• MDMA &
    Empathogenic
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Ok i just wanted to clear this up, How bad is ecstasy really?

NoneOfThisIsReal said:
In my opinion it is worse than alcohol and weed. The side effects from doing ecstasy every weekend are more severe than drinking or smoking weed in the weekends. Not just memory loss as you said, but also depression, anxiety etc etc.
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i agree to this, every weekend use has given me problems that alcohol and doap never gave me, id have to be smoking or drinking everyday to feel the same drained feeling one night on pills would leave me feeling. all depending on how much drank, smoked, dosed, etc.

also I've done many pills not knowing the contents, so unless your just getting mdma dose in your pills, you don't know what other problems could come about.
 
Meejay said:
You shouldn't drink, smoke, take E, snort rails etc all the time?

Duh!

If we're all done pointing out the brutally obvious differences between people who use drugs and people who have substance abuse issues, I like the following study & article to illustrate the long term effects of E:

CLICKEY ME!!
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That study is a little misleading. Two points to bear in mind:

a) If the average user experiences 'some' issues, then that means the potential is definately there, and

b) If the average user experiences 'minor' depression and impairment, then that means there are probably users on the far end of the scale who experience severe depression and impairment, and there are many users on this forum who will attest to that.



The biggest thing is moderation though. Don't use more than once every 8 weeks or so, and supplement properly, and don't binge, and I imagine you'll be relatively ok. But do not by an means adopt the belief that MDMA is harmless, or that you can use it recklessly and 'it won't happen to me,' because it usually does, and if you abuse MDMA it will fuck you right back, it's a powerful drug and not to be messed around with lightly.
 
b) If the average user experiences 'minor' depression and impairment, then that means there are probably users on the far end of the scale who experience severe depression and impairment
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aren't there people on the opposite side that feel great and satisfied with their experience too?
 
agreeing with everyone just make sure you do it in moderation and not over the top. it is no other experience and a hell of a lot better than drinking all night. But if you really want the ultimate experience. just do lsd :)
 
askaboutme said:
aren't there people on the opposite side that feel great and satisfied with their experience too?
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Of course, but the point is that the potential for serious damage is there, which is why you have to practice moderation and harm reduction so you end up on the right end of that spectrum :)
 
does anyone actually have any science that backs up their claims that ecstasy use in moderation doesn't have long term effects? I hear it claimed that ecstasy in moderation doesn't cause long term side effects, but that is most often followed by a flippant you should be fine. how about a 'here is a study that reveals that ecstasy in moderation doesn't have long term side effects' ? I have yet to see one.
 
fat_bunnies said:
Do you have any science that backs up the claim that long term use of MDMA is has extremely negative long term effects?
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if innocent until proven guilty is a sufficient standard for you in these types of cases, power to you.

fat_bunnies said:
Here's a link to the 2003 German study cited in the documentary that refutes the government propaganda;

http://jnm.snmjournals.org/cgi/content/full/44/3/375
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did you actually read that study? while it certainly disputes the government 'propaganda', it by no means refutes it. the results were inconclusive at best.

I use ecstasy in moderation as well. I do so because I believe that even if there are long-term side effects, they are probably worth embracing based on how much I enjoy using ecstasy. But I think it is important from a harm reduction perspective to recognize that we really don't know all that much about the long term effects of ecstasy. bluelight, and many other user-friendly harm reduction communities seem to have adopted the mantra that moderate ecstasy use does not have long term effects. while this might be true, there really isn't any conclusive evidence pointing one way or another.
 
toa$t said:
does anyone actually have any science that backs up their claims that ecstasy use in moderation doesn't have long term effects? I hear it claimed that ecstasy in moderation doesn't cause long term side effects, but that is most often followed by a flippant you should be fine. how about a 'here is a study that reveals that ecstasy in moderation doesn't have long term side effects' ? I have yet to see one.
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...
 
A couple of years ago a parliamentary commission was set up by the UK government to study the harmfulness of drugs.

Their conclusions included the one that ecstasy was one of the least harmful of all drugs, the least harmful being khat.

