Need to quickly detox from Heroin due to travel - to use Suboxone or not?

[enzo831]

hey guys,
long time reader, fist time poster. i have what i consider a fairly unique and difficult detox situation that i need help with. i've read through every related thread on the board however am finding it difficult to find answer about how one or two doses of subxone can affect withdrawal ie will it help or will it just delay the inevitable.

I have been using heroin recreationally for about 2 years now, however over the last 6 months i have started using it daily and generally use about $150 worth a day (i snort it if that makes any difference).

i work full time, and have had a couple of attempts at detoxing using clonidine, valium and tramadol. I find that the worst of the physical symptoms are over within 48 hours, but sometime between 30 - 80 hours the mental cravings become too much and almost against my will I end up scoring.

my difficult situation is this - on tuesday morning i have to travel with work to a place where i will be staying for two months. I will have no access to opiates, be engaging in high pressure work and be sharing a room with a workmate. I'm working until friday, however thankfully have Monday off - so i plan to detox over the weekend, however am very fearful that the junkie/inner zombie in me will take over and i will end up scoring at some stage (as i always do). i have access to 8mg of suboxone that i'm thinking of using to help make things easier and help me fight the urge to score, but also im afraid that there is a chance using it could just delay or elongate the physical withdrawal symptoms. here are my possible plans:


No Suboxone:
Have my last dose at 9am friday, attempt the ride the whole thing out.
Pros: No chance of Suboxone stretching out things.
Cons: High likelihood of the aforementioned zombie- like relapse, thus leading to me being in full withdrawal on a plane, in the company of others or at work.

One Suboxone dose:
I'll have only one 2mg-4mg does of Suboxone, 24 hours after my last dose of heroin. Thus leaving me with 72 hours to ride out the physical symptoms
Pros:
Less chance of scoring due me being more comfortable and the knowledge smack wont work.
Cons:
Suboxone's longer half life possibly leading the longer primary physical and mental withdrawal symptoms.


Two Suboxone doses:
I'll have only one 2mg-4mg does of Suboxone, 24 hours after my last dose of heroin. Then have a second on Sunday morning. Only leaving me with 48 hours to ride out the physical symptoms.
Pros:
Less chance of scoring due to me being more comfortable and the knowledge smack wont work.
Cons:
Suboxone's longer half life possibly leading the longer primary physical and mental withdrawal symptoms, that will continue at full force into the week (I'm not really afraid of secondary symptoms, as i can put those down to having a mild cold and just deal with them).

I could also save the crumbs and have small 1mg - .25gm doses daily, but I'm afraid of two things with this - 1. The naltraxone will work harder than the bupe and i could end up getting very very sick when i dose and have nothing to cover it up or 2. When run out I'll end up having serious withdrawals and be in the thick of it while at work.

Also, please spare me the options of calling in sick or coming up with some other excuse - if that happens i will almost certainly loose my job and I would prefer to go down fighting my addiction instead of raising the white flag and loosing the only thing I have left.

Thanks in advance for your advice, the knowledge and the experiences of the members on this board have helped me so much in my drug taking over years.

 

[neversickanymore]

Hello enzo, welcome to BL proper.. how are you getting to the new work location?

 

[enzo831]

I'll be flying. It's an international flight to a country that doesn't treat drug possession nicely, so i dont want to take anything with me, except maybe some suboxone crumbs.

 

[twotoomany]

I recently kicked a smallish oxy habit with 4 mg of sub over the course of a week. Day 5 after subs was the worst, but not terrible. A little stomach pain and diarrhea. My taper looked like this: 1-1-.5-.5-.5-.25-.25. It worked well for me (and my girl) and was relatively painless. This was coming off 30-45mg oxy a day with a few 8mg hydromorphone snorted from time to time over two years of steady use. It wasn't great, but it didn't totally suck. If you decide to use subs, wait until you're REALLY sick to dose, and start small. Don't take more than you need to "hold" you. I probably could have started at .5mg instead of 1 and been fine. Good luck!

 

[cj]

Your basically screwed unless you can bring suboxone. You dont have long enough for a sub taper to work if im underdtanding you right. Your leaving a week from today? If thats the case your only chance to not be sick on the plane or trip is to stop taking any opiates right now!! You dont mention how big your habit is. But you can pretty much count on 5 days of hellish sickness. Even after that is over sleep will be affected another week or so. Your best bet imo is to stop now or go get a legit suboxone script to bring on the trip.

 

[THCisgod]

Your basically screwed unless you can bring suboxone. You dont have long enough for a sub taper to work if im underdtanding you right. Your leaving a week from today? If thats the case your only chance to not be sick on the plane or trip is to stop taking any opiates right now!! You dont mention how big your habit is. But you can pretty much count on 5 days of hellish sickness. Even after that is over sleep will be affected another week or so. Your best bet imo is to stop now or go get a legit suboxone script to bring on the trip.

I don't think he can stop now due to work, but if I were you id just stop all weekend that's your best bet at least you'll feel a little better on the trip but I imagine being on the plane isn't going to be fun I had the same dilemma once it was shittyy I was only on like 60mg of roxis a day probably but I just stopped the next day I felt really uncomfortable on the plane didn't get a wink of sleep the whole time due to restless legs and sweating but 3 days will help a lot

 

[enzo831]

twotoomany - how were the other 4 days after? and how was your mood, were you able to function?

crimsonjunk - i use about $150AU worth a day which is either .2 of "pure" or .5 of "regular" (snorting it, for 6 months, and about once or twice a week before that)

i now have another 8mg of sub, so it's possible for me to attempt full (short) taper... although im wondering how sudden the withdrawals come on with this type of taper, do they ramp up or will i end up in the thick of it without warning?

also is the length time from your last does of sub to being functional longer compared to your last dose of smack (going cold truckey)?

final question that will inform my decision - is it possible that after being inducted, a dose of sub could cause PW symptoms?

