZING. I intend to get back to my walking within the next few days. I've been doing little walks around the block so my muscles don't fall apart, but nothing really like I used to.

I cannot begin to thank those who have contributed to this thread. This forum in general has been one of the most eye opening and helpful experiences. Just having a place to talk or vent my frustrations, as well as compare my experiences, has been THE reason I am where I am right now. I may not be posting all the time, but I have been reading others experiences and it is more than helpful. Honestly, and this is going to sound sickening, but just having the reassurance that I am not alone in this, and that others have been through this and succeeded, has been most helpful of all. I will continue to update this thread. Thanks you so much for all the support!

 

[tokenname]

^^super cool post ^^

glad you're handling it..
you've been thru something.
you're stronger now.
be proud!