Niketamid

[PR22]

I live in Poland. I went out to buy caffeine pills, but instead came home with a box of <snip> which has the active ingredient Niketamid.

The two links I posted are the Google translated version of Polish websites. I can't find a non-Polish reference to Niketamid, so maybe we only have it here? I'm always experimenting with nootropics and stimulant combinations to make my productivity a little higher. I'd like some more information on this drug such as dosages or even an experience report. Right now all I have to go on is from the Glucardiamid website which says "Oral: Suck 4 to 6 tablets per day."

 

[Corazon]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikethamide

 

[recyclethepandas]

i've never seen it in the united states. it's amazing to me that a GABA-A antagonist would be over-the-counter anywhere. this would probably induce serious anxiety if you're susceptible to that. i don't know much about this drug, but theoretically anything antagonizing GABA receptors would cause indirect stimulation from increases in glutamate's activity. glutamate excitates neurons, so it is implicated in learning, memory, and conscious thought. it plays a role in just about everything the brain does. i don't doubt that this drug would be stimulating, or that it might improve your performance, thinking ability, etc. but overactivity of glutamate causes excitotoxicity. it is the same mechanism by which alcohol withdrawal kills brain cells. it is the same mechanism by which stress kills brain cells. same mechanism by which head trauma kills brain cells. releasing large amounts of glutamate causes symptoms from anxiety to tachycardia to psychosis to brain damage. for that reason, i recommend being very careful with any drug that antagonizes GABA. GABA is an inhibitory and neuroprotective compound... it prevents glutamate from excitating neurons, and thus prevents the brain from seizing. it follows that damage to the brain's production or modulation of GABA (enzymatically, through the diet, etc) causes heightened susceptibility to seizure. if i were you, i wouldn't take these pills at all. yes, it is stimulating, but other stimulants work via much safer mechanisms. i think taking more than the recommended dose could certainly cause you to have a seizure, and perhaps even kill you. most other forms of stimulant are not very dangerous in overdose. this would increase the likelihood of a seizure AND a cardiovascular event. bad combo. plus without GABA agonism to protect your neurons from over-excitation, you are risking mild brain damage even at a small dose. although it may not be enough to cause noticeable changes to your cognition, i wouldn't doubt for a second that chronic use of this drug could cause noticeable brain damage. again this is just speculation because i haven't seen any published journals on this chemical.

source: im a biochemistry and molecular biology major

 

[Corazon]

i've never seen it in the united states. it's amazing to me that a GABA-A antagonist would be over-the-counter anywhere. this would probably induce serious anxiety if you're susceptible to that. i don't know much about this drug, but theoretically anything antagonizing GABA receptors would cause indirect stimulation from increases in glutamate's activity. glutamate excitates neurons, so it is implicated in learning, memory, and conscious thought. it plays a role in just about everything the brain does. i don't doubt that this drug would be stimulating, or that it might improve your performance, thinking ability, etc. but overactivity of glutamate causes excitotoxicity. it is the same mechanism by which alcohol withdrawal kills brain cells. it is the same mechanism by which stress kills brain cells. same mechanism by which head trauma kills brain cells. releasing large amounts of glutamate causes symptoms from anxiety to tachycardia to psychosis to brain damage. for that reason, i recommend being very careful with any drug that antagonizes GABA. GABA is an inhibitory and neuroprotective compound... it prevents glutamate from excitating neurons, and thus prevents the brain from seizing. it follows that damage to the brain's production or modulation of GABA (enzymatically, through the diet, etc) causes heightened susceptibility to seizure. if i were you, i wouldn't take these pills at all. yes, it is stimulating, but other stimulants work via much safer mechanisms. i think taking more than the recommended dose could certainly cause you to have a seizure, and perhaps even kill you. most other forms of stimulant are not very dangerous in overdose. this would increase the likelihood of a seizure AND a cardiovascular event. bad combo. plus without GABA agonism to protect your neurons from over-excitation, you are risking mild brain damage even at a small dose. although it may not be enough to cause noticeable changes to your cognition, i wouldn't doubt for a second that chronic use of this drug could cause noticeable brain damage. again this is just speculation because i haven't seen any published journals on this chemical.

source: im a biochemistry and molecular biology major

sounds bad for the brain.

