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Phenobarbital for anxiety?

Charles Ferdinand

Charles Ferdinand

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 29, 2009
Messages
327
Location
Rocky Point, México
Hi everyone!
So, my eleventh antidepressant (Venlafaxine) didn't do shit for my generalized anxiety even after 3 weeks. It actually made it worse.
I've tried all (literally) every benzo on the market, once having an 18mg/day of clonazepam habit, 3 years of daily use, 4 months of withdrawal hell and finally clean and sober.
My psychiatrist is offering me to try phenobarbital, the single readily available barb in my state (live in northern Mexico).
I've tried it before, I actually washed 100 mg with tequila and it obviusly put me the fuck out. I know it isn't recreational, I don't care, I need the anxiolytic effects.
It's obviusly a short term fix, we will try to extend as much as possible with lower doses and memantine to avoid tolerance as much as we can.
I'm currently on my seventh attempt at therapy (psychoanalisys (sp?) this time), and in my fifth month, but sometimes anxiety is so bad I can leave my house to attend therapy, nevermind talking to my therapist about the important personal stuff.
BTW, I've found phenobarb it not hypnotic at all.
I'd very much find your input helpful, and be very thankful <3
Regards!
 
Yeah, i've tried phenobarbital before. It's definitely not recreational. However, I wouldn't bother with psychoanalysis. it's a big waste of time. Try something like CBT.

Phenobarbital may do okay for your anxiety, it's hard to say, but if you're in the habit of mixing with other drugs, you should probably avoid it. Alcohol is not something an intelligent person would take with phenobarb, and opiates are even worse (for a period I mixed 5mg!!!! of phenobarbital with 4mg of suboxone. Even with a ridiculously tiny dose like that the effect was strongly potentiated!)
 
It should be added that if you thought clonazepam withdrawal was bad, phenobarbital will be worse. The only benefit is that it has got an extremely long duration.
 
I took 300 mg phenobarbital for getting nice high. One of the best for anxiety problems together with clonazepam (little sedation).
 
Phenobarbital has a very, very long half life (53-118 hours according to Wikipedia). Not only does this long half life making daily dosing tricky but it also means the potential for drug interactions even days after your last phenobarbital dose exist. Mixing alcohol with barbiturates is very dangerous, do not do it. The same word of caution applies for mixing other depressants with barbiturates.

CBT is a good option - I don't know if that's available to you or not. Benzodiazepines or other anti-anxiety drugs that aren't barbiturates are much safer choices for managing your anxiety.

Good luck.
 
Hi! thanks for response everyone! <3
NeighborhoodThreat said:
Phenobarbital has a very, very long half life (53-118 hours according to Wikipedia). Not only does this long half life making daily dosing tricky but it also means the potential for drug interactions even days after your last phenobarbital dose exist. Mixing alcohol with barbiturates is very dangerous, do not do it. The same word of caution applies for mixing other depressants with barbiturates.

CBT is a good option - I don't know if that's available to you or not. Benzodiazepines or other anti-anxiety drugs that aren't barbiturates are much safer choices for managing your anxiety.

Good luck.
Click to expand...

CBT is available, and have tried it, but seeing how everyone recommends it, I might just try it again with a different therapist.
I (and my psychiatrist) have come down to a low dose phenobarb (25 mg) and memantine, because there's nothing else. I've tried EVERY SINGLE benzo on the market, and had a 18mg tolerance to clonazepam, and didn't even feel anything at that dose. I've also tried tryciclics, MAOI's and eleven SSRI's (and SNRI's, and DNRI's). Buspar (didn't do shit), Lyrica (which was great but stopped working), Atarax (Vistaril) produced me an allergic reaction, the other antihistaminics just made me drowsy.

Thanks in advance for your inputs!
 
Well it seems you have tried just about everything. I do know someone who was prescribed phenobarbital for anxiety because their shrink said that most benzos had more abuse potential then phenobarbital which i guess is true but is still a poor reason to do so given how dangerous phenobarbital can be. I personally would not want to have to taper off of phenobarbital but then again i take 4-6mg's of clonazepam a day for my anxiety so it's not like i get off scot free either. I am very lucky that my tolerance to the anti-anxiety effects of clonazepam leveled off fairly quickly as ive been on the stuff about 6 years now and haven't had to increase the dose in 4 or 5 years and i have in fact for the most part decreased my dose as 4mg's a day does me fine unless I'm having a really bad day.

