Please help

[katy1954]

please help ,I am 20 yrs on benzos,and I am 58yrs old.
I am on 4mgs ativan and 5mgs valium.And in trouble.
I know about the benzo groups and ashton,but I think i am in tolerance withdrawl.
I recently stopped lyrica and gabapentin.
I want off benzos but fear I will not get there due to long term use.
I at least need to cross to a loger acting one.Ativan is causing hyperventilation and so many problems.
ashotn gives you a crossover that takes 7weeks or so ,I think i need it faster than that.
do I need to be hospitalized to do this/
or can I cross faster?
I am in a lot of trouble and my dr just doesnt even know.
a 3yr lyrica use kept my tolerance in check but now I am off those.and dont want back on.
any ideas? how to cross faster to avoid the interdose anxiety of ativan and dont want to increase the ativan.
Please please give me some ideas.
thank you
Katy

 

[JarBag]

I am sure other people can be more helpful than I, but just remember, no matter what you do, don't go cold turkey. The waves of anxiety going all over the place can lead to irrational decisions. This isn't necessarily directed at you, but a precautionary to all.
I would let your doctor know ASAP! They can help taper you down as fast as possible, if they don't see any purpose or your concern, I'd find a new doc. I'd say don't do the hospitalization unless you are in fear of extensive problems such as seizures.
Sorry I couldn't be of much help, I wish you the best.

It's hard to just switch benzos with no problems and even prevent withdrawal especially after 20 years. You can look at a post I made on one of my threads earlier about someone close in my family abruptly coming off K-pin.

 

[debaser]

I would let your doctor know ASAP! They can help taper you down as fast as possible, if they don't see any purpose or your concern, I'd find a new doc.

This, basically. Taper very slowly (it could take quite some time, but it's worth it). This is key. Do it under the close supervision of a new doctor who knows their shit is my other advice. Good luck!

 

[tentram]

yep, i'm another of the opinion of you talking to and working out a nice slow and easy taper with them - your doctor - they'll definitely work with you to help wean you off as comfortably as possible. you definitely need someone monitoring you closely after such a long period on them and now wanting to come off because of the possible problems which may arise.

best of luck and keep us updated on your progress

 

[Swimmingdancer]

You do already have another active thread about this, we don't really allow posting of multiple threads on the same topic. Were you thinking this thread is different as you are now trying to get off the benzos completely (if I understand correctly)?

Would it be ok if I merge your 2 threads together? The other one does provide some additional info about your situation.

As I said in your other thread, talk to your doctor about everything you are going through and if your doctor isn't helpful find a better one. You shouldn't have to suffer without professional help.

 

[pasha]

Well your dose of diazepam (Valium) isn't high, and your lorazepam (Ativan) dose is moderate. For 20 years of use, I'd say your dosages are pretty low.

The way I see it, you shouldn't stop the pregabalin (Lyrica) or gabapentin before the benzodiazepines. These drugs ease the withdrawal symptoms of benzodiazepines heavily, and also stop the seizures that lorazepam withdrawal is known for. Pregabalin and gabapentin have some withdrawal of their own but certainly not as severe as benzodiazepine withdrawal for most people.

If you have the option of going to an inpatient facility or a hospital for detoxification than do so because 20 years is a long time. If not work out a detailed taper regimen with your doctor with a switch to an equipotent dose of diazepam and taper from there. Once your done you would be doing yourself a huge favor to get back on the gabapentin or preferably pregabalin for a few weeks.

Be very firm about what your doctor plans for you and demand to know every detail.

 

[phatass]

if you don't want to go to a hospital to do your taper i would advise switching to an equivalent dose of diazepam (45mg diazepam total i think) and lowering your dose by 5 to 10 percent per week (depending on wd symptoms) you can probably taper a lot faster but in tis case i would recommend you do it under total medical supervision (detox/rehab type thing)....

