Opioids Nortilidine, dosage and ROA

[jack_flash]

Hello people,

I'm thinking of ordering Nortilidine soon. I was wondering about two things:
- The dosages, apparently it's 1:1 with morphine, so I need to start at around 20mg and go my way up?
- The ROA, can I snort it, or should I take it orally only like the real Tilidine?

Thanks for your answers!

 

[Josephine_Morphine]

I have the same questions. Did you ever try it? What ROA worked best?

 

[jack_flash]

Hey, no didn't try it yet, I'm waiting for more info before I order some

 

[nasir~]

Hey, no didn't try it yet, I'm waiting for more info before I order some

I am very interested in this one myself.
Tilidine, with its DRI-effects, is a quite nice opioid.

Even though it's not very potent, I _used to_(*1) enjoy taking 750mg to 1600mg.

Even with a 40mg-50mg Methadone tolerance I could get a nice and pretty unique opioid high going!

[Edit: I forgot to write/mention that I was referring to my Methadone dose at that time]

(*1) "I _used to_ enjoy"; Back when there was still Tilidine _without_ naloxone in it available.
Now, since at least 15 years Tilidine is ONLY available as a preparation with naloxone; AFAIK that seems to be the case in Germany and basically 'the rest of the world'...

 

[4DQSAR]

Nortilidine?

It's an odd one. Years ago it turned up briefly as an RC (as reported on in Land der Träume). In animal models it was reckoned to be around the same potency as morphine.

But here's the thing, a key precursor is extremely expensive and I know of no synthesis that doesn't actually make tilidine which is then selectively N-demethylated. I'm pretty sure the few manufacturers actually make that precursor themselves and I GUESS might sell it to an institution but it's not an obvious target.

Now maybe someone has legally obtained tilidine (if it's intended to be used as a precursor, it isn't legally considered as a drug) although it would still need to undergo that selective N-demethylation. The patent route uses bromine but I imagine better routes are known. But as I say, for M potency, not obvious.

For comparison, tramadol is SO cheap that someone could begin by resolving the two enantiomers (only one is an opiate receptor ligand) and O-demethylate that. Those two steps would increase potency by x8 i.e. morphine-range. For the insane the tertiary hydroxyl can be substituted for an -F but DAST is very dangerous and even the newer agents require careful handling.

So while I 100% would love to taste nortilidine, I think I would want to see the instrumental data as in the previous paragraph I've explained how something around the same potency could be made for far, far less.

It's known to be a DRI and indeed it overlays the stimulant cypenamine perfectly. The German reports had students saying they would consume tilidine before an exam as it's stimulant activity increases vigilance.

So do be careful and please provide a trip report.

OT A British research team produced the reversed ester analog of both tilidine and nortilidine. I was even able to contact the guy whose name is on the patent. He told me that it had been trialled but duration was considered too short. Now, I'm not going to presume the same is automatically true for nortilidine, but if duration is only 2-3 hours, that might suggest it is what it says it is.

Stay safe - no RC is worth your life.

 

[jack_flash]

Even though it's not very potent, I _used to_(*1) enjoy taking 750mg to 1600mg.

Careful if you try Nortilidine, doses are the same as morphine so 750mg I'm not sure you'll end up alive...

So do be careful and please provide a trip report.

Yeah I won't try before having more info on dosage and ROA, the few stuff I could find are people saying the effects were the same as Tilidine, but didn't say what dose they used.

Stay safe - no RC is worth your life.

I couldn't agree more

 

[4DQSAR]

@jack_flash - if that N-demethylation relies on a liver enzyme, tilidine might be akin to codeine i.e. taking more won't increase the subjective effects, just the duration. Tilidine itself purely being a prodrug (for opiate effects at least).

I forgot to mention that it goes on to be metabolized to dinortilidine and there seemed to be some debate if that's also active as an opioid. Sadly I went through all the on-line academic papers until it ended up stating that it was active BUT the reference was to an old and out-of-print German medical reference book (and yes, I did check to see if it had been scanned). Most modern studies don't seem to mention it but I would expect it still to have stimulant properties.

Put simply, if people want the stimulant effect, maybe higher doses DO work.

 

[Josephine_Morphine]

(only one is an opiate receptor ligand)

I thought I heard this once, thanks for the confirmation. I had some tramadol a while back, came from, Asia. It had almost zero opioid activity , I suspected it had all of the wrong tramadol enantiomer , and not a 50/50 combination like I think it's supposed to have. This was a great mystery to me. I finally found some tramadol after years and years not being able to find it, but it's a particular brand and it's not as "good" as proper tramadol, it was basically bunk. It had to be all (-)-

 

[4DQSAR]

I thought I heard this once, thanks for the confirmation. I had some tramadol a while back, came from, Asia. It had almost zero opioid activity , I suspected it had all of the wrong tramadol enantiomer , and not a 50/50 combination like I think it's supposed to have. This was a great mystery to me. I finally found some tramadol after years and years not being able to find it, but it's a particular brand and it's not as "good" as proper tramadol, it was basically bunk. It had to be all (-)-

Well there are four stereoisomers but the product sold as tramadol is just two of them (the trans pair if memory serves). Someone tried to scam us with what they claimed was the N-ethyl homologue of ketamines. But the NMR data clearly showed that the -Cl was at the para rather than ortho position. They argued the toss for a while then I sent them the NMR along with the calculated peaks (ChemOffice) showing them to be identical.

So rather than admit fault, they just offered it at a much lower price. We said no - because NOBODY knows if it's safe. But I wouldn't be at all surprised if someone bought it.

I do appreciate that if you are only buying bits, instrumentation is too costly. But now it's such a dubious market, no longer are there websites where people discuss sources. In effect legal control has made it more dangerous for end users.