Not AGAIN... please (tramadol withdrawal)

[Frank Lucas]

I can't believe I've done this to myself again. I've posted on a here a couple of times during the past year+ about my on again/off again relationship with this dirty drug. This is my 4th binge in about 18 months. I've gone through a total of 1080 50mg tablets in this time. This time I went through 360 in just over a month, taking 500-750mg a day, and the withdrawal is much worse than it ever was before.... and it is very physical this time, whereas it was mostly psychological in the past with just an inkling of the physical.

The reason I'm abusing tram is because I'm on an extremely strict form of probation and it's one of the most euphoric drugs I can take that won't cause me to fail a UA. It's not my DOC... I mean maybe it is now, I never really had a DOC before and now that I can't do weed, coke, or booze, this is all I got. I've also been abusing zolpidem and "spice" blends, but I don't really get euphoria from that junk. I also quit cigarettes 6 months ago, because my lungs couldn't take it anymore and I have not really been right since mentally. Always an emotional wreck, no energy, brain fog, and lashing out at people for things they did to me years and years ago... Tramadol just makes all that go away... but after a long binge, I become manic and agitated from it, and I just want out... but I don't know where out is, because while the withdrawal has always eased up.... I miss the energy so bad, and I hate the reality of my life w/o the false sense of security. I am a 28 yr old college drop-out who once had 99th percentile college admissions scores and an "A minus" average all my life when I was in school, who now has a criminal record, no degree, out of school for 6 years, and I make 9.25 USD/hr working at a food store. I used to know how to fix computers like a genius, but that was in the days of MS-DOS, Windows 95, and then 98... I don't know shit anymore about computers. I had a great job for a while, but they fired me when they found out about my criminal charges (possession of 0.25gr coke and 3 tabs of X... PFFFFT).

I was such a promising young man once... I was that guy who was going to be really successful... now I'm 28, I have TWO WONDERFUL CHILDREN that I don't feel like I will ever be able to be decent provider too...

if anyone read all of this... please... anything encouraging...

(also I'm court-ordered to 12-step meetings, been going for 2 years, but I hate them and I will never benefit from them)

thanks

 

[Mr Blonde]

It's going to be hard to deal with the WD if you can't take much to deal with it... what are the major physical symptoms you have?

 

[sid3]

Tram wd is tough regardless that it's not an opie. Your dealing with the SSRI factor as well. Maybe a true SRRI would help out. Your brain chemistry has been changed so your receptors are screaming. Is it possible to get into a clinic that offers sub? That could be cheaper than a Dr's office. I know a few people that are on subs for Trams and it has helped them get away from that shyt. Also the fact that your wages are low, like mine, you are eligiable for the Neddy Meds program. While your trying to get back on track have you looked into any social services. Having two children to care for would lead me to believe there is some assistance out there, use it if you can get it. Just becasue your bottoming out now doesn't ean you can't get your head straight and get back into school or so form of apprenticeship. Just get off the trams and on to something precsribed by a Dr, I would think your PO can't deny you medically assisted treatment. The same comfort meds for opiate wds work for tram wd. If you can't get on subs at least get to a Dr and be staright up with him, the fews minutes of shame/embarassment W.E, is so worth it to get some comfort meds to help you get through the worst of it.

 

[indelibleface]

For starters, tramadol is an opiate. It can have worse withdrawal effects than heroin in many people, so never discount the severity of its withdrawals.

Secondly, this hits home pretty hard--I went through several runs of this drug myself. I never got as high as you dosed, but I used it in the same sort of way you did, as a comfort to edge out the sharp points of life.

You just need to realize this time how abysmal it is for your motivation in the end. Sure it helps for a month, but then the more you take often, the deader you feel in general. It made me completely okay with being middle of the road instead of striving to achieve the best.

If you can, depending on your doctor, he may be able to prescribe clonidine for WDs which should help some. I have also used loperamide successfully in this way. Also, push yourself to be active. It feels like a bad flu, so your body feels like rest is the best option 24-7, and while getting as much rest as possible is always good, pushing yourself to get active is a must for quicker recovery. Exercise feels good, even just a short jog. (Bring music!) And taking lots of hot baths or using a spa is my absolute favorite remedy; it`ll negate at least 75% of the physical symptoms while you`re immersed in hot water.

