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Pcp and acid

Yeah, nobody really does PCP much anymore, at least not intentionally. I cut my previous comment short since without doing real PCP for sure, I can't really say how much they resemble each other. The similarities are there though, I always thought people doing acid and ketamine together would at least appreciate PCP-but the stigma is strong even among drug users.
 
Sure the PCP experience isn't anything like Ketamine, but that doesn't mean that they both don't affect the same receptor sites. Both Ketamine and PCP are NMDA antagonist which is where the dissociative effects come from. I don't feel like it is to far off to try and relate the PCP experience on LSD with Ketamine and LSD, because of the similar sites of action.
 
The experience of PCP for me did not have much dissociative quality at all. Maybe it does for horses but for me I just felt high.

Have you ever done PCP? I would not describe it as a dissociative drug.
 
What does horses have to do with anything? Also I've never heard of anyone who thought PCP doesn't have dissociative qualities.

Whether or not your experience had these qualities still doesn't do anything to the fact that PCP works on the same receptors as ketamine to produce their psychoactive effects. These effects or class of drugs what act on these receptors are known as dissociatives.
 
I mentioned horses because its use in humans was discontinued but has been used in animals. Horses are an example of an animal.

I know its labeled as a dissociative, but the lower doses that most users aim for dont seem to produce the ego-dissolving or boundary dissolving properties that other dissociative produce even at small doses.....Belladona is a true dissociative even in small doses inducing immediate delerium, but with PCP users can dance on the drug or have conversations at a dosage that will still make them high as fuck....The ego-dissolving and anesthesia does happen at higher doses, so its mentioned in all the literature, but at recreational doses it doesnt seem to produce as much of this as other drugs in the same class might....It seems to have different effects up until that point.


Have you ever done PCP?



I guess its a legitimate comparison, but its also very different.
 
Sentience said:
I mentioned horses because its use in humans was discontinued but has been used in animals. Horses are an example of an animal.

I know its labeled as a dissociative, but the lower doses that most users aim for dont seem to produce the ego-dissolving or boundary dissolving properties that other dissociative produce even at small doses.....Belladona is a true dissociative even in small doses inducing immediate delerium, but with PCP users can dance on the drug or have conversations at a dosage that will still make them high as fuck....The ego-dissolving and anesthesia does happen at higher doses, so its mentioned in all the literature, but at recreational doses it doesnt seem to produce as much of this as other drugs in the same class might....It seems to have different effects up until that point.


Have you ever done PCP?

edit: Also, seems most recreational anesthetic dissociatives are uncompetitive channel blockers, not just related because of antagonism of the NMDA receptor



I guess its a legitimate comparison, but its also very different.
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I still don't see how it is relevant that PCP was used on horses. Ketamine is used to this day in veterinary applications as a anesthetic. Just because it has use in other organisms don't change how they interact with your body.

Belledona and related atropine containing plants are considered to be a deliriant (anticholinergic) when taken at doses high enough to produce hallucinations, not a dissociative. PCP and ketamine are classified as anesthetic dissociative due to the inhibition of the NMDA receptor, which is an excitatory receptor (one main ligand being the amino acid glutamate). The inhibition of these receptor have been seen to cause a detachment from reality and your physical being (a classic dissociative effect). Also just think about it, the fact that it is a type of anesthesia should help tell you that these drugs work by inhibiting these excitatory responses, leaving you with a more closed and detached view of reality (focusing on the effects of the mind, though if you want to look at other effects, the pain relief caused by these anesthetic dissociative can not be undone with naloxone, which is interesting and should also tell you something about the effects on inhibiting the transmission of signals from the body to the brain).

I've never personally done PCP. I've done 4-meo-pcp however, but I'm not trying pretend I know what PCP is like, but just trying to get across that there are correlation between synergy and effect with combining dissociative with LSD.

Also you can dance easier on ketamine (even at higher doses) than say DXM, doesn't mean it is any less of a dissociative. I've taken high doses of both and I can say that I don't have to much problem walking on ketamine, but if you watched me on a high dose of DXM, i would be stumbling around like an idiot. Just different effect profiles. All dissociatives are different, but they are related by inhibiting different excitatory receptors (this is why salvia is considered a dissociative - it is an antagonist at the kappa opioid receptor).

Also 4-meo-pcp completely wacked out my ability to dance, let alone walk.
 
I was going more by the subjective effects at targeted recreational doses rather than by what receptors we know it targets and what effects are produced at therapeutic doses.

To me, and I have done PCP, I didnt FEEL any of the classic disassociation that is described by ketamine users for example. I know it can produce those effects though.

I would be willing to bet that PCP has effects on other receptors besides those that were focused on for its medical action for anesthesia. At lower doses perhaps those other factors come more into play and at higher doses you get disassociation.



I dont want to get into a fight about it, but when I was on it I felt no ego dissolution and had very clear boundaries between myself and others....and I have talked to other users who have said about the same thing.


But technically you are right about everything you are saying.
 
What has to happen to qualify as a dissociative for you?