 

[katy1954]

I am not sure about the threads,sorry.I meant my dr doesnt know how to withdraw and I live in Canada so its hard to get another dr.my psychiartist says I am a bad patient(I wont take nay more of his drugs,antipsychotics etc)(he got me on ativan) and doesnt want to refer me it takes months,in Cnada you cant just fire a dr find another.the thing for benzos here is a 10 day detox ,there are no benzo wise drs here ,hospital will take you if youre suicadal.Lyrica made me so sick ,bloated and couldnt think right.But i am really sick now ,I am alone and scared.Lost 30lbs in one month,trouble even writing this.I dont know what ot do

 

[pally pete]

I am not sure about the threads,sorry.I meant my dr doesnt know how to withdraw and I live in Canada so its hard to get another dr.my psychiartist says I am a bad patient(I wont take nay more of his drugs,antipsychotics etc)(he got me on ativan) and doesnt want to refer me it takes months,in Cnada you cant just fire a dr find another.the thing for benzos here is a 10 day detox ,there are no benzo wise drs here ,hospital will take you if youre suicadal.Lyrica made me so sick ,bloated and couldnt think right.But i am really sick now ,I am alone and scared.Lost 30lbs in one month,trouble even writing this.I dont know what ot do

I feel your desperation.

Can you not go to a hospital and explain your situation? If a general hospital will not suffice could you possibly go to a specialist hospital/treatment centre as you do need help by the sounds of things.

 

[RobotRipping]

I live in Canada as well and yeah you're right it's really difficult to find another Dr, especially one who understands benzo dependency. In my case, i did find one who was understanding but he put me through the most painful taper imaginable. Well he wanted it to go on for 6 months but i cut it short against his advice, the problem was that i was started on 20mg of diazepam to taper from a 10mg phenazepam or clonazepam/day with additional ativan habit. So it hurt like absolute hell at first and i guess he just couldn't prescribe me 100mg of diazepam to start me out but i guess that's not really his fault.

Luckily your doses are low but you are older than i am and because of that you have to be more cautious in your taper. Why do you want to be off ativan/diazepam? At that age most Drs will just keep you on them for life, after 20 years, i couldn't imagine the withdrawal and PAWS that would happen, even when not abused. You say you are experiencing inter dose withdrawal but i think it's the lyrica and gabapentin withdrawal that's doing it. If ativan makes you hyperventilate then get your doc to switch you completely to diazepam and take enough to make yourself comfortable and stabilize on that so that you can get out of the gabapentin/lyrica withdrawals. After that you can decide your course of action but you really should not have to suffer through this.

If a Dr. can't/won't help (mine certainly doesn't) then you kind of have to just do it on your own in which case you'll have to be very cautious in your taper. I'd make it at least a 6 month taper, there's no quick way out of this and IMO i'm not sure it would be beneficial to taper your benzodiazepines at all, unless you just don't like them anymore. I think as another poster pointed out that the lyrica/gabapentin is definitely causing the inter dose withdrawal issue, it's not the benzos it's them, so after you are through that withdrawal, you should feel normal again.

i've had Drs tell me to go to detox for benzos but it is excruciating from what i hear and 10 days isn't enough to even detox you from a 20 year benzo habit.

 

[katy1954]

general hospital I dont knowI think you need to be suicidal to get into psyhe ward.I am having trouble communicating my situation ,there are no specialist hopsitals here except government and it takes months to get a referral.they wont take you until detoxed,but youre right i need some help.thank you

I wanted to lower benzos because I have severe sleep apnea.not completely off .I dont know how much more of this I can take.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

I'm going to get your 2 threads merged together because they are so similar and the other one has more info about your situation. You've been off pregabalin for quite a while now and you tapered off using gabapentin, stopping both completely over a month ago, correct?

I live in Canada so I know it's certainly not impossible to switch doctors here. If you want a new GP simply go to a new GP, if you want a new psychiatrist go to a GP and ask them to refer you to a good psychiatrist. There can sometimes be a long wait to see a good psych so I sympathize with that, but you are making it sound like you are not allowed to see any new doctors. I really think it would help. In the meantime, have you told your current one everything you've told us?

 

[RobotRipping]

what are your symptoms right now? are they similar to a benzo withdrawal as described by ashton? I'd just switch over to diazepam completely for now and see if that helps, it seems a lot of people have adverse reactions to ativan for whatever reason. Not sure on sleep apnea and benzos, i'd try and see another GP as well, i know to see an actual psych takes forever in Canada but a GP should be able to handle this.

 

[katy1954]

yes everything.told everything.My psychiatrist wont refer me ,and I asked my family dr.He wont either becasue I already have a psychicatrist.there is a shortage of gp's in alberta ,please i am telling them everyhting i know and yes off gabapentin and lyrica for 30 days.I was on 1-300 gabapentin since sept I didnt taper it and I never took more thna 300 a day.
I see my gp tomorrow.I am doing my best here.My psychiatrist said I was a difficult patient and he didnt want his collegues to have to deal with me,he also said things like"its your funeral" when I wouldnt take his drugs -antipsychotics and everything he gave me for 13 years.Maybe you dont believe me but its true.He considers me non compliant ,labelled me and I had a chance to see another psychicatrist in hospital who disagreed.said I was just dependent on benzos.Once a pschiatrist labels you thats it.for 13 years he gave me all kinds of drugs and nothing worked.I am trying my best to function .
I cant write anymore.
Katy

how do you just switch form ativan to diazapm in such a short time? thank you for your help.