 

[twotoomany]

You won't get PW after induction. I felt FINE while on the subs. The only day I felt pretty rough was day 5 off subs. Even still, I made it to work. I have a challenging job working with emotionally disturbed and violent kids. By day 7 off sub, I was fine. There were a couple nights that sleeping was tough, but I was still able to sleep a but. Hope this helps. Feel free to pm me.

 

[theseeker]

enzo- can you get a legitimate prescription for subs? While it's true I wouldn't want to travel to any country (like Singapore) that has tough drug laws with any illicit controlled substances, I doubt they are going to scrutinize medication that has been legitimately prescribed for you. No one has EVER looked at my pills while traveling..never (even in Changi airport, Singapore). There's no time, there's too many people. Do you think your meds are going to be scrutinized *that* closely by the authorities? How are they to know a pill for hypertension from a sub?

I mean, I'm sure you know better about this situation. What exactly are the laws for a legitimate sub prescription in your destination country? I just can't imagine someone going through each and every medication that people have these days....

If you had your own sub prescription, maybe you could start to get a handle on the heroin problem: at $150 a day, you've really crossed the line IMHO. That's over $1000/ week. I don't care what you make- that's way too much $$ spent on drugs. Sorry if I sound preachy- but at this rate you stand to spend >$50,000 on heroin this year. I'm sure you know all this, but sometimes seeing a number right there can put a problem in perspective.

 

[frankiec]

Similiar Experience

I'm currently going through a similar experience, I had 1 sub to detox with.... I was doing 300 - 450 mg oxy a day, stealing from family the whole 9 yards, but 11 days ago I took my last roxy, waited about 15 hours to take the sub, my biggest problem was never being able to wait the "suggested" 24 hours after last oxy to take the sub, I would always end up scoring before I felt to bad. This time I planned my day expecting precipitated withdrawals if I took the sub too soon, I would rather suffer through an hour or so of hell and just be done with the demon....felt like I deserved it anyways. So I crushed up a quarter of it (I have always found snorting it to almost double its potency, i.e. a quarter up the nose did as much for me as a half under the tongue,which may be more psychological, because its always been my prefered way of taking things, but I do believe I read the bioavailibility is higher nasaly than sublingually...anyways sorry) But after tossing and turning in bed for a few hours I was fine, able to get up and play with my 3 year old son I have full custody of. The next 3 mornings I did a quarter, and almost all the horrible symptoms of withdrawel were gone. I was able to work everyday... I walk around outdoors for 9 hours a day, other than minor fatigue I was able to function pretty well with just the 1 suboxene so it can definetely make it so your able to function at your new location... you can complain of jet lag or say your feeling under the weather for the few days after the sub is gone, but you should most definetely be able to take on your responsibilities. As I was saying its now day 10 and the only symptom I have is insomnia.... Which i'll take in comparisson to past withdrawels, cold turkey, and all those horrible experiences I'm hoping keep me away for good! This is my first post sorry if I broke any rules just very tired and spending all my time on these forums!! I wish you the best!!!

 

[enzo831]

theseeker - i have no qualms with bringing the subs i have with me, as far as getting prescription, i have no time, here it takes a lot of red tape, piss tests, proper induction, signing up to a licensed doctor and pharmacist and normally a period where you have to go to the pharmacy and they watch you dose. and yes, i do plan on quitting completely, not just surviving this trip - i've booked a naltrexone injection for the day after i get back.

frankiec - congratulations! have you found that in the last 10 days your withdrawal has peaked at all, any time period where stuff was particularly bad?
also i know you've probably looked in to it already, but have you considered at getting a naltrexone/vivitrol injection/implant to help you avoid temptation?

 

[neversickanymore]

Hey enz.. jump now.. and you will be fine.. I was going to suggest that you fly early, flush the subs, but it seems complicated... we can find drugs anywhere.. once spent the money to backpack europe instead of a rehab.. found the H in ammonia square in athens, less than an hour after landing, wasn't even looking for it, just found me.. a regional can help but it wont "cure".. have to change you.. flush thE subs and jump.. you can do this.. have to figure out how to be happy though.. if I can figure this out ANYONE CAN..

 

[cj]

Hey enz.. jump now.. and you will be fine.. I was going to suggest that you fly early, flush the subs, but it seems complicated... we can find drugs anywhere.. once spent the money to backpack europe instead of a rehab.. found the H in ammonia square in athens, less than an hour after landing, wasn't even looking for it, just found me.. a regional can help but it wont "cure".. have to change you.. flush thE subs and jump.. you can do this.. have to figure out how to be happy though.. if I can figure this out ANYONE CAN..

That seems like irresponsible advice. I think you should take the sub with you and use it to get you through the travelling and settling in period. Then you can make a rational educated decision om the next step. Dont make an emotional decision

 

[neversickanymore]

IMO by waiting the proper time to dose the subs they will be partially into withdrawal.. and really what are two doses of subs going to do besides, facilitate a period of moderate withdrawal followed by an increased time they will spend in acutes pushing the real heavy acute withdrawal into the time where they will be required to work.. best to use the travel time to detox (blame it on motion sickness or some sketchy airport food).. and not end up a major mess the first part of a new project.. but I guess we will see how it works out, because I almost guarantee that an addict in withdrawal, that already admittedly struggles without scoring (who doesn't) will undoubtedly take the subs, if they had them would. OP please keep us informed as to how it turns out and I wish you the best