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Psychotic Breakthrough

hawaii

hawaii

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 10, 2012
Messages
88
Since a year I'm frequenting a psychiatrist.
Initially because I had a depression period.
I wasn't able to have positive thoughts and do quite anything in real life.
Now everything changed. I'm feeling well and my work is going greater than I have ever expected, so I'm in a very positive period.
With my psychiatrist we started talking about Ketamine (which I never done) and my past drugs experiences.
He sometimes says I'm right to do what I need to do to feel good and I personally tried to explain why I'm interested in the Ketamine experience (I became aware of this substance years ago but only after having read books by John Lilly, Karl Jansen and docs by Stanislav Grof I have a brighter idea about this drug).
I'm about to try it in a week or so and today we talked about this.
He tried to explain me that in life what makes us evolve is the everyday "struggle" (he quoted "Faust" by Goethe) rather than a single experience (possibly the K-hole..).
We also talked about schizofrenia and he said that psychotic people experience a kind of breakthrough (which has not be my case, but who knows by now) and then they remain psychotic for their life and that the K-Hole can be something like that.

Honestly I don't think I'll go for the K-Hole the very first time but I think I'll try to reach it as my life goes on...so...

Now I feel a bit worried.
In the end he said that we'll integrate my experiences within my life with no problem and that I'm a healthy person but somehow he warned me about this.

What do you guys think?
 
Quite a psychiatrist you've got yourself there. Very... progressive?
 
I come from a small city in Italy...that's why!
Haha I appreciate your joke but I'm serious here :)
What do you personally think?
 
dissociatives can fuck with you sense of reality, yes. i don't think the "breakthrough" your doctor mentioned about schizos is a good thing. sure, for the schizo they are just aware of what's really going on. but are they really just paranoid and delusional?
yes. they can also put you mentally and/or emotionally back at a certain time in your life when you take them, so i don't see why you'd want to fuck with a drug that can be harmful when you're at a good place.
 
i'm at a good place in real life but i'm spiritually "void" and i feel i need to enlighten some aspects of my life.
 
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thanks for your reply.
in fact, i read Ketamine is a quite safe drug.
still, this morning i woke up a bit preoccupied about what we talked about yesterday...not a good thing.

more opinions are welcome! :)
 
^ Could bring back the depression.. I've seen it do a lot worse.

You are feeling ok now.. why risk losing that?
 
try a vipassana meditation course instead! I've been in my fair share of k holes, and while they can be extremely powerful its very difficult to bring back into your life in any balanced way. And its very easy to want to keep going back which can lead to some dark places. Look up this meditation technique you can go learn it for free! (donation based) it brought me further than any k hole!
 
hawaii said:
i'm at a good place in real life but i'm spiritually "void" and i feel i need to enlighten some aspects of my life.
Click to expand...

Was your depressive period reactive to something? Were you a drug user before you experienced depression?

I understand that you feel spiritually void and you want to take drugs or a drug to enable you access to spiritual experience. This is how I feel also. I experienced many years depression and it drained me spiritually and I'm now looking for a 'gateway', as it were, back into the spiritual realms - something for me to believe in, some experience to make me sit bolt upright and say, "wow, yes, there *is* more and I've just been there and felt and seen it."

But I think you're jumping headlong into this. Spiritual journeys never end. You have your whole life ahead of you to develop spiritually (and maybe beyond). Please, if there's only one piece of advice I can offer you, it's to take a deep breath and say, "slowly...very slowly" and smile. Don't go rushing around and jumping down holes...that's tigger behaviour, and tigger is the sort of personality that can rush and climb up the tree, then finds out he can't climb back down. What you need to do is think 'pooh'. Simplistic, uncluttered, in tune with nature, and relaxed.

Good luck with your journey and may it be a happy and healthy one. :)
 
My depressive period was reactive to the fact I somehow "discovered" death and also my true condition.
I mean, I lost my both grand fathers when I was a kid but never reflected too much about that.
But two years ago, aged 20 circa, I had these very hard months.
I felt burning inside and thought about how miserable the human condition is.
I had this period after a vacation in Spain with my mates where I tried MDMA for the first time, did 0,5 gram over a night.
Initially I was thinking again and again about that night, thinking I was "awakened" my mind to a different state. I somehow felt an old way of thinking was going away and a more adult one was coming. During the depressing period I faced all my fails and found I needed to rethink many relationships in life and started thinking life is full of pain too, when you lose your beloved ones etc.
I was struggling. I don't think it was the MDMA usage...maybe yes but I see that period changed me. Thru pain I'm now different. So even if it was the MDMA obsession in my head I don't mind it. Looking it now, that period was necessary.

Now it's different. Two years has passed, I feel like I'm adult now (I'm 23 years old) and in my work everything is going great.
My life is dedicated to electronic music. I study that, I release more records now, I took "control" over my life more and I have an agent now, so I'm starting travelling Italy and Europe to play (and earn a living hopefully, why not!).