Have you tried atypical anti-psychotics such as quetiapine or olanzapine or hell even old typical anti-psychotics such as chlorpromazine, Methotrimeprazine aka levomepromazine (used a fair bit in Canada for anxiety and insomnia) or perphenazine. They may be worth trying if you haven't given them a go but I'm guessing you have atleast tried seroquel.
 
paranoid android said:
Well it seems you have tried just about everything. I do know someone who was prescribed phenobarbital for anxiety because their shrink said that most benzos had more abuse potential then phenobarbital which i guess is true but is still a poor reason to do so given how dangerous phenobarbital can be. I personally would not want to have to taper off of phenobarbital but then again i take 4-6mg's of clonazepam a day for my anxiety so it's not like i get off scot free either. I am very lucky that my tolerance to the anti-anxiety effects of clonazepam leveled off fairly quickly as ive been on the stuff about 6 years now and haven't had to increase the dose in 4 or 5 years and i have in fact for the most part decreased my dose as 4mg's a day does me fine unless I'm having a really bad day.

Have you tried atypical anti-psychotics such as quetiapine or olanzapine or hell even old typical anti-psychotics such as chlorpromazine, Methotrimeprazine aka levomepromazine (used a fair bit in Canada for anxiety and insomnia) or perphenazine. They may be worth trying if you haven't given them a go but I'm guessing you have atleast tried seroquel.
Click to expand...

Hey! yeah i've forgot to mention those too: I've tried: haloperidol, geodon, levomepromazine, perphenazine, risperdal and zyprexa. But only made me sleep for an entire day, waking up to eat (specialy zyprexa and risperdal), I gained 44 pounds (144lbs to 198 lbs) and have managed to lose 10, but I'm still overweight, and nothing I've tried has helped me in that aspect (diets, excercise and mild stimulants such as tramadol and pristiq TOGETHER). They didn't relieved my anxiety EVER, just knocked me the fuck out for an entire day and made eat like a pig. And they were very dyshporic.

Also, lately, for the past 4 months or so, I've been very depressed, I had never been clinically depressed, but the fact that I'm actually worse than before: got sober and my anxiety disorder simply reappeared, it also depresses me that I am feeling like I've ran out of options here, at some point benzos, Lyrica, and even soma and tramadol did the trick (replaced one with the next whenever the last stopped working) and I was outgoing, creative, functional and had a very active social life. But now I can't leave my house to go to therapy and get panick attacks from just login in to facebook. I feel like a shadow of my former self. I even skipped the current semester at college because I simply can not go outside.
The only things I haven't touched are opiates, amphetamines and coke, but I'm tempted to, altough I realize it will just make things worse on the long run.
 
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Well, tramadol is a bit of an opiate.

Amphetamines might be okay, some find them anxiolytic and certainly would help you lose weight and increase your mood a bit. However, many find it to be anxiogenic, so start low if you start at all. Stay away from coke. the half life is too short to be of any clinical utility in treating mood disorders.
 
i probably should add that 3 weeks really isn't much for an anti-depressant, and 8-12 weeks is about the time it takes to be sure of the substance.
even though i took venlafaxine for about a year and it did fuck all. and i had the same reaction to pregabalin, but i still keep getting it prescribed, as i kind of enjoy taking it every once in a while in higher dosages.
 
Charles Ferdinand said:
Hey! yeah i've forgot to mention those too: I've tried: haloperidol, geodon, levomepromazine, perphenazine, risperdal and zyprexa. But only made me sleep for an entire day, waking up to eat (specialy zyprexa and risperdal), I gained 44 pounds (144lbs to 198 lbs) and have managed to lose 10, but I'm still overweight, and nothing I've tried has helped me in that aspect (diets, excercise and mild stimulants such as tramadol and pristiq TOGETHER). They didn't relieved my anxiety EVER, just knocked me the fuck out for an entire day and made eat like a pig. And they were very dyshporic.

Also, lately, for the past 4 months or so, I've been very depressed, I had never been clinically depressed, but the fact that I'm actually worse than before: got sober and my anxiety disorder simply reappeared, it also depresses me that I am feeling like I've ran out of options here, at some point benzos, Lyrica, and even soma and tramadol did the trick (replaced one with the next whenever the last stopped working) and I was outgoing, creative, functional and had a very active social life. But now I can't leave my house to go to therapy and get panick attacks from just login in to facebook. I feel like a shadow of my former self. I even skipped the current semester at college because I simply can not go outside.
The only things I haven't touched are opiates, amphetamines and coke, but I'm tempted to, altough I realize it will just make things worse on the long run.
Click to expand...

Jesus you really have tried the lot. What MAOI's did you try? Some are better then others at treating anxiety. Also it would be worth mentioning that if you already have depression phenobarbital may not be the drug for you as it is notorious for worsening preexisting depression. I know someone that was on it for epilepsy and it made them really depressed but since it was about the only drug that actually controlled her epilepsy she had little choice but to stay on it. So now she takes a anti-depressant with it in a attempt to stop the mind numbing depression caused by the phenobarbital.