It`s not over: there is life after tramadol. I made it, and so can you.

 

[Mr Blonde]

While in WD I like to try and keep my mind occupied with other things, reading, writing, that sort of thing, anything to try and get out of that head space...

I think Inedible's tips are good, especially the hot bath one, I remember doing that to relax.

 

[indelibleface]

Yeah, I`d say, if you can, spend as much time in a spa or bath as possible. Most of the pain with tramadol WDs is due to severe muscle tension and restless leg syndrome, all of which temporarily goes away while doing this, in my experience.

The other part, the mental effects, are a bit more tricky. I found tramadol WDs for the first half-week to be very mentally taxing. It was like a depression that sat on my chest and pushed me to the floor. Exercise is your best bet to combat this. A short run of SSRIs (overseen by a doctor) is probably the best option, but I didn`t do this. Being around friends, family, and staying active and taking vitamins were my best elixirs.

 

[indelibleface]

Some people say, for the first few days, that low-dosing with DXM works wonders. I didn`t try this, but taking a sub-recreational dose of, maybe, 45-60mg DXM might provide comfort. DXM raises serotonin levels as well as may provide some relaxation and easing of muscle tension.

5-HTP might be a good supplement to try as it is a precursor to serotonin in your brain. It should help with the mental effects a lot, and it`s available in pharmacies and health stores OTC. Just don`t take it with DXM; it could be dangerous as both raise serotonin levels.

 

[Mr Blonde]

Could it be dangerous to add DXM whilst tramadol is still in the body? They are contraindicated, no?

 

[sid3]

I don't know where you heard that, but the non narcotic Trams aren't an opiate, they are opiate like in their structure/action. That's why the Op was been using the trams as they don't show up on his UAs. I read it as though he's been getting them through the mail, because of the large amounts being taken. I agree the dual wds make it sometimes far worse than a real opiate wd.Clonodine may be the best choice if your PO is really strict. Couldn't hurt to give some immodium a shot too, there's been a few who have claim to have had a lot of relief from overall physical symptoms, not just the runs.

 

[Colmes]

I can't believe I've done this to myself again. I've posted on a here a couple of times during the past year+ about my on again/off again relationship with this dirty drug. This is my 4th binge in about 18 months. I've gone through a total of 1080 50mg tablets in this time. This time I went through 360 in just over a month, taking 500-750mg a day, and the withdrawal is much worse than it ever was before.... and it is very physical this time, whereas it was mostly psychological in the past with just an inkling of the physical.

The reason I'm abusing tram is because I'm on an extremely strict form of probation and it's one of the most euphoric drugs I can take that won't cause me to fail a UA. It's not my DOC... I mean maybe it is now, I never really had a DOC before and now that I can't do weed, coke, or booze, this is all I got. I've also been abusing zolpidem and "spice" blends, but I don't really get euphoria from that junk. I also quit cigarettes 6 months ago, because my lungs couldn't take it anymore and I have not really been right since mentally. Always an emotional wreck, no energy, brain fog, and lashing out at people for things they did to me years and years ago... Tramadol just makes all that go away... but after a long binge, I become manic and agitated from it, and I just want out... but I don't know where out is, because while the withdrawal has always eased up.... I miss the energy so bad, and I hate the reality of my life w/o the false sense of security. I am a 28 yr old college drop-out who once had 99th percentile college admissions scores and an "A minus" average all my life when I was in school, who now has a criminal record, no degree, out of school for 6 years, and I make 9.25 USD/hr working at a food store. I used to know how to fix computers like a genius, but that was in the days of MS-DOS, Windows 95, and then 98... I don't know shit anymore about computers. I had a great job for a while, but they fired me when they found out about my criminal charges (possession of 0.25gr coke and 3 tabs of X... PFFFFT).

I was such a promising young man once... I was that guy who was going to be really successful... now I'm 28, I have TWO WONDERFUL CHILDREN that I don't feel like I will ever be able to be decent provider too...

if anyone read all of this... please... anything encouraging...