What I feel tho it's I still need to reach a kind of enlightnment...which, in my depressive period I thought suicide and death might be.
I don't want to think about suicide anymore tho...sometimes I still do. But I want to find a different transformative experience without thinking about my physical death (which is...definitive and can cause sorrow to my parents, friends etc)

Then came a brief psychedelic period. Started during winter 2011 more or less.
LSA and LSD mainly.
The LSA experience was a strange (initially) and then beautiful one. I had it in London, with my friends during a weekend vacation.
After a couple hours of panic and psychological pain I started relaxing and hallucinating with music.
I could feel I was contacting my true self again somehow and during the end of the trip I saw a very bright hand tense towards me, helping me.
Just an hand, I took that and everyhting then became relaxed.
The day after I was thinking I went close to what people say it's God.
I think it was just an energy and I visualized it that way.
The positivie thing is that the day after I felt NORMAL again, not crazy at all. Absolutely normal, calm and happy. I'm a very shy person but the day after I was different. I was open to people and I was fucking happy I was alive, with my friends, in London...
I came back to Italy, locked in my studio, and recorded the piece which now gives the name to my upcoming album.
All critics and friends feel that as on my best pieces ever and I feel that too.
I enjoyed a lot doing it, I was somehow "resetted" and I found a direction musically/ethically.

Now, talking about Ketamine.
I don't think LSA and Ketamine can be compared but what I look for is that kind of experience but more brief.
I can't take LSA or other long lasting psychedelics, because of many reasons...my mum calls, friends call me whatever and they distract me from that.
I would do it for both the aspects...spiritual and creative.
Feeling "new" and fresh is great for the creative process. And now everything is "colliding" in a positive way I want to be as creactive as possible...to feel good and fulfilled.

Other drug usage, is daily marijuana smoking, since 8 years and I want quit that. Not because I'm not enjoying it (a part a couple of bad nights) but because I find it pointless.

I hope my post is not confused but I worked all day and now I'm a bit tired.

Hope we can talk about this and that you guys share your experiences.
 
hawaii said:
thanks for your reply.
in fact, i read Ketamine is a quite safe drug.
still, this morning i woke up a bit preoccupied about what we talked about yesterday...not a good thing.

more opinions are welcome! :)
Click to expand...

I think it's relatively safe in controlled conditions. It becomes a problem, like with most drugs, when it is used chronically to cope with whatever is distressing you in your life. They did a two part series on NPR a few months ago I remember hearing details about Ketamine actually being developed in a clinical setting to help treat major depression. Here is a story you could maybe listen to: http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2012/10/04/162299564/ketamine-relieves-depression-by-restoring-brain-connections

So, take what you will from that. I also disagree with the notion that a K-Hole could cause a permanent psychotic break in the same way someone becomes schizophrenic. I feel I've read a lot of experiences involving dissociatives in general and very rarely would I find something about someone going totally "batshit crazy" from frequent use. Sure, maybe a little psychotic? But I don't think anything like what would be described as a break. I could be wrong though.

I know how you feel though, about seeking some spirituality and filling a void. I think most people on the planet experience something like this many times in their lives. Totally normal. How you choose to fill that void is up to you. There are definitely healthy and unhealthy ways to go about this. The meditation idea was a good one, I personally have not had as much success with it as I'd like, but that may be because it takes a lot of practice. I'm kind of lazy. ;)

Drugs are another option, of course, but probably not the best. I take some prescription NDRI medication that seems to work okay and I also partake in occasional (use to be quite frequent but I've cut back) use of ketamine, methoxetamine, and DXM. Dissociatives helped me escape reality. But I believe the real key is what you'll probably hear from a lot of people: that you need to form healthy, long term habits such as proper diet and exercise, hobbies to keep your mind engaged, perhaps some college courses?

I'm sorry if my advice wasn't too great, probably because I'm still struggling with the same issues. Just know that things always get better. Whenever I'm feeling down, I remind myself that this is temporary, and it will pass. That these moods come and go and I have been very happy in the past and will be happy again. Kind of the same way I would talk myself down from a bad trip, that it's just the effect of the drug and it will pass.

Good luck! :D
 
I learned a lot from ketamine, but I am not one who is prone to psychotic breaks. I would be careful.

It's cool that your psychiatrist is supportive but it doesn't seem like he really balanced out his support with cautionary information.
 
Well, he never said I'm prone to a psychotic break down, but we talked about that and he somehow warned me about that.
He explained me all psychotic people experience a psychotic break down as the beginning of their illness and he related that (possibly) to the K-Hole.
I obviously thought about that and I'm aware of that now, which is a thing concerning me a bit.
 
can anyone explain exactly what this "psychotic breakthrough" is like?

For the past few months, I've had interest in increasing my dosage of psychedelics for a ++++, however a psychotic break is exactly what is keeping me from trying it out.
 
Some recent studies have shown ketamine can do wonders for depression. If your doctor thinks you should try it, then go ahead!
 
He didn't say that but he suggested me some antidepressants (which I didn't take) in the past.
 
I think he meant breakdown.. Where somebody can just snap and they're never quite the same..

Although yeah a K-hole is VERY unlikely to cause the snap.. and wouldn't in a healthy person.
 
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