Is Gaba-a antagonism responsible for the respiratory effects as well ?

 

[recyclethepandas]

well gaba exerts an inhibitory effect on nearly every neuron in the brain, so its natural to assume that it would have some activity in the brain stem in the form of inhibiting hyperventilation, right? but i think GABA is more of a respiratory antispasmodic than it is a respiratory depressant. even with glutamate and GABA in perfect balance, a norepinephrine agonist or reuptake inhibitor will still induce heightened breath rate. and interestingly, opiates reduce GABA modulation and release, suggesting that if GABA were a respiratory depressant, opiates would actually cause heightened breath rate. but instead clinically we observe that opiates obviously exert a depressant effect on the respiratory system. so my guess (and this is only speculation) is that GABA would prevent hyper-excitation of the brain stem which might result in hyperventilation, but this would only be in the event of some kind of localized seizure in the brain stem which i've never heard of. glutamate is used to control every breath you inhale and exhale, and the rate at which you breathe is automatically dictated by your brainstem based on sensory signals conveying your blood CO2 levels. so i don't think GABA antagonism would directly produce an effect on the breath. if this were true, then benzodiazepines, which increase GABA modulation, would depress ventilation, which they don't seem to do. this drug would simply increase the seizure threshold, and possibly the incidence of a cardiovascular event. but of course, if this drug affects the heart rate, it will indirectly affect the breath rate. but i don't think it would have much effect on the cardiovascular system unless you took so much that the glutamate caused a seizure, or you took a large dose (not an overdose) and then ran a marathon or got extremely startled, which might induce a seizure. really the biggest concerns here are a) seizure and b) excitotoxicity of the frontal lobe, which can't handle extreme sudden doses of glutamate the way other parts of the nervous system handle on a daily basis.

 

[drdoctor]

My, that looks as unusual as it would be unpleasant (I'd imagine). Probably best to avoid if you have anything else or unless you are ODing on sedatives.

 

[recyclethepandas]

but yeah i definitely don't think this is good for the brain. the GABAergic and glutamatergic systems are by far the most prominent neurotransmitter systems in the brain. they are a finely tuned balance. the reason benzodiazepines can cause agitation, psychosis, and seizure during withdrawal is because they acclimate the brain to their presence. as the brain grows accustomed to the extra GABA modulation induced by benzodiazepines, it kicks in extra glutamate modulation. this is the mechanism by which benzodiazepine tolerance forms. when you cut off the mechanism that induces the extra GABA modulation (the benzos), the balance is completely thrown off because the brain takes a long time to downregulate the additional glutamate activity. so you end up with a rebound effect caused by extreme glutamate levels relative to the GABA present, which inhibits glutamate's excitation. and what we see in this withdrawal syndrome (which is basically the same thing that would happen if you took a lot of this niketamid stuff) is not necessarily hyperventilation, but extreme excitation of the frontal lobe, inducing the symptoms of anxiety and hypersensitivity. a simple analogy would be kicking your brain into electric overload. there is a high risk for seizure if glutamate reaches a certain level, so one must be careful not to undergo anything mentally rigorous or exciting. which, to me, defeats the purpose of taking a stimulant in the first place. if the stimulant is going to make it dangerous to "think too hard," then you're gonna be sitting around doing nothing and feeling really stimulated. sounds like hell to me... your brain is already equipped with the necessary chemicals to help you focus, you just gotta push yourself to focus to get the process started. this isn't even considering the psychological implications of stimulant use... i mean, its really not good to depend on anything outside of yourself for any reason, but especially if you need the drug to focus. i would just toss em out if i were you, but i'm no niketamid expert lol