Of course when alcohol was found to be way up there along with coke and H the report was binned.
 
every weekend use wasnt even bad imo, i felt normal after doing it constantly for 6 months.

anyone in UK will tell you how massive mdma abuse is here yet everyone seems fine so i dont see the problem
 
here is a VERY VERY detailed study about the effects of MDMA and a discussion with multiple studies whether it permanent damages your neurons.

http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25637

The long and the short of it is -- maybe. If you overdose and overdo with extreme dosages, it MAY be harmful but basically most studies show the "long-term effects" especially down-regulation mainly reverse themselves after a period of time.
 
There are plenty of studies that show MDMA to be extremely neurotoxic, and it doesn't have to be large doses. You want to know why you find yourself scrambling for words or not being able to think clearly after a dose? It's because mdma damages the neuronal networks that connect your brain.

Thats why you see trouble with memory, speech, and cognitive function. People want to defend the drug because its so much fun. Thats fine. Just know that later on down the road it will take its toll.
 
"ecstasy" is dangerous in that you don't know what your getting.. Pill testing kits can help you avoid non MDxx pills and know what you have before taking it.

despite all the media hype even the DEA admits that MDMA may not be neurotoxic @ recreational doses

http://thedea.org/neurotoxicity.html
^great read
 
you realize that the fact that we are exposes to neurotoxins every day doesn't mean that it is ok that we are exposed to neurotoxins every day, right?

and how do you know that those stories are 'government propaganda' if there are no conclusive studies either way? don't you think it is possible that the studies suggesting that we don't really know whether ecstasy has long-term effects but seems to be ok in moderation have a bias?

surely, as an ecstasy user, you are more inclined to accept results that gel with your lifestyle. Accusations of bias certainly cut both ways (Ricaurte notwithstanding, but I assume you aren't basing your 'government propaganda' posts solely on that). I certainly don't pretend to understand the science behind the research on either side of the equation to the extent that I can make an informed decision about which is correct.
 
fat_bunnies said:
ShaolinBomber those studies your referring are the government propaganda I was talking about, studies that are funded by the government have an inherit bias towards finding something negative, if you don't know about the George Ricaurte scandal you should look it up;

http://www.maps.org/media/che022304.html

also I said this earlier but I guess I'll have to say it again, your exposed to neurotoxins every fucking day and the government has no problem with it. Alcohol the most widely abused drug is a neurotoxin! The artificial sweetener aspartame is a neurotoxin! The very air you breathe contains neurotoxins!
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nope, im not referring to ricaurte. Im referring to the numerou studies done at various universities across the country that state that mdma is neurotoxic.

You're a typical e user who is quick to follow what everyone else says about government propaganda. its not propaganda. Educate yourself instead of listening to the hippies.

Go to pubmed.com. Type in MDMA neurotoxic and read to your hearts desire about all of the negative PHYSIOLOGICAL DAMAGE MDMA does to you.
 
You know what, i know you wont go to pubmed.com cause you dont want to hear the truth so ill link some article here for you.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/...nel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16183702?ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DiscoveryPanel.Pubmed_Discovery_RA&linkpos=1&log$=relatedarticles&logdbfrom=pubmed

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12738056?ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DiscoveryPanel.Pubmed_Discovery_RA&linkpos=1&log$=relatedreviews&logdbfrom=pubmed

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16541247?ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DiscoveryPanel.Pubmed_Discovery_RA&linkpos=4&log$=relatedreviews&logdbfrom=pubmed

Theres just a few of the countless articles about this on pubmed.com
 
I think it is like anything.
if you do it too much, it is def bad and can be abused.
in moderation (giving your brain/body time to heal in between) it is on of the most beautiful experiences imaginable
 
it is very dependant on your brand.some extacy is not even extacy just meth+LSD.especially in asia here some are so poorly made and impure that the makers put shards of glass inside the tablet to open a wound in your stomach and make it feel stronger.IV dosent sound so bad now heh lol.
 
prsnmalam said:
it is very dependant on your brand.some extacy is not even extacy just meth+LSD.especially in asia here some are so poorly made and impure that the makers put shards of glass inside the tablet to open a wound in your stomach and make it feel stronger.IV dosent sound so bad now heh lol.
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Dude, NO - on so many levels.
 
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