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NEWS: Nurofen + etc to be made Prescription only!!!

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^ Haha sourced some baking soda so I will give it a crack tonight! I used 15mg of diazepam with my dose on friday and 2mg xanax last night.

Was trying to skate by tonight on only 5mg of valium, 2 restavits and 60mg DXM 45 before my dose plus 15mg DXM 15 minutes after my dose. I also consume 1 or 2 (usually 2) standrard measures of alcohol in the half hour prior to dosing as I have heard alcohol induces CYP 2D6 and I find it adds to the high regardless. If anyone has any advice of more stuff I could add to make this work that would be great, I don't have grapefruit juice so that option is out.
 
Yup u unfortunately lack the enzymes to convert codeine into morphine. U could always try a CWE and see if a higher dose works for u. U either lack the enzymes, had a big meal before u just dosed (u need to wait atleast 3h before having it) or u mite have a high natural tolerance for opiates.
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I wouldn't say that just yet, 8 Nurofens is a low dose in my opinion. I fucking love codeine now, but when I first used it I felt nothing off 120mg, had to try 240 to get the good feeling.

GurnEr joshE: Try using a higher dose and see if that works, I wouldn't put it down to enzymes just yet.
 
^ I am always baffled when I read reports of people getting "euphoria" off of 60-120mg. I wish I could munch a few fortes and be nodding but I remember years ago when I did my first extraction, I used around 100mg of starting material and figured I would have 75-80mh in my end result. Felt slightly warm and relaxed and thats it. Tried closer to 200mg a week later and it wasn't much better so I wrote it off for a couple years.

The small amount of people I have turned on to CWE have all felt mild effects off 250-300mg off the bat but all of them required closer to 500mg to get reasonably strong effects. I honestly wonder if some people experience placebo from such low codeine doses, if it really isn't a placebo these people are probably very lucky they didn't come across OC 80s before N+.
 
I used to nod out on 6 nurofens. Then began experimenting with 6 nuros + 15-20mg oxy. My tolerance is so high now 700mg codeine + 60mg oxy doesnt do much. Altho this 600mg codeine + 1.5 bar benzo is not too bad:| But yea Mr Blonde is correct, try a larger dose n see if it works.
 
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Yeah tolerance is a bitch :| 600mg gets me a nice buzz, but that's about it, I need to take a tolerance break but always end up buying more after a few days. It's stabilized a bit since I stopped with the oxy though, which is nice.
 
OK so my codeine has most definately worked :D I am by no means wasted but quite happy with the effects, given my little 3 day run I can actually see how it would be possible to get addicted to it so long as one wasn't using stronger opiates too often.

I always used to say marijuana and methamphetamine were my drugs of choice, but these days it definayely is opiates. The stronger the better but I am not overly fussy.

I was thinking about trying tagamet and grapefruit juice to potemtiate but there are mixed reports on whether these actually potentiate or just extend the high. Does anyone have experience with this?

Also I know some people use loperamide with it, I have generally avoided this because I already get constipated the day after using opiates. Lately I haven't been affected as strongly in that way and am now wondering if it is worthwhile to potentiate codeine?
 
^ Tagamet will inhibit CYP2D6, as will grapefruit juice unfortunately.

I have never heard of loperamide being used to potentiate it, loperamide doesn't cross the BBB after all. Maybe try promethazine or something instead?

Wait... actually I guess if you drink the grapefruit juice timed right after you have dosed it won't inhibit conversion into morphine.
 
"Codeine, unlike hydrocodone, has little to no intrinsic activity. It is a prodrug. This means, for codeine to work, it must first pass through an enzyme that chops off a methyl group, converting the codeine to morphine. This happens primarily in the liver or small intestine.

This enzyme is known as Cytochrome P450 2D6, or "2D6" for short. AKA the codeine to morphine convertor in your body.
Studies have shown that in population subgroups with a genetically inactive version of 2D6 have little to no response to codeine.