Have you tried ketamine for anxiety? I found that ketamine removes any anxiety that i have even at very low doses. Coke is not something you want to try as it will only make your anxiety worse if anything along with maybe creating a horrible addiction. It's so short acting that it would be useless for this purpose anyway. Amphetamines may be worth trying as they do help some peoples anxiety but amphetamine addiction is not something you want to experience and overuse will no doubt cause far worse anxiety then you already have. As for opiates/opioids well tramadol is a very weak Mu receptor agonist along with being a SNRI so yeah it's basically a very weak opioid. The usual ones that are MU agonist's such as codeine, hydrocodone, oxycodone, morphine, etc all produce tolerance to the good effects fairly quickly and a opiate addiction is not exactly great for someone with anxiety. Nothing like worrying about running out to cause awful anxiety trust me on that :|

Psychedelics such as LSD or psilocybin may help anxiety but it depends alot on the person as these drugs can cause anxiety in some people as well. Granted i would recommend trying something like psilocybin before trying a opiate for anxiety but that is just my own personal opinion there. This is probably a stupid question but have you tried Cannabis or more specifically a strong Indica strain of it for anxiety? I find that strong indica strains have a very pronounced anti-anxiety effect and this does in fact let me get away with taking less of my clonazepam some days.
 
if all these anti-anxiety medications really aren't working, have you considered ADHD/ADD?

i also was diagnosed with an anxiety problem early on and didn't react to any of the benzos really (apart from lyrica, much like yourself) until the benzo's started fucking my brain's natural method to produce gaba, and now they provide anxiety relief due to the anxiety they caused me :(

i also tried several SSRI/SNRI's too - all of which essentially drove me crazy.

i saw (who i believe) to be a more honest, caring and frankly professional psychiatrist (in comparison to my old one) about my issue, having told him all about my previous experience with anxiety etc.

he ran a whole load of checks, which dated back to me from when i was 5-6 years old, calling my schools, talking to relatives (of which i agreed to let him do) - it took about 2 weeks for him to come up with a relevant diagnosis, which was ADHD and for 11 months now i have been under his guidance of medication to help my problems, along with CBT and therapy. granted i had a huge drug problem the day i met him, but he prescribed methylphenidate (which was okay, but the crash was not for me) and then finally dexdedrine, which i can safely say has turned my life around, from being under-achieving, shy, anxious and miserable to all the opposites.

it curbed my anxiety which i suffered from, and gives me a general feeling of wellbeing and keeps me awake during the day. throughout my entire life i had suffered from those problems.

i have no issues sleeping while i take my medication either. i'm prescribed 40mg split daily, 20mg at 8am, 10mg at around lunch (12-1pm) and then (if needed, mostly if i have a lot of work to do) 10mg at around 5pm.
if i take my dose at 5pm, i can still easily fall asleep at around 11pm.

i have not increased this dose in the slightest during my time on this medication - which i hope is a good sign.

perhaps it may help you? it's definitely worth considering. but make sure that your psychiatrist performs a proper ADHD/ADD test rather than a simple tick box one, otherwise it could make matters worse.

i am however a notorious drug abuser on occasions. this is simply me being an asshole/trying to escape from life.

the dexedrine actually helped me kick a very hardcore opiate habit too, even though i mingle around with them from time to time still, my psychiatrist does perform random drug screening. i have tested positive once for benzos, and he has been trying ever since to help me kick the habit of them, but is aware that i had a major problem with them earlier on. when i tested for opiates though, he did cut me off, of course tapering, but i continued to go and see him and he supported me through stopping taking them as well. sorry a bit off topic.
 
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If your doctor is prepared to Rx you Phenobarbital for anxiety, you might as well ask him for Meprobamate instead.
It might be the answer you are looking for.
 
I'm also struggling with anxiety, though it's not so bad (anymore) as in your case.

You wrote it just started and you had a good life in most matters before. In your many therapies, haven't you come to the reason why you're so afraid?
I know this can take some time. If find it very unlikely for a good balance of neurotransmitters in your brain just to switch to a complete imbalance.

I'd love to read more about that. You can also write me a pm, if you want to. Maybe I can be of assistance.

Good luck, mate!
 
About MAOI's I've only tried Moclobemide and my doctor does not want to try the old ones just yet (maybe later).
I also forgot to add memantine, amisulpride and sulpride to the list.

And well, anxiety is so bad that 4 months ago I slashed both my wrists. My family dismissed me as someone trying to just get some attention. But I wasn't.

Thanks for all the replies so far! <3
 
One of the best for anxiety, but barbs in general are NOT good for your liver, or brain. Benzos are better but still cause problems.

Exercise works best for me, the really intense types of cardio, etc. Uphill sprints, weight lifting, etc, get rid of anxiety...until the next day when I need to exercise again.
 
Hey when I was real bad anxious alcohol was such a short answer. Plus mixing the 2 is just dangerous. Please look after yourself.
 
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