Natural tongue (Ginsberg quote - wish for expansion)

[Setarcos]

From Ginsberg interview (Spotaneous mind appears to be an extremely interesting book should anyone be interested):

"recovery of natural tongue, of speech forms that are real rather than literary forms" ->
I've done psychedelics but only one time I did acid gives me any light on this... it's meaning remains incredibly blurry to me and I'm hoping someone here might have some idea what is meant by this or what it could mean

To quote full passage (for those interested & for context):
"Interviewer:Yes it is and I think Huxley already spokie of expanding conciousness in the Doors of Perception
AG: in America, it was necessary top go through a long period of change of conciousness before people could be liberated from the hypnotic hallucination that theyd been locked in. It would have been premature to speak in popilitcal terms in those times. In fact we were definitely thinking in non political terms, apolitical terms. TGhe first necessity was to get bafck to Person, from public to person. Before determining a new public, you havd to find out who you are, who is your person. Whnich meant finding oujt different modalities of conciousness, different modalities of sexuality, different approaches to basic identity, examination of the nature of conciousness itself finally - on a very serious level, meaning not only psychoanalysis and drugs but also meditation and ascetic experience, isolation and solitary experience and shabda yoga(A version of yoga using sound as a means for transforming conciousness) and jazz and sexual exploration. And recovery of natural tongue, of speech forms that are real rather than literary forms, and recovery of body mvovement and song and dance, in those days catalyzed primarily by rhythm and blue, the precursos of rock n rolll. Like Neal and Jack driving around listening to black rhythm and blues."

Looking forward to seeing if anyone can point me in a good direction... Appreciate only true understanding can come from own senses - hope it was of some interest

 

[Dagny]

Honey, let me tell you about the year 2001.

I am a huge Ginsberg fan; the entire era of the Beat Poets really but this guy in particular thanks to "Howl."

As a whole I would compare the passage to 2 things:

• A new renaissance. Society always seems to reach a point where it needs one, and after struggling embraces the concept of beauty again. The 1960's was a renaissance, of sorts, as people were moved to create (and moved by the creation of) music, art, and passion. Human beings craved knowledge. And for the spiritual/metaphysical aspect many drugs were taken - new cultures require different rules so communication must fill different roles.
• "The Matrix." (Not trying to be cheesy or ridiculous, but it's an easy metaphor and works here.) A sort of social 'unplugging' from the machine. When enough people realize that control lies in someone else's hands and that no one is happy with the decision-making, they will make noise until given a say. Like any adolescent with new-found freedom, each person who insists on independence has to do some soul-searching + figure out what they want/who they are. What happens to each affects them all, and once free from the Matrix they no longer spoke the machine's language.

As for the specific passage you quote about a 'natural tongue': There are many folks from this board who remember 2001 like I do. We also took drugs and tried new ways to connect so that our view of existence went beyond what was written or seen every day. Countless people on countless occasions experienced/described moments of transcending speech. Not just with LSD but Ketamine, GHB, MDMA, etc., the combinations of these. There were discussions of a societal matrix and our release from its control. Time and again someone would say, "I don't even have to say things to be understood, you just know," or the equivalent. It felt like a more pure language for me. Natural and entirely un-composed.

Ginsberg and his Beatnik friends may have had similar moments. It comes down to feeling a connection with your fellow man, simplifying what we know so more can be learned. We all want to be understood but often lose the words to describe how we feel. That language is a limiting form of expression should be no surprise; humans require other sensory stimulation + input. He calls this speech 'real' - thoughts can be illusion but all of your senses tingling means something is there, it's real if others are reacting.

Sorry about being long-winded, Ginsberg always makes me start thinking.