Codeine is also metabolized by another enzyme, called "3A4", which metabolizes it to norcodeine, an undesirable product of little or no activity.

So there are at least two major pathways by which codeine is metabolized.

If one blocks the 3A4 enzyme without blocking the 2D6 enzyme, theoretically, more morphine is produced in your body.

Grapefruit juice, being a specific inhibitor of 3A4, functions by blocking 3A4 and allowing more codeine to be converted to morphine via 2D6. Grapefruit juice is desirable because the active compound is specific to 3A4, with no effect on 2D6."

I took that from another forum so according to that it would work, but I can't say it does as I have never tried it. I was also reading about tagamet. I just want to find even more stuff to add to the codeine experience.

Last night went pretty well, second washes seem to work and I definately think the baking soda made a difference too. SO tempted to go get more today but I am going to be smart and keep my tolerance down, plus I really can't afford another thing I have to have daily.

Also, I haven't noticed any acid reflux symptoms today so maybe it wasn't the ibuprofen extractions, I am going to keep an eye on it but for now I will probably continue to use ibu as it is cheaper.
 
Also I was wondering something last night, does anyone think its possible that regular codeine intake would cause ones liver to adapt making it more efficien at processing codeine? Upon doing extensive reading about peoples experiences with codeine it seems that it varies alot whether codeine is useful to harder opiate addicts for withdrawal symptoms. From my observation it appears a common factor in whether they find it useful or not is if they used it recreationally earlier in their opioid career.

I figure it isn't too illogical to think if your liver is being made to turn codeine into morphine a few times a week it might get more efficient at it. This could be why some long term users don't seem to notice the ceiling effect, or why long term addicts can continue to feed their habit with the exact same dose for extended periods.

Anyway its just a theory, but if anyone knows if theres any truth to this or if its just a crack pot theory that would be cool.
 
Dont have time to give a long reply as i got to head off to work but to ur questions DM but i know that grapefruit doesnt potentiate it, i actually heard/read the opposite.
 
drug_mentor said:
"Codeine, unlike hydrocodone, has little to no intrinsic activity. It is a prodrug. This means, for codeine to work, it must first pass through an enzyme that chops off a methyl group, converting the codeine to morphine. This happens primarily in the liver or small intestine.

This enzyme is known as Cytochrome P450 2D6, or "2D6" for short. AKA the codeine to morphine convertor in your body.
Studies have shown that in population subgroups with a genetically inactive version of 2D6 have little to no response to codeine.

Codeine is also metabolized by another enzyme, called "3A4", which metabolizes it to norcodeine, an undesirable product of little or no activity.

So there are at least two major pathways by which codeine is metabolized.

If one blocks the 3A4 enzyme without blocking the 2D6 enzyme, theoretically, more morphine is produced in your body.

Grapefruit juice, being a specific inhibitor of 3A4, functions by blocking 3A4 and allowing more codeine to be converted to morphine via 2D6. Grapefruit juice is desirable because the active compound is specific to 3A4, with no effect on 2D6."

I took that from another forum so according to that it would work, but I can't say it does as I have never tried it. I was also reading about tagamet. I just want to find even more stuff to add to the codeine experience.

Last night went pretty well, second washes seem to work and I definately think the baking soda made a difference too. SO tempted to go get more today but I am going to be smart and keep my tolerance down, plus I really can't afford another thing I have to have daily.

Also, I haven't noticed any acid reflux symptoms today so maybe it wasn't the ibuprofen extractions, I am going to keep an eye on it but for now I will probably continue to use ibu as it is cheaper.
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Well, it looks like I was wrong, grapefruit juice doesn't inhibit CYP2D6 after all. :)

However, the effects of grapefruit juice on codeine to morphine conversion would be minimal I still believe as there is still a limit as to how much codeine can be converted to morphine by CYP2D6. Codeine isn't just converted into norcodeine, it also converted into codeine-6-glucorinide and an amount of it passes through unmetabolized.