I understand what your saying, but i think you are ignoring some of what makes a dissociative a dissociative. I've done low doses of K, DXM, 4-MeO-PCP, and nitrous and still manage to feel some sort of dissociative effect. You don't need to loss your sense of self to be feeling a dissociative effect. One way I try and describe the low dose effects of a dissociative is just being slightly confused about your surroundings, a general apathetic feeling (still can include euphoria or dysphoria), and a feeling of being a little distant from the world.

Honestly I find medium dose of DXM to be supirior to a medium dose of ketamine in terms of dissociative effect. Ketamine seems to be a little bit more on the psychedelic edge.

Words are just a bitch to use sometimes. Really makes trying to explain qualitative things very hard, and fuck, lets not forget that words have a different meaning for everyone. Crazy stuff.
 
I didnt feel confused at all, nor apathetic nor distant.....Actually, I totally blacked out when I overdosed and lost 8 hours of time so I guess I did experience the disassociation eventually, but while I was coming up and quite high I didnt have any of those symptoms you described.....Which leads me to believe that the recreational target dose lacks many of the qualities experienced at higher doses which is why it makes such a crummy dissociative in medicine for humans and why they stopped using it....Just a theory based on anecdotal evidence and experience.

To me the drug that best personifies disassociation is Salvia. I would almost describe it as an out of personality experience. Definite ego dissolution. Unable to separate self from other, losing sense of self and melding with the cosmos. Deleriant like hallucinations at the deeper levels.

I am not sure what I experienced when I blacked out, as I dont remember any of it....That was probably a dissociative effect, but up until that point I was really high and yet I wasnt confused or disoriented. I was having philosophical conversations and felt like I could go running or sit and meditate. My heart was racing, but I also smoked some weed. I couldnt tell if it was a stimulant or a depressant but had qualities of both.

I think you are correct in a lot of ways but I feel that there are other effects that kick in long before the dis-associative effects kick in for this drug.

(Spellcheck messed up my spelling of dis-associative).
 
General Patton said:
Yeah, nobody really does PCP much anymore, at least not intentionally. I cut my previous comment short since without doing real PCP for sure, I can't really say how much they resemble each other. The similarities are there though, I always thought people doing acid and ketamine together would at least appreciate PCP-but the stigma is strong even among drug users.
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It's a bunch of bullshit. Among my nitrous addicted, dexing friends I am considered absolutely crazy for being willing to get wet given the chance.
 
Aside from fears about getting sold formaldehyde/freaking out and punching a police officer, I think there's a racial component to the stigma as well. It's like reefer madness where because people don't know fully what something is-they associate it with scary black men who will mug or rape them. It's true that some black gangs like the Crips distribute dust, but so do white biker gangs. Occasionally in a more underhanded fashion as well, like the mis-representation of PCP as "mesc" by the Quebec Hells Angels. It's worth noting that these gangs often have white-collar sides to them, which the only kind of crime that is widely tolerated in North America.
 
I dont think PCP is very good for you. You dont know what a headache is until you have come down off of PCP.
 
dude PCP to me is way more psychedelic and dissociative than k, if ketamine is a shot you like push into your skin and inject then PCP is a really big hammer you slam into one of those inch long thick nails into a piece of wood or some shit
 
At the higher doses I totally blacked out and dont remember what happened, so I believe you. However, the effects can vary and at the low dosage I didnt feel like it was dissociative. Perhaps it was when I blacked out.

Angel Dust is also known as PCP. It is known as a Hallucinogen, but has the effects of a stimulant, an anesthetic, or a narcotic pain-killer, depending on the amount taken
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# The effects of Angel Dust may vary greatly, more so than most street drugs.
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http://heloo-dolly.tripod.com/id15.html
 
i can definately see how you blacked out, how did you ingest it when you did it
 
Some fuckers on gave me a bowel of ganja and didnt tell me it was laced until after I had too much of it. I was 13.

You should always tell people what you are giving them.
 
lol id jump at the chance to do pcp and acid together hell id jump at the chance to do pcp. i did 2 hits of acid and 300mg of dxm and that was an awsome trip. and ketamine + mushrooms was fun as fuck too.

dissociatives by themselves feel very cold and mechanical to me. if that makes any sense. but they mix beautifully with traditional psychedelics like acid and mushrooms. i dont know what it is but psychedelics bring some thing to dissociatives and make it a truly cosmic experience.

dissocitives feel incomplete to me with out a psychedelics. but then again ive never really went into a k hole. i did a point of potent k mixed in with a line of preemo blow. and was having a great time. the blow wore off though and the k kicked in hard core i came damn close that day. lol it was a pretty scary experience to be honest i didnt know what the fuck was going on i felt like if i let go of the floor i was gonna fall into space and keep falling for ever so i was immobile for nearly 40 minutes. psychedelics for some reason just make it easier for me to let go
 
Ok so i got to mix some k with some acid recently. It was definitely reminiscient of k and pcp, but came no where near the intensity and emotional aspect of pcp and acid. It didnt last for 2 days either..
 
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