(also I'm court-ordered to 12-step meetings, been going for 2 years, but I hate them and I will never benefit from them)

thanks

You're 28, you are young, its the w/d talking there! Think of your 2 kids as well, you have a reason to go back to school when you're ready. You're not 98, and even if you were, and wanted to go to college, more power to you.

Tramadol, despite the fact that its much weaker than morphine as far as potency, has some SSNRI effects as well. Also, the dosage you've been taking is really excessive, did you do any tapering, or cold turkey?

The depression will be probably the cornerstone of the withdraw, many people go to rehab for tramadol addiction, and I imagine that the depression felt could cause some real strong (somatoform disorder like) pains; on top of the actual pain from the withdraw. Somatoform disorder, just incase you had not heard the word, is when depression manifests itself inward, and causes often strong body pains (really in any part of the body, but its not limited to pain, also GI problems). Its a coping mechanism that our brain really didnt do a wonderful job planning.

I'm not saying youre not in real legit pain as well, but I suspect the depression that comes with tramadol w/d, as you are essentially stopping an opioid (or opioid like drug, for anyone who is anal about that), and an antidepressant at the same time. Those two, well, you're smart, thats a bad combo to feel the wrath of.

Goodluck man, id really try to taper if you can without relapsing, if not, look around the site for the best OTC remedies.

 

[Colmes]

Could it be dangerous to add DXM whilst tramadol is still in the body? They are contraindicated, no?

While its still in the body, I dont think that would be a problem at all really. [i am not a medical professional]. I am well aware taking opiates and dxm co-morbidly is very dangerous, but being that tramadol is quite different from any other opiate we'd be speaking of, and its just in his system...unless you take huge amounts...it seems like you're fine.

But...I dont find dxm to be much of a help at all for something like that. Causes hypertension. Hypertension + w/d is fun, but i'd pass.

 

[Frank Lucas]

So today was a hell of a rollercoaster... the symptoms come and go constantly. And a few times I actually thought the worst was already over. I called up a friend and coworker that I can confide in and confessed exactly what was going on. He already knew about the tramadol but didn't know the extent to which I had been abusing it. I almost called out of work, but I have perfect attendance this year so I figured, I would try to tough it out somehow. Plus I really didn't want to talk to store manager at all in this state. I work in a shop-rite sub-shop. It's my job to make about hundred sandwiches of all kinds everyday. yay. Seeing my friend there who was the one person who knew the secret to my productivity and now failure felt good. Then he left and shortly thereafter, the symptoms came back with a vengeance. My back ached from standing, the ham I use to make sandwiches was ice-cold and made my hand hurt even more (oh god, do not want to think about that while I'm typing... owww). I guess there is a somatoform component to it... since the more I think about a body part, the more it hurts... hmmm. The runs were really bad up to that point as well. Hot flashes, sweats, chills, strange burning sensations in the hind quarters... after an hour of that I went home sick, something I never ever do... I've worked through having the flu, and thats my reputation there because I really need a raise and care about my reputation, but f-it this was too much. This was no time to be a martyr. So I went home sick and called my wife. Actually, first I called my friend and told him that I couldn't make it and I went home. He actually got out of bed and walked back to work and finished my shift for me so that the shit wouldn't hit the fan when our boss came in the next day and found that our department was a wreck. Wow... I should call him tonight and thank him, but I feel like such a selfish-ass for putting him in that position, that I don't know if I will call him or not. I'm ashamed at myself. Then I called my wife. I don't live with my wife right now, as we both live with our respective parents... our families don't get along, her parents hate me, and my parents don't like her and we don't make enough money to live on our own anymore these days. My wife picked me up and we took the kids to the park. This was wonderful, but I was so brain-scattered that I went out with just a tank top and shorts on... it was 70 degrees and i was FREEZING. So I wore my wife's tiny jean jacket, I probably looked like I was either homeless or homosexual (both?) in that get-up, but I really didn't care - lol. My wife was very sympathetic and caring and the kids were just being so cool... the boy is 5 and the girl is 2, and it was like they just knew to be extra loving. The physical symptoms still came and went every few minutes, but the depression was completely gone for the whole afternoon! My wife laughed at my "withdrawal talk" as it's only one or two steps away from word salad.