I make the assumption that I'm an extensive metabolizer of codeine because I can push my doses so high; however I've used grapefruit juice a few times and not noticed any effect on my experience. :\

Also I was wondering something last night, does anyone think its possible that regular codeine intake would cause ones liver to adapt making it more efficien at processing codeine? Upon doing extensive reading about peoples experiences with codeine it seems that it varies alot whether codeine is useful to harder opiate addicts for withdrawal symptoms. From my observation it appears a common factor in whether they find it useful or not is if they used it recreationally earlier in their opioid career.

I figure it isn't too illogical to think if your liver is being made to turn codeine into morphine a few times a week it might get more efficient at it. This could be why some long term users don't seem to notice the ceiling effect, or why long term addicts can continue to feed their habit with the exact same dose for extended periods.

Anyway its just a theory, but if anyone knows if theres any truth to this or if its just a crack pot theory that would be cool.
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I asked this same question a couple of years ago when my addiction was starting to push my doses well above the ceiling dose. I believe I was already an extensive metabolizer as even at normal doses I got a hell of a lot out of codeine; it would be interesting to know exactly how much morphine I get out of it. People I know who are affected by the ceiling effect don't seem to be able to adapt from what I've seen, but it would be interesting to see some more experiences from people.
 
The human body is certainly capable of more amazing things than "learning" to turn more codeine into morphine with regular use, I am not stating its a fact but as I have very limited scientific knowledge it seems plausible to me.

The last 3 extractions I have performed a second wash on my gunk after my initial shirt filter and then filtered both solutions through a coffee filter. I feel as though this second wash has increased the effects, probably 20-30%, although I did also dose a spoonfull of baking soda 20 minutes before dosing last night which may have helped.

It seems to me this would mean CWE is less efficient than some of us may have assumed, I would be very interested for a lab analysis of a CWE to see exactly how much codeine, and other crap, it contained. It could be that codeine is more potent than some of us think, and because CWE is inefficient we are not actually hitting ceiling doses until performing extractions on doses well above the ceiling limit.

That would certainly explain why the opioid conversion chart posted earlier in this thread by Mad Mick had 240mg of codeine equivalent to 40mg of morphine or 20-30mg of oxycodone.

That info I found on grapefruit juice is pretty interesting and I am going to have to try it one day soon, I am an avid user of diazepam and it is useful for that aswell so I should have some fun with it. It is interesting that you did not notice GFJ affected your experience at all Mr Blonde, although it is a tad inconclusive exactly what effect it should have on codeine it is clear there should be some. Perhaps it does inhibit 3A4 and leave more codeine available to be turned into morphine but as someone who already metabolises more into morphine than usual it has no effect on you.

I have been contemplating purchasing some tagamet, which is supposed to potentiate codeine much the same way as GFJ does. However in light of the fact GFJ induces 3A4 instead of 2D6 I am left wondering if tagamet would be ineffective because of inhibiting 2D6 or if it works the same as GFJ. If anyone could shed some light on that it would be great. I have a big report due tommorrow but once I am done I may do some digging myself.

I fucking love codeine, even with the price increase it is still well worth it. I was starting to think it wasn't working well for me but it seems performing a second wash has really brought back a good high for me. I had sme heroin the other night and I enjoyed it alot. For the money though codeine is king, sure I take the heroin on its own bar a little weed and codeine needs a bit of this and that to spice it up, its still a damn nice opiate buzz and it works out very cheap in comparison.
 
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^ Tagamet (cimetidine) I can definitely say is listed in my CYP450 chart as a CYP2D6 inhibitor. :)

Maybe I will try a second wash next time too and report on effects, though I am going to try and take a little break since this shit is so expensive now.

Though drug_mentor, if you dose the tagamet just right when the codeine is already converted/well on it's way into being converted into morphine it may have the effect you want.
 