 

[pasha]

^ Ask your doctor to switch you to an equivalent dose of diazepam. It has a much longer half-life and can be tapered easily.

Whatever you do, don't go to an in hospital psychiatric ward, they lock you in small rooms with no windows and only a camera for monitoring. They're simply inhumane. Find a detox facility in your area that's compassionate to your situation. Again, be firm about what you want.

Edit: Just google Alberta detox and call them right away, ask what their benzodiazepine taper plan is, and report back here and well tell you if its sufficient.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

yes everything.told everything.My psychiatrist wont refer me ,and I asked my family dr.He wont either becasue I already have a psychicatrist.there is a shortage of gp's in alberta ,please i am telling them everyhting i know and yes off gabapentin and lyrica for 30 days.I was on 1-300 gabapentin since sept I didnt taper it and I never took more thna 300 a day.
I see my gp tomorrow.I am doing my best here.My psychiatrist said I was a difficult patient and he didnt want his collegues to have to deal with me,he also said things like"its your funeral" when I wouldnt take his drugs -antipsychotics and everything he gave me for 13 years.Maybe you dont believe me but its true.He considers me non compliant ,labelled me and I had a chance to see another psychicatrist in hospital who disagreed.said I was just dependent on benzos.Once a pschiatrist labels you thats it.for 13 years he gave me all kinds of drugs and nothing worked.I am trying my best to function .

I really think you need to at least see a new GP. It does not sound like you are getting good care from your current GP or psych. Even if it's difficult to find a GP where you live surely you can find one. Go to this website and type in the name of your town/city to find a GP accepting new patients: College of Physicians and Surgeons Alberta Physician Search

I know it's hard to stay optimistic but you need to seek out better medical care.

how do you just switch form ativan to diazapm in such a short time?

What did your psych say when you said you think you are having a bad reaction to the Ativan? And aren't you already taking diazepam (Valium)? Could he not just increase your diazepam dose and decrease your Ativan dose?

 

[jaspersilence]

yes everything.told everything.My psychiatrist wont refer me ,and I asked my family dr.He wont either becasue I already have a psychicatrist.there is a shortage of gp's in alberta ,please i am telling them everyhting i know and yes off gabapentin and lyrica for 30 days.I was on 1-300 gabapentin since sept I didnt taper it and I never took more thna 300 a day.
I see my gp tomorrow.I am doing my best here.My psychiatrist said I was a difficult patient and he didnt want his collegues to have to deal with me,he also said things like"its your funeral" when I wouldnt take his drugs -antipsychotics and everything he gave me for 13 years.Maybe you dont believe me but its true.He considers me non compliant ,labelled me and I had a chance to see another psychicatrist in hospital who disagreed.said I was just dependent on benzos.Once a pschiatrist labels you thats it.for 13 years he gave me all kinds of drugs and nothing worked.I am trying my best to function .
I cant write anymore.
Katy

how do you just switch form ativan to diazapm in such a short time? thank you for your help.

First of all,I am praying for you...Second,you need to calm down.Take the meds your psych doctor wants you to take,I can tell you need something for a chemical imbalance,based on your med withdraw I assume.Do not,on your own,stop taking meds cold turkey.Get back on everything you were taking before,and make a plan while you are mentally stable,and comfortable.I'm sorry if I seem curt,but I don't want to write a book on how I feel bad for you.I hope you take my advice,and I see a more controlled post from you soon.PLEASE TAKE MY ADVICE.Again I'm sorry for being aggressive,but an aggressive plan is what you need.

 

[phatass]

here is a taper schedual which has several examples including someone who is taking 40mg valium (diazepam) which is approximately equivalent/equipotent to your dose of ativan and valium (you're at 45mg approx i think) the whole process takes a minimum of 26 weeks... it also has an example of someone on 6mg and 3mg lorazepam per day

http://www.benzo.org.uk/manual/bzsched.htm#s2

maybe you could print this out and take it to your doctor, to try to establish a taper plan