Now it's just me and the computer... it was really nice to check this thread and see all these replies. I mean REALLY nice. Thank you to all.

I'm actually determined to do this cold turkey... although I had some ambien last night, I will not take any tonight... I don't have work tomorrow, so I don't really need the sleep - plus my recent abuse of ambien (around the clock dosing, 30-40mg/day as a quasi-benzo) is probably part of what I'm withdrawing from, so I don't want to take a step backwards. I don't know... we'll see... if I feel as uncomfortable in my bed as I did last night, I might take 10mg, I might not...

Subs would probably be really good, but I get tested for them. If I were on suboxone for the rest of my life it probably wouldn't be such a bad thing, as I have taken them before and they gave me a lot of energy and motivation. I didn't have a doctor though, as I was copping them on the street which defeats some of the purpose. I ended up withdrawing from them but I don't remember that being quite this bad. Gotta take a break from typing, it eases the mind, but hurts the bones...

thanks again to all

 

[Mr Blonde]

While its still in the body, I dont think that would be a problem at all really. [i am not a medical professional]. I am well aware taking opiates and dxm co-morbidly is very dangerous, but being that tramadol is quite different from any other opiate we'd be speaking of, and its just in his system...unless you take huge amounts...it seems like you're fine.

But...I dont find dxm to be much of a help at all for something like that. Causes hypertension. Hypertension + w/d is fun, but i'd pass.

No no, opioids and DXM can be good in low doses because DXM can halt the increase of tolerance. I'm talking 30-40mg doses of DXM here a lot of people in OD swear by it.

Also, my concern was not with CNS depression but rather serotonin syndrome!

I don't know where you heard that, but the non narcotic Trams aren't an opiate, they are opiate like in their structure/action. That's why the Op was been using the trams as they don't show up on his UAs. I read it as though he's been getting them through the mail, because of the large amounts being taken. I agree the dual wds make it sometimes far worse than a real opiate wd.Clonodine may be the best choice if your PO is really strict. Couldn't hurt to give some immodium a shot too, there's been a few who have claim to have had a lot of relief from overall physical symptoms, not just the runs.

The main metabolite of tramadol, M1, is a mu receptor agonist!

Cha-ching!

Frank Lucas: I'm glad your family is so supportive of you. Hold on in there brother, you can do it!

 

[versd]

tramadol is well known to have SSRI properties.

dxm - dextromethorphan is contraindicated with SSRI's because of the potential for serotonin syndrome.

now im sure many people in OD will report that in small doses these substances can be mixed. with that being said, this is a harm reduction site, and so the advice to be given here is to avoid this combination for your own safety.

please see http://www.nhtsa.gov/PEOPLE/injury/research/job185drugs/dextromethorphan.htm for a reputable source. there are plenty of other sources out there, i think you'll find it hard to find somewhere which does not list SSRI's as a contraindicated substance for dxm.

go see a doctor to see if there are any antidepressants which may be able to help you here. an offlabel use of tramadol is for its SSRI properties, perhaps you can find a non-abuseable medication to help you find the same relief.

have you tried tapering your use of tramadol?

 

[hyroller]

If it helps any, I feel exactly the same way about my 'potential' and how little I have done with it during my time in this life

I can't relate to the tramadol WDs, but I hope you find inspiration from your kids to get clean & become the best parent that you can....

 

[theseeker]

Hey Frank- I used to abuse tram all the damn time. I did like 500 mg a day for two years straight. The w/d does indeed suck but you'll be out of the woods fairly soon. Tram withdrawal hits hard but it doesn't really last for some reason even though it has that opiate component to it. That feeling of coldness is one big symptom.

But there's hope- that shit doesn't last. In a week or so you'll actually be ok. It's not like oxy where you feel shitty for like a month. Keep your head up bro. It's a shitty day here in jersey so that can't be helping your mood but just know this shit won't last.

 

[Bojangles69]

I'm wding in Jersey too but I LOVE this shitty weather.