^ I am not too keen on dosing CYP2D6 inhibitors even after codeine. I read alot of reports of people using diphenhydramine to potentiate opiates and one time the chemist was out of restavit and sold me 'snuzaid'which contains 50mg diphenhydramine. I read this inhibited CYP2D6 so I waited half an hour after drinking my codeine to take one tablet. I was just starting to feel it come on and 15 minutes after the diphen my high was DEAD, the only noticeable effect of the codeine was itchiness which diphen is meant to stop!

Although I have found promethazine dosed 30-40 minutes after codeine does well to extend the high and keep the itches at bay, I don't really use it anymore because I like restavit which can be taken beforehand. Occassionally I do use both though.

I am interested whether a second wash works well for you, as I have a friend who tried it who uses codeine regularly and it worked well for them. To clarify my technique, I dump the ball of white gunk back in the glass I originally dissolved the pills in, pour slightly less water than I used to dissolve the pills over it, wait 5 minutes or so and then stir until it is fully dissolved then refilter this through a shirt then coffee filters as normal. I figure just running an extra lot of water through the shirt would just run over the stuff and not really penetrate it to get the goodies out. All this time posting in this thread is making me crave opiates bad now haha.
 
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^ Yeah I was craving opioids as well but I just received some morphine and plugged 120mg and now I am good. :D

I remember diphenhydramine not working well with codeine for me either, not sure why but it was weird... it didn't take away my high completely though but I felt detached from it. :\

I don't think it has to do with it being a CYP2D6 inhibitor though.

Oh yeah and doxylamine succinate is a good potentiator, once I got as part of my dose a 24 pack of pain tablets with doxylamine in it, I use it and got REAL good. :D

I will try the rewash the next time I get codeine and report back with results. :)
 
^ I have never tried CWE on mersyndol, I just pop 2 restavits or 50mg of doxylamine succinate. I have a friend who favours 'Travalcam' which contain dimenhydrinate, atropine and something else, when they come and use with me I usually have one of them and one restavit. I have been using antihistamines with codeine for atleast a year and never really upped my dose because I don't want a nasty antihistamine trip. Do you think it would work well for me to take 3 or 4? One time I had a couple travalcams and was jibbering absolute nonsense, don't particularly want to repeat that experience.
 
^ 3 or 4 dimenhydrinate? That's 150mg-200mg... for me that might be a little too much, I imagine very sedating maybe too much so. On it's own I don't think it would cause delirium, but combined with an opioid maybe especially since you have had a weird experience with travacalm, though that is dimenhydrinate plus hyoscine and caffeine.

It might be worth giving a go, it might even give you a nod. :D
 
^ I meant 3 or 4 restavits, I usually take 2. I wont exceed 2 travalcam after last time. I was just asking because I assumed 24 mersyndol was more than 50mg doxy and you said it worked well, I am not looking for an antihistamine buzz.

Do you use DXM with your codeine? I have found 30-90mg very effective at increasing the effects. I usually dose 30-60mg 45 minutes to an hour before my codeine and sometimes another 30mg 15 minutes or so after I drink my codeine elixir.
 
^ Oh yeah you will be fine brother, I like that combination actually. :)

I don't think I used the whole 24 pack, maybe 12 of them and it made me very sedated and combined well the codeine, your mileage may vary but I think it's good. :D

Haven't tried DXM with opioids yet but I am very much considering doing it as I have heard good things, do you think it has helped with your tolerance as well?
 
I couldn't comment on tolerance, I have strange usage patterns where sometimes its once a week, sometimes its 3 times a week and sometimes i go a few weeks without, not to mention all the different drugs I combine with it on different occassions. I think you are meant to take small doses daily to reduce your tolerance but I am not sure.

I have used DXM nearly every time for AGES and definately feel it adds to the high. Whether this is through tolerance reduction, direct potentiation or just drug synergy I am not sure. One thing I do know is you will seldom go through my drug stash and not find a bottle of Robitussin DX sitting next to all my other goodies, and I don't drink the shit by itself. ;)

I highly encourage you give it a try because assuming you dose 60mg with your codeine thats 10 doses in a bottle, if it works as well for you as it does for me its a very cost effective potentiator.
 
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