 

[Subdivisions]

I am not a doctor, (and forgive me if this was repeated above)...but I have some decent experience with Trams. One thing I learned, is that they are fairly easy to taper down off of (in my experience). You have to remember that stopping them cold turkey is not only going to send you into withdrawals, it is also not recommended because of the chance of seizure...though how many people this really happens to I can't really say.

If you have enough to set yourself up a taper program...perhaps consider that? I, at one point, was taking about 7 a day, and cut down to 5, then 4, then 3, etc...your mileage may vary...food for thought.

 

[User Name Here]

I think tramadol was one of the most addictive drugs I ever took to be honest. My mom has been prescribed to it since I was probably ten, around the time it first came out. She was diagnosed with RLS which was considered mostly B.S. back then but her neurologist (who later became mine) was trying it out because he believed in it. Anyway, my legs started bothering me one night and she broke a 50mg pill in half and gave it to me, and it was awesome. I was probably around 11. I forgot all about it until I took ultracet for the first time in, oh, 9th grade and it was the most amazing thing I had felt before. I eventually made the connection and found out the two were alike, and I started stealing my mom's. Eventually I made up RLS symptoms, went to that dr., and after trying neurontin and quinine, he put me on tramadol. I would go through one bottle in a week.

One thing led to another and by age 16 I was able to down 20 in a course of about ten or so hours. I had a bad head injury later on that year and it induced epilepsy, so I became prone to seizures. I started having more seizures because of the amount of tramadol I took, but no one realized it was more of the tramadol than anything, they just thought it was the epilepsy. This still didn't stop me. I just learned to take the right kind of anti-seizure meds to combat the seizures and continued taking up to 20 tramadols in a night, sometimes up to 30 throughout a whole day. Around this time is when I started abusing oxycontin so tramadol became my kind of "back-up" drug when I couldn't find that. I learned how to doctor shop and eventually had up to three prescriptions for either 60 or 120 50mg pills, so I would have up to, oh, 300 pills of it in one month plus what I stole from my mom and bought off a friend who was prescribed to it as well (she sold hers to buy oxycontin which was her d.o.c.).

Anyway, long story short, I battled with it for YEARS. It was way too easy to get from any doctor because none of the docs I've seen consider it a heavy duty drug (I'm assuming). I eventually got back up to taking at least 20 a day and started having mad seizures, lost my license, couldn't work, etc. and there was only one option for me: I HAD to quit. So I fucked myself over and told my doctor everything, and he sort of red lighted my name if that makes sense. Even if I want to get it again, any pharmacy that fills it will more than likely catch me. I dunno if there's a flag on my name or what, but I tried it once and I got a phone call from the pharmacy saying they would not fill it for me and that if I tried it again they would call the police (!!!). This was enough incentive for me to stop. Also, at the same time I was caught taking them from my mom whose husband threatened to call the police on me if I didn't bring them back to their house immediately (which I did).

The only way I was able to quit taking them was to fuck myself over. It was incredibly hard to tell my doctor what was going on but he actually said he respected me for being honest, even if it meant giving myself a bad name or whatever. Even when I want to get it--and I still do--I can't. If I had never told my doctor(s) and gotten caught by my parents, I would still be doctor shopping for it today (it's also fucking cheap, even without insurance which I have but when using multiple scripts couldn't utilize for everything).

Basically I'm going to suggest the same thing but it's so hard for an addict to actually do it. I used one of those days where I was fed the fuck up and made myself march into the doctor's office and that was that. It was one of the hardest things I've ever done though.

I sincerely hope you are able to kick this habit one day. It also has one of the worst withdrawals I've ever known, and the only way I was able to curb it was to taper down. In fact, I was able to taper down from 20 a day to nothing by taking two or four in a 24 hour period for about a week straight. I avoided all withdrawal symptoms by doing this, but it was really hard not saying "fuck it" and taking them all at once instead of spacing them out. I'm not really sure how I did it except for realizing I had NO other choice.

Good luck and if you ever want to talk about it more, you can message me. I am very familiar with this drug...

 

[versd]

^ thanks for taking the time